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HomeMy WebLinkAboutCORRESPONDENCE - NON-AGENDAFlores, Dora From: U Calma <Ij.calma@yahoo.com> Sent: Monday, August 31, 2020 10:08 AM To: eComment Subject: A request/comment for the Sept 1 Council Meeting We have witnessed several American cities where the mayor orders their own city police force to stand down and watch as these protesters, who mostly come from outside of the city, burn houses and business establishments. This has left local tax -paying residents wondering if they can rely on the police to protect them and put the kibosh on this ruckus. With all the protests, riot, and violence we see in the media (i.e. Kenosha and Portland) where innocent citizens are harassed, injured, and killed by these so-called "peaceful protesters", can the City Manager Kristine, Mayor Pulido, and Chief Valentin promise us in public and in record that the SAPD will uphold their duty to serve and protect us, Santa Ana residents and business owners, first and foremost? Regards, Louie Calma A homeowner in Santa Ana Ward 6 Flores, Dora From: Omar Hernandez <h2omar@yahoo.com> Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2020 12:30 PM To: eComment Subject: Questions for meeting Water bill Why is it that the Basic Service charge went up from $19.00 to $102? We understand raises, but this is a 500% raise? I've read on various blogs that the reason is someone else is preparing the paperwork. If this is the case, what prevents the city from going back to a cheaper company to prepare the paperwork? Thankyou UNIVERSITY OF CALIFORNIA, IRVINE BERKELEY • DAVIS • IRVINE • LOS ANGELES • RIVERSIDE •SAN DIEGO • SAN FRANCISCO August 31, 2020 SANTA BARBARA • SANTA CRUZ Department of Population Health & Disease Prevention 653 E. Peltason Drive Irvine, CA 92697 Re: Environmental Justice and Community Engagement in Santa Ana's General Plan Update To Whom it May Concern, Thank you for the opportunity to comment on the City of Santa Ana's Draft General Plan and the General Plan Program Environmental Impact Report. I am a current Doctoral Student in the Program in Public Health at the University of California, Irvine. I have a Masters in Public Health and Masters in Social Work and research health inequities within Latinx populations. I am writing today to request that the City of Santa Ana delay the process for moving forward with the General Plan to allow time for community outreach and input. There are a few reasons that I think this is very important: 1. Environmental conditions such as exposure to pollution in the air, water, and soil contribute immensely to producing and maintaining health disparities. These conditions disproportionately impact communities of color, such as those residing in Santa Ana. 2. Many times, risk assessment and policy recommendations are done without the consideration or input of community members. Community members are experts of their own lives and their lived conditions, not allowing outreach and input of the community is a disservice to that community and can further perpetuate health disparities. In summary, providing adequate time for outreach and input of the community before moving forward with the General Plan will elicit an accurate snapshot of the strengths, challenges, and needs for the communities in Santa Ana. Without this expert information, environmental justice in this community is not possible. Thank you. Sincerely, Victoria E. Rodriguez, MSW, MPH cc: Adolfo Sierra, President, Madison Park Neighborhood Association Jose Rea, Treasurer, Madison Park Neighborhood Association Leonel Flores, GREEN Community Organizer, Madison Park Neighborhood Association Miguel Pulido, Mayor, City of Santa Ana Phil Bacerra, Councihnember, City of Santa Ana Nelida Mendoza, Councihnember, City of Santa Ana David Penaloza, Councihnember, City of Santa Ana Vicente Sarmiento, Councihnember, City of Santa Ana Jose Solorio, Councihnember, City of Santa Ana Juan Villegas, Mayor Pro Tem/Councihnember, City of Santa Ana Kristine Ridge, City Manager, City of Santa Ana Verny Carvajal, Principal Planner, City of Santa Ana Sonia Carvalho, City Attorney, City of Santa Ana Nabil Saba, Public Works Agency Executive Director, City of Santa Ana Minh Thai, Planning & Building Agency Executive Director, City of Santa Ana R. Leonard, Certified Shortl 818,99. SHFFT 1 mnrW 1 1 SUPERIOR COURT OF THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA 2 FOR THE COUNTY OF LOS ANGELES, NORTRWEST DISTRICT 3 4 MAN DALESANORO, AN INDIVI➢UAL; ) AND PARALLEL PEAL ESTATE ) 5 .1 SOBS, LLC, A CALIFORNIA ) LIMITED LIABILITY COMPANY, ) 6 PLAINTIFFS, ) GSE NO. TO CASE VS. ) (RELATED TO CASE 8 ) .14698631 VIC-, A S CALIFORNIADEVELOPMCO COMPANY, ) 9 INC., A LIFORNIA CORPORATION, ) VINEYARDS DEVNS, INC., A ) 10 CORPORATIONS, INC., A CALIFORNIA ) CORPORA, LLC BINATRA6 CALIFORNIACOO) 11 LINT CT, LLB, A CALINIA ) LIMITED LIABILITY COMPANY, VDC ) 12 AT THE NET, A CALIFORNIANORDI) CORPORATION; RYAN AN ) 13 INDIVIDUAL, AND DOES ES 1-50, 1-50, ) 34 DEFENDANTS. ) TO. IPACE 1-186 15 16 1] 18 DEPOSITION OF RYAN ANDREW OGULNICK 19 MONDAY, AUGUST 13, 2012 20 21 22 R. LEONARD, C.S.A., INC. 23 CERTIFIED SHORTHAND REPORTER REPORTED NT: 4142 MEADOW RIDGE PLACE 24 M. LEONAPD ENCINO, GLIFORNIA 91436 CER NO. 3334 (818) 995-2449 25 FILE NO.: 37194 26 1 2 3 4 s 6 U 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 1] 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 U.1F I j ➢EPOSITION OT EYAN ANDREN OGOLNICR, TAKEN ON BEHALF OF PLAINTIFFS, AT 1875 CENTURY PARK MST, 23RD FLOOR, LOS ANGELES, CALIFORNIA 90067, AT 10:42 A.M., MONDAY, AUGUST 13, 2012, BEFORE ACHIN LEONARD, CM NO. 3334, A CERTIFIED SHORTHAND REPORTER WITHIN ANO FOR THE COUNTY OF LOS ANGELES ANN STATE OF CALIFORNIA, PURSUANT TO NOTICE. APPEARANCES OF COUNSEL FOR PLAINTIFFS: BIRO MAR£LLA BOXER WOLPERT NESSIM OROONS 6 LINCENBERG APC BY: SOHN N. RNBINER, ESQ. ISIS CENTURY PASS EAST 23RD FLOOR IRS ANGELES, CALIFORNIA 9GO67 j C.S.R., Inc. and Reporters 5,2449 PAGE 3 1 APPEARANCES CONTINUED 2 3 FOR DEFENDANTS: 4 5 ...1 HENRY EISEO, ESQ. 6 9255 SUNSET BOULEVARD 7 SUITE 920 8 LOS ANGELES, CALIFORNIA 90069 9 10 11 12 ALSO PRESENT: MAN DALES.. 13 ARI SCHOTTENSTEIN 14 MIUM LEVINE 15 CONSTANCE FAIL (VIDEOGRAPHER) 16 1] 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 3 PAGE 4 I N D E X 2 WITNESS EXAMINATION PAGE 3 RYAN ANDREN OGULNICR BY MR. RUEINER '1 4 5 6 B 9 10 11 12 E X H I B I T S 13 14 MAMM PAGE 15 16 4 ORGANIZATIONAL CHART 15 1] 18 5 PARALLEL REAL ESTATE ADVISORS LLC 1D4 19 CONSULTING ANO M ISORY AGREEMENT 20 21 6 PARALLEL REAL ESTATE ADVISORS LLC 122 22 CONSULTING AND ADVISORY AGREEMENT 23 24 ] PARALLEL REAL ESTATE ADVISORS LLC 125 25 CONSULTING ANO ADVISORY AGREEMENT 4 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 2 .�..,., � x�mEx roNTxNGED z 3 8 OEPENOANT'S SDPPLP.! WN RESPONSES 178 4 TO DOCUMENT REQUESTS SET NO. ONE. 5 6 (UNANSWERED QUESTIONS) 7 PAGE/LINE 8 9/1 9 18/1 10 2014 11 z]n 12 104/7 13 206/17 14 111/1 15 141/16 16 175/23 1] 1S 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 5-1 PAGE 7 09:45:13 1 MR. BISNO: ROBERT BISNO, B-I-S-N-O, COUNSEL FOR 2 MR, OGULNICK. 09:45:13 3 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: WILL THE COURT REPORTER PLEASE 4 SWEAR IN THE WITNESS. 09:45:13 5 09:45:13 6 RYAN ANDREW OGULNICK, 09:45:13 7 A DEFENDANT HEREIN, HAVING BEEN DULY AFFIRMED, 09:45:13 8 WAS EXAMINED AND TESTIFIED AS FOLLOWS: 09:45:13 9 09:45:13 10 EXAMINATION 09:45:13 11 09:45:13 12 BY MR. RUBINER: 09:45:13 13 Q YOU ALL SET? OKAY, 09:45:13 14 GOOD MORNING, MR. OGULNICX. 09:45:13 15 ALTHOUGH I STATED MY NAME ON SHE RECORD AND WE 16 MET BRIEFLY OUTSIDE AND IN A PRIOR PROCEEDING, JUST FOR 17 THE RECORD MY NAME IS JOHN RUBINER AND I REPRESENT SEAN 18 DALESANDRO AND PARALLEL REAL ESTATE ADVISORS AID THIS 19 PROCEEDING IS CALLED A DEPOSITION. 09:45:13 20 HAVE YOU EVER HAD YOUR DEPOSITION TAKEN BEFORE? 09:45:13 21 A YES. 09:45:13 22 Q HOW MANY TIMES? 09:45:13 23 A THREE OR FOUR. 09:15:13 24 Q WHEN WAS THE MOST RECENT TIME YOU HAD YOUR 25 DEPOSITION TAKEN BEFORE TODAY? PAGE 6 PAGE 8 09:15:13 1 LOS ANGELES, CALIFORNIA; MONDAY, AUGUST 13, 2012 09:45:13 1 A THREE YEARS AGO. 09:45:13 2 10:42 A.M. 00:45:13 2 Q AND WAS THAT IN CONNECTION -- STRIKE THAT, 09:15:13 3 -000- 09:45:13 3 WERE YOU A PARTY TO THE CASE IN WHICH THAT 09:45:13 4 4 DEPOSITION WAS TAKEN? 09:45:13 5 09:45:13 5 A I DON'T RECALL. 09:15:13 6 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: WE'RE ON THE VIDEOTAPED 09:45:13 6 Q WAS THE C014PANY YOU WERE AFFILIATED 'WITH A ? RECORD BEGINNING AT DISK NO, 1 AT 10:12 A.M. 7 PARTY TO THAT CASE? 09:45:13 8 MY NAME IS CONSTANCE BAIL, THE VIDEO OPERATOR. 09:45:13 8 A I THINK SO. 9 THE NAME OF MY EMPLOYER IS R. LEONARD, CSR, LOCATED IN 09:45:13 9 Q DO YOU RECALL WHO TOOK YOUR DEPOSITION? IC LOS ANGELES, CALIFORNIA. 09:45:13 10 A I DO NOT. 09:45:13 11 TODAY'S DATE IS AUGUST 13TH, 2012, 09:45:13 11 Q DO YOU RECALL THE GENERAL SUBJECT NATTER THE G9:45:13 12 THIS DEPOSITION IS BEING TAKEN AT THE LAW 12 DISPUTE WAS ABOUT? 13 OFFICES OF BIRO MARELLA, ET AL., IN LOS ANGELES, 05:45:13 13 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. HE'S NOW STATED THREE TIMES 09:15:13 14 CALIFORNIA. 14 HE DOESN'T RECALL. 09:45:13 15 THE CASE CAPTION IS SEAN DALESANDRO, ET AL., 09:45:13 15 THE WITNESS: I DON'T RECALL. 16 VS. VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION, ET AL., CASE NO. 09:45:13 16 Q BY MR. RUBINER: AND THEN PRIOR TO THE 17 BC 469811. 17 DEPOSITION ABOUT THREE OR FOUR YEARS AGO, OR ABOUT THREE 09:45:13 18 THIS DEPOSITION IS BEING TAKEN ON BEHALF OF THE 1S YEARS AGO, WHEN WAS THE NEXT MOST RECENT TIME YOU 19 PLAINTIFF. 19 PROVIDED DEPOSITION TESTIMONY? 09:45:13 20 COULD COUNSEL PLEASE, i'OULD YOU PLEASE NOW 09:45:13 20 A SIX OR SEVEN YEARS AGO, 21 STATE YOUR APPEARANCES FOR THE RECORD, 09:45:13 21 Q DO YOU RECALL WHO THE PARTIES TO THAT CASE 09:15:13 22 MR. RUBINER: JOHN RUBINER, COUNSEL FOR THE - 22 WERE? 23 PLAINTIFF, AND ALSO THERE'S -TECHNICALLY TWO CASES THAT 09:45:13 23 MR. BISND: RELEVANCE. OBJECTION. 24 THIS IS PART OF THAT ARE CONSOLIDATED SO COUNSEL FOR THE 09:45:13 24 THE WITNESS: ANSWER? 25 DEFENDANTS IN THE OTHER CASE. 09:45:13 25 MR. BISNO: YOU CAN ANSWER. 61 a Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulmck, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 3 PAGE 9 PAGE 11 09:15:13 1 THE WITNESS: I DO. 1 QUASI -PUBLIC PROCEEDING AND I DON'T REPRESENT THEM, 09:15:13 2 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHO WERE THE PARTIES TO THAT 09:45:13 2 IN ANY EVENT, WE CAN - 3 CASE? D9:45:13 3 MR, BISNO: PARDON ME. THIS IS YOUR PREMISES. IF 09:45:13 4 A IT WAS LEWIS KAPLAN, DEFENDANT, AND I WAS THE 4 YOU WISH TO EXCLUDE THEM YOU CAN. THEY HAVE NO BY RIGHT 5 PLAINTIFF SEEKING TO RECOVER FUNDS I HAD LOANED TO HIS 5 TO BE ON YOUR PROPERTY. AGAIN, IF THEY DISRUPT THE 6 COMPANY. 6 TESTIMONY OF MY CLIENT AGAIN I WILL HAVE MY CLIENT WALK 09:45:13 7 Q AND WHEN WAS THE FIRST DEPOSITION THAT YOU 7 OUT, 8 WERE, THAT YOU TESTIFIED AT? 09:45:13 8 MR. RUBINER: ARE YOU FINISHED? 09:45:13 9 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE, NOT REASONABLY 09:45:13 9 MR. BISNO: YES. 10 LIKELY TO LEAD TO RELEVANT EVIDENCE. WE'RE NOW GOING 09:45:13 10 Q BY MR. RUBINER: HAVE YOU EVER TESTIFIED AT A 11 BEYOND SIX YEARS AS MR. OGULNICE HAS ALREADY TESTIFIED 11 TRIAL? 12 IT WAS MORE THAN SIX YEARS AGO AND I WILL INSTRUCT HIM 09:45:13 12 A YES. 13 NOT TO ANSWER. 09:45:13 13 Q WHEN DID YOU TESTIFY AT A TRIAL? 09:45:13 14 Q BY MR, RUBINER: ARE YOU GOING TO FOLLOW YOUR 09:45:13 14 A 2009. MAYBE 2008. 15 COUNSEL'S INSTRUCTION? 09:45:13 15 Q WHERE WAS THE TRIAL? 09:45:13 16 A YES. 09:45:13 16 A IN THE CENTRAL COURTHOUSE, LOS ANGELES. 09:15:13 11 MR. RUBINER: CAN WE STIPULATE, COUNSEL, IF YOU 09:45:13 17 Q DO YOU RECALL THE CASE? 1B INSTRUCT HIM NOT TO ANSWER THAT HE'LL NOT BE ANSWERING 09:45:13 18 MR, BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 2008 19 BASED ON YOUR INSTRUCTION? 19 PROCEEDING. THAT'S BEFORE MY CLIENT EVER MET YOUR 09:15:13 20 MR. BISNO: I HOPE 50 BUT I DON'T KNOW THAT WE CAN 20 CLIENT. PLEASE GIVE ME AN OFFER OF PROOF AS TO THIS 21 STIPULATE TO THAT. 21 LINE OF QUESTIONING AND ITS RELEVANCE OR LIKELY TO LEAD 09:45:13 22 MR. RUBINER: SO THAT'S A NO? 22 TO RELEVANT EVIDENCE. 09:45:13 23 MR. BISNO: THAT IS A NO, 09:45:13 23 MR. RUBINER: HIS BACKGROUND TESTIFYING AND WHAT HE 09:45:13 24 EXCUSE ME, WE ARE BEING DIVERTED BY COMMENTS 24 MAY HAVE SAID UNDER OATH ABOUT HIS VARIOUS BUSINESSES 25 OR SMIRKS COMING FROM NONPARTIES AND I WOULD DIRECT YOU 25 MAY OR 14AY NOT BE RELEVANT TO WHAT HE, REPRESENTATIONS 9 11 PAGE 10 PAGE 12 1 TO HAVE THEM LEAVE THE ROOM OR MY CLIENT WILL LEAVE THE 1 HE MADE TO MY CLIENT ABOUT HIS PAST BUSINESS EXPERIENCE, 2 ROOM AND IF THEY GIVE ANY MORE SMIRKS MY CLIENT WILL 2 AND IF THIS IS AT A PUBLIC PROCEEDING, A TRIAL, THERE'S 3 LEAVE THE ROOM AND REQUEST SANCTIONS FROM YOU BECAUSE 3 NOTHING, CERTAINLY NOTHING CONFIDENTIAL ABOUT IT AND, 4 THEY ARE UNNERVING OR ATTE14PTING TO UNNERVE MY CLIENT. 4 THEREFORE, IT'S REASONABLY CALCULATED TO LEAD TO THE 09:45:13 S MR. RUBINER: WELL, I DON'T REPRESENT THEM AS 5 DISCOVERY OF ADMISSIBLE EVIDENCE. 6 WE -- AS 1 EXPLAINED IN VARIOUS COMMENTS AND LETTERS TO 09:45:13 6 MR. BISNO: YOU MAY ANSWER. 7 YOUR PREDECESSOR COUNSEL WHICH I ASSUME YOU'VE REVIEWED 09:45:13 7 THE WITNESS: IT WAS STEVE GILFENBATN'S CUSTODY 8 SINCE YOU CAME INTO THE CASE, I DON'T CONTROL THEM, I 8 CASE AGAINST HIS GIRLFRIEND AT THE TIME. I THINK HER 9 HAVE NO CONTROL OVER THEM. THE DEPOSITION IS NOT BY 9 N1114E IS KAREN. 10 DEFINITION A PRIVATE PROCEEDING. AND YOU CAN DO 09:45:13 10 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DO YOU KNOW WHO CALLED YOU IN 11 WHATEVER YOU WANT BUT I -- WE HAVE THE VIDEOTAPE. I 11 THAT CASE? 12 HAVEN'T HEARD ANYTHING. IF SOMETHING, THEY'RE DOING OR 09:45:13 12 A GILFENBAIN, 13 SAYING SOMETHING IT WILL BE ON THE VIDEOTAPE AND WE CAN 09:45:13 13 Q STEVE GILFENBAIN? 14 DEAL WITH IT THEN. 09:45:13 14 A CORRECT. 09:45:13 15 MR. BISNO: I -- 09:15:13 15 Q OTHER THAN THE TESTIMONY CONCERNING 09:45:13 16 Q BY MR. RUBINER: HAVE YOU EVER - 16 MR. GILFENBAIN, DID YOU, HAVE YOU TESTIFIED AT ANY OTHER 09:15:13 17 MR. BISNO: I DISAGREE. A VIDEOTAPE CAPTURES THE 17 TRIALS? 18 IMAGES OF MR. OGULNICR AND I'VE MADE MY POSITION CLEAR. 09:45:13 1S A I DON'T RECALL. 19 IF THEY TRY TO DISRUPT IN ANY WAY MY CLIENT'S TESTIMONY 09:45:13 19 Q HAVE YOU EVER TESTIFIED AY AN ARBITRATION? 20 I WILL HAVE MY CLIENT LEAVE THE ROOM, AND YOUR 09:45:13 20 A NO. 21 CONTENTION THAT YOU DIDN'T ADVISE THEM OF THIS IS 09:45:13 21 Q ALTHOUGH YOU SEEM TO HAVE A GENERAL FAMILIARITY 09:15:13 22 NONSENSE, WE DIDN'T ADVISE THEM OF THIS. DID THEY GET 22 WITH THE DEPOSITION PROCESS AND I'M SURE YOUR COUNSEL 23 THE INFORMATION OUT OF THIN AIR? 23 PROBABLY EXPLAINED TO YOU WHAT'S GOING ON TODAY, JUST SO 09:45:13 24 MR. RUBINER: I DIDN'T SAY I DIDN'T ADVISE ANYBODY 24 WE'RE ALL ON THE SAME PAGE I'M GOING TO JUST GO OVER 25 ABOUT THE NATURE OF THE DEPOSITION. I SAID THAT IT'S A 25 GENERALLY WHAT'S HAPPENING TODAY. 101 12 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. I August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 4 PAGE 13 PAGE 15 09:45:13 1 THE PERSON TO MY LEFT, YOUR RIGHT IS THE COURT 09:45:13 1 Q IN THE LAST YEAR, HAVE YOU DONE ANYTHING TO 2 REPORTER AND IT'S HER JOB TO TAKE DOWN EVERY WORD THAT'S 2 LOOK FOR DOCUMENTS CONCERNING MR. DALESANDRD? 3 SAID BY ANYBODY IN THE ROOM DURING THE COURSE OF THE 09:45:13 3 A NO. 4 DEPOSITION. 09:45:13 4 Q IN THE LAST YEAR, HAVE YOU DONE ANYTHING TO 09:45:13 5 DO YOU UNDERSTAND? 5 LOOK FOR DOCUMENTS CONCERNING PARALLEL? STRIKE THAT. 09:45:13 6 A I 30. 09:45:13 6 IF I USE THE PHRASE "PARALLEL' TO REFER TO 09:45:13 1 Q BECAUSE THE COURT REPORTER IS WORKING ON THIS 7 PARALLEL REAL ESTATE ADVISORS, WIL, YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT 8 SPECIAL MACHINE, IT'S IMPORTANT THAT ONLY ONE OF US B PM REFERRING TO? 9 SPEAK AT A TIME. 09:45:13 9 A YOU NEED TO REPHRASE THE QUESTION. I DON'T 09:45:13 10 DO YOU UNDERSTAND? 10 UNDERSTAND THAT QUESTION. 09:45:13 11 A I AM FAMILIAR WITH THAT PROCESS. 09:45:13 11 Q OKAY. D9;45:13 12 Q ADDITIONALLY, BECAUSE THE COURT REPORTER IS 09:45:13 12 ARE YOU FAMILIAR THAT THERE'S A PARTY IN THIS 13 USING THIS SPECIAL MACHINE, IT'S IMPORTANT THAT WE USE 13 CASE CALLED PARALLEL REAL ESTATE ADVISORS? 14 WORDS AND NOT NODS OF THE HEAD OR SHAKES OF THE 09:45:13 14 A ND. 15 SHOULDERS OR COLLOQUIAL PHRASES SUCH AS 'UM-HMM' OR 09:45:13 15 Q HAVE YOU EVER HEARD OF A COMPANY CALLED 16 'UN -HUH" OR "UH-HUH." 16 PARALLEL REAL ESTATE ADVISORS? 09:45:13 11 DO YOU UNDERSTAND? 09:45:13 17 A YES. 09:45:13 18 A I DO, 09:45:13 18 Q WHEN DID YOU FIRST HEAR OF IT? 09:45:13 19 Q IF YOU DON'T HEAR A QUESTION, ASE ME RIGHT AWAY 09:15:13 19 A SUMMER OF 2010. 20 AND I CAN REPEAT THE QUESTION OR ASK THE COURT REPORTER 09:45:13 20 Q IN WHAT CONNECTION? 21 TO REPEAT THE QUESTION. 09:45:13 21 A I WAS INTRODUCED TO THAT COMPANY AND SEAN WAS 09:45:13 22 DO YOU UNDERSTAND? 22 ONE OF THE PRINCIPALS. I'M NOT SURE IF HE WAS THE ONLY 09:45:13 23 A YES, 23 PRINCIPAL. ONE OF THE PRINCIPALS. AND HE WAS BROKERING 09:45:13 24 Q ADDITIONALLY, IF YOU DON'T HEAR A 24 CAPITAL. 25 QUESTION -- I'M SORRY -- IF YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND A 09:45:13 25 Q AND WHAT WERE YOU TOLD THE COMPANY'S NAME WAS? 13 15 PAGE 14 PAGE 16 I QUESTION, LET ME KNOW AND WE CAN FIND OUT WHATEVER IT IS 09:45:13 1 A PARALLEL. 2 ABOUT THE QUESTION YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND AND HAVE A 09:45:13 2 Q SO IF I REFER TO THE COMPANY AS PARALLEL, WILL 3 QUESTION SO THAT YOU UNDERSTAND IT. 3 YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT I'M REFERRING TO? D9:45:13 4 DO YOU UNDERSTAND? 09:45:13 4 A IN THAT CAPACITY, YES. 09:45:13 5 A YES. 09:45:13 5 Q HAVE YOU EVER LOOKED FOR DOCUMENTS CONCERNING 09:45:13 6 Q IF YOU ANSWER A QUESTION WE'LL ALL ASSUME THAT 6 PARALLEL? 3 YOU BOTH HEAD THE QUESTION AND UNDERSTOOD WHAT IT MEANT. 09:45:13 7 A NO. 09:15:13 8 DO YOU UNDERSTAND? 09:45:13 B Q DID ANYONE EVER ASK YOU TO LOOK FOR DOCUMENTS 09:15:13 9 A YES. 9 CONCERNING MR. DALESANDRO? 09:45:13 10 Q YOU UNDERSTAND THAT YOU'RE UNDER OATH? 09:15:13 10 A YES. 09:45:13 11 A YES. 09:45:13 11 Q WHO? D9:45:13 12 Q THAT MEANS THAT YOUR TESTIMONY TODAY CARRIES 09:45:13 12 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT THAT IT CALLS 13 THE SAME WEIGHT AS IF YOU WERE TESTIFYING IN COURT 13 FOR DISCLOSURE OF ATTORNEY -CLIENT COMMUNICATION. 14 BEFORE A JUDGE AND A JURY. 09:45:13 14 THE WITNESS: IT WOULD BE ONE OF MY ATTORNEYS. 09:45:13 15 DO YOU UNDERSTAND? 09:45:13 15 MR. BISNO: I WILL INSTRUCT YOU NOT TO ANSWER A 09:45:13 16 A I DO. 16 QUESTION THAT CALLS FOR ANY REVELATION OF 09:15:13 11 Q HAVE YOU HAD ANY PROBLEMS UNDERSTANDING ANY OF 17 ATTORNEY -CLIENT COMMUNICATION. 18 MY QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS THUS EAR? 09:45:13 18 THE WITNESS: OKAY. 09:45:13 19 A NO. 09:45:13 19 MR. BISNO: TELL ME AND I WILL PUT IT ON THE 09:45:13 20 Q CAN YOU THINK OF ANY REASON YOU CAN'T PROVIDE 20 RECORD. 21 COMPLETE, ACCURATE AND TRUTHFUL TESTIMONY TODAY? 09:45:13 21 THE WITNESS: OKAY. 09:45:13 22 A NOT AT THIS TIME. 09:15:13 22 Q BY MR. RUBINER: BUT YOU NEVER LOOKED FOR 09:45:13 23 Q DID YOU DO ANYTHING TO PREPARE FOR THE 23 DOCUMENTS CONCERNING MR. DALESANDRON IS THAT CORRECT? 24 DEPOSITION TODAY? 09:45:13 24 A NO, 09:45:13 25 A NO. 09:45:13 25 MR. BISNO: ASKED AND ANSWERED. OBJECTION. 141 1 16 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 5 PAGE 17 PAGE 19 09:45:13 1 Q BY MR, RUBINER: DID YOU EVER -- WHAT TYPES 1 DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION? 2 OF -- WELL, DID YOU EVER HAVE A FILE OF DOCUMENTS 09:45:13 2 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. MISSTATES PREVIOUS 3 CONCERNING MR. DALESANDRD? 3 TESTIMONY. D9:45:13 4 A NOT ME PERSONALLY. 09:45:13 4 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID YOU SAY THAT SHE WAS CFO 09:45:13 5 Q DID YOU EVER ASK ANYBODY AT ONE OF YOUR 5 OF VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION? 6 COMPANIES TO RIAINTAIN DOCUMENTS CONCERNING MR. 09:45:13 6 A I DID. EXCEPT YOU SAID CEO WHEN YOU ASKED THE 7 DALESANDRD? 7 QUESTION. 09:45:13 8 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT THAT IT CALLS 09:45:13 8 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHEN DID MISS OGULNICK BECOME 9 FOR THE DISCLOSURE OF ATTORNEY -CLIENT COMMUNICATION. 9 CFO OF -- 09:45:13 10 TO THE EXTENT YOU CAN ANSWER THAT QUESTION 09:45:13 10 MR. BISNO: EXCUSE ME. AGAIN, MR. SCHOTTENSTEIN IS 11 WITHOUT DISCLOSING ATTORNEY -CLIENT COMMUNICATION, YOU'RE 11 DISRUPTING THIS DEPOSITION BY GESTURING TO 12 FREE TO CO SO. 12 MR. DALESANDRD. I'M GOING TO ASK THIS TIME AND ONLY ONE D9:45:13 13 THE WITNESS: I DON'T BELIEVE THERE WAS EVER ANY 13 MORE TIME IF MR. SCHOTTENSTEIN OR MR. LEVINE PERSISTS IN 14 HARD COPIES OR ACTUALLY PIECES OF PAPER BUT LIKELY 14 DOING THAT WE WILL TERMINATE THIS DEPOSITION. 15 SOMEBODY WHO WORKS FOR ME CREATED AN E-MAIL FILE OR A 09:45:13 15 MR. RUBINER: I DON'T BELIEVE THAT HIM, THAT 16 WORD FILE, WHATEVER. A DESK TOP FILE. 16 ANYBODY PASSING NOTES OR GESTURING TO EACH OTHER IS 09:45:13 17 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHEN YOU SAY LIKELY SOMEONE 17 DISRUPTING YOUR WITNESS OR ANYTHING THAT WOULD BE 16 WHO WORKS FOR YOU, ARE YOU AWARE OF SOMEONE WHO WORKS 16 DIFFERENT THAN WHAT EXISTS IN A TRIAL WHERE PEOPLE ARE 19 FOR YOU ACTUALLY DOING THAT? 19 ALLOWED TO WRITE. I'M GOING TO HAKE COMMENTS AND ASK 09:45:13 20 A YES. 20 QUESTIONS OF MY CLIENT THAT IS NOT DISRUPTING THE D9:45:13 21 Q AND WHO IS THE PERSON THAT WORKED FOR YOU THAT 21 DEPOSITION, THEY'VE NOT INTERRUPTED ANYTHING, THEY'VE 22 DID THAT? 22 NOT SAID ANYTHING, THEY DIDN'T GESTURE TOWARDS YOUR 09:45:13 23 A RACHEL. 23 CLIENT. YOU CAN MAKE ALL THE STATEMENTS YOU WANT BUT 09:45:13 24 Q THAT'S RACHEL OGULNICK? 24 YOU'RE INCORRECT AS TO WHAT IS GOING ON IN THIS ROOM 09:45:13 25 A CORRECT. 25 (DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD). 17 9 PAGE 16 PAGE 20 09:45:13 1 Q DID YOU EVER HAVE ANY DISCUSSIONS WITH MISS 09:45:13 1 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHEN DID MISS OGULNICK BECOME 2 OGULNICK ABOUT CREATING A FILE OF DOCUMENTS CONCERNING 2 CFO OF VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION? 3 MR. DALESANDRD? 09:45:13 3 A 2009. 09:45:13 4 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT THAT IT CALLS 09:45:13 4 Q WAS MISS OGULNICK -- WHAT COMPANY -- .AS OF S FOR SPOUSAL COMMUNICATIOI4. S 2009, WHAT COMPAVIEE DID YOU HAVE AN OWNERSHIP INTEREST 09:45:13 6 TO THE EXTENT YOU CANNOT ANSWER THAT QUESTION 6 IN? 7 WITHOUT REVEALING SPOUSAL COMMUNICATION, I WILL DIRECT 09:45:13 7 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE, OBJECTION. B YOU NOT TO ANSWER THAT QUESTION. B RIGHT TO PRIVACY. 09:45:13 9 THE WITNESS: CAN YOU REPEAT THE QUESTION? 09:15:13 9 I'LL INSTRUCT YOU NOT TO ANSWER THE QUESTION AS 09:45:13 10 MR. RUBINER: CAN YOU REPEAT THE QUESTION. 10 PHRASED. 09:45:13 li )QUESTION READ), 09:45:13 11 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHEN WAS VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT 09:15:13 12 MR. BIDED: AGAIN, I WILL REFRESH YOUR 12 CORPORATION CREATED? 13 RECOLLECTION, YOUR MEMORY. TO THE EXTENT YOU MUST 09:45:13 13 A 2007. 14 REVEAL SPOUSAL COMMUNICATION TO ANSWER THAT QUESTION, I 09:45;13 14 Q AND WHO WAS THE CFO OF VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT 15 AM DIRECTING YOU NOT TO ANSWER. 15 CORPORATION IN 2007? 09:45:13 16 THE WITNESS: I WILL NOT ANSWER, 09:45:13 16 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. D9:45:13 17 Q BY MR. RUBINER: SO YOU'RE NOT ANSWERING BASED 09:15:13 17 YOU MAY ANSWER. 18 ON YOUR COUNSEL'S INSTRUCTION; IS THAT RIGHT? 09:45:13 18 THE WITNESS: TT WAS JEREMY OGULNICK, MY BROTHER. 09:45:13 19 A CORRECT. 09:45:13 19 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHEN DID MR. OGULNICK STOP 09:45:13 20 Q WHAT'S MISS OGULNICK'S POSITION WITH YOUR 20 BEING CFO OF VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION? 21 COMPANY? 09:45:13 21 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 22 A SHE'S CFO. SHE IS VP IN CHARGE OF DESIGN. 09:45:13 22 THE WITNESS: WHEN WE CHANGED THE FILING WITH THE 09:45:13 23 Q WHAT COMPANY IS SHE CFO OF? 23 SECRETARY OF STATE, STATEMENT OF INFORMATION, AS I 09:45:13 2 A VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION. 24 STATED BEFORE, IT WOULD BE IN 2009. 09:45:13 25 Q WHEN DID SHE BECOME CEO OF VINEYARDS 09:15:13 25 Q BY MR. RUBINER: AND THAT'S WHEN MISS OGULNICK 181 20 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 6 PAGE 21 1 BECAME THE CFO OF VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION? 09:45:13 2 A JUST TO BE PRECISE, I BELIEVE IN 2009 SHE WAS 3 RACHEL FIANNAGAN. SINCE THEN WE HAVE MARRIED AND SHE IS 4 MRS. OGULNICX AND SHE, SAME PERSON, DIFFERENT NAME SINCE 5 2009. 09:45:13 6 Q WHEN DID YOU GET MARRIED? 09:45:13 7 A ARE YOU GOING TO SHOW THIS TO MY WIFE? MAY 8 24TH, I THINK IT'S '09. 09:45:13 9 Q NOW, YOU SAID THAT MISS OGULNICK OR MISS 10 FLANNAGAN WAS VICE-PRESIDENT IN CHARGE OF DESIGN; IS 11 THAT RIGHT? 09:45:13 12 A CORRECT. 09:45:13 13 Q WHICH C014PANY IS SHE VICE-PRESIDENT IN CHARGE 14 OF DESIGN OF? 09:45:13 15 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. AT WHAT TIME? 09:45:13 16 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHEN YOU SAID THAT SHE WAS, 17 WHEN YOU SAID IN YOUR PRIOR ANSWER SHE WAS 18 VICE-PRESIDENT IN CHARGE OF DESIGN, WHAT WERE YOU 19 REFERRING TO? 09:45:13 20 A FROM 2009 WHEN SHE BEGAN WORKING FOR MY COMPANY 21 SHE WAS TN CHARGE OF INTERFACING WITH THE ARCHITECT TO 22 CREATE ELEVATIONS, TO CREATE FLOOR PLANS, MARKETING 23 MATERIAL, INTERNET - SORRY. EXCUSE 14E. WEBSITE 24 MARKETING. 09:45:13 25 Q WHAT COMPANY? 21 F.4PAGE 231 CORPORATION HAVE AN OFFICE? 5:13 2 A HOME OFFICE. 5:13 3 Q WHERE IS THAT? 5:13 4 MR. BISHO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09.45:13 5 THE WITNESS: LOS ANGELES. 09:45:13 6 Q BY MR, RUBINER: DOES VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION HAVE THE SAME OFFICE ADDRESS FROM 2009 TILL B TODAY? 09:45:13 9 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE, 09:45:13 10 THE WITNESS: WE MAINTAINED AN OFFICE IN PALM 09:45:13 11 DESERT SOMETIME IN 108, 109 AND 2010. 09:45:13 12 Q BY MR. RUBINER: SO IN 2008, 2009 AND 2010 13 VINEYARDS HAD AN OFFICE IN PALM DESERT? 09:45:13 14 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. OBJECTION. 15 COMPOUND. 09:45:13 16 THE WITNESS: CORRECT. 09:15:13 17 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHERE IN PALM DESERT WAS IT? 09:45:13 18 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 03JECTION. 19 VAGUE AS TO TIME. )9:45:13 20 THE WITNESS: 37600 COLLEGE DRIVE. )9:45:13 21 Q BY MR, RUBINER: WAS IT THE SAME ADDRESS THE 22 ENTIRE TIMME IT WAS IN PALM DESERT? )9:45:13 23 A IT WAS. )9:45:13 24 Q AND IS THAT THE DEVELOPMENT KNOWN AS THE 25 VINEYARDS OF PALM DESERT? PAGE 22 PAGE 24 09:15:13 1 A IN VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT. 09:45:13 1 A IT is, EXCUSE ME. 09:45:13 2 Q DOES MISS OGULNICK CURRENTLY HAVE ANY OTHER 09:45:13 2 Q AND OTHER THAN AT THE VINEYARDS OF PALM DESERT, 3 POSITIONS OTHER THAN CFO AND VICE-PRESIDENT IN CHARGE OF 3 IN 2010 DID VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION HAVE AN 4 DESIGN WITH VINEYARDS? 4 OFFICE AT ANY OTHER ADDRESS? 09:45:13 5 A IT'S POSSIBLE. SHE CERTAINLY DOES MUCH MORE 09:45:13 5 A JUST THE HOME OFFICE I MENTIONED ON OGDEN 6 THAN THOSE TWO CAPACITIES. I DON'T KNOW IF SHE IS 6 DRIVE. 1 OFFICIALLY LISTED ON A STATE FILING. 0 9 : 45:13 7 Q DOES VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION PROVIDE 09:45:13 B Q IN 2009 WHEN MISS, THEN MISS FLANNAGAN BECAME 8 YOU WITH A COMPUTER? 9 CFO OF VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION, DID IT HAVE 09:45:13 9 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. 1O ANY OTHER EMPLOYEES? 09:45:13 10 Q BY MR. RUBINER: EVER, 09:45:13 11 MR, BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. COUNSEL, WHERE 09:45:13 11 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION, RELEVANCE INSOFAR AS THE 12 ARE YOU GOING WITH THIS? 20D9 IS WELL BEFORE THE TIME 12 QUESTION INCLUDES PRE-2010 ACTIVITIES. 13 MY CLIENT EVER MET YOUR CLIENT. 09:15:13 13 THE WITNESS: I -- I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT 09:45:13 14 MR. RUBINER: IT'S REASONABLY CALCULATED TO LEAD TO 14 QUESTION. 15 THE DISCOVERY OF ADMISSIBLE EVIDENCE CONCERNING 09:45:13 15 Q BY MR. RUBINER: IN 2010, DID YOU HAVE A 16 REPRESENTATIONS MY CLIENT CONTENDS WERE MADE A YEAR 16 COMPUTER THAT YOU USED FOR VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT 17 LATER. 17 CORPORATION BUSINESS? 09:45:13 18 MR. BISNO: YOU MAY ANSWER. 09:45:13 18 A YES. 09:45:13 19 THE WITNESS: NO, NO EMPLOYEES. 09:45:13 19 Q WHERE DID YOU MAINTAIN THAT COMPUTER? 09:45:13 20 Q BY MR. RUBINER: SINCE 2009, OTHER THAN YOUR 09:45:13 20 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 21 WIFE AND YOURSELF, HAS VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION 09:45:13 21 THE WITNESS: IN WHICH YEAR ➢=D YOU ASE? 22 HAD ANY OTHER EMPLOYEES? 09:45:13 22 Q BY MR. RUBINER: 2010. 09:45:13 23 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE, 09:45:13 23 A IT WOULD HAVE BEEN AT EITHER OFFICE. 09:15:13 24 THE WITNESS: NO. 09:45:13 24 Q DID YOU HAVE SEPARATE COMPUTERS AT EACH OFFICE? 09:45:13 25 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DOES VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT 09:15:13 25 A NO, 221 24 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 7 PAGE 25 PAGE 27 09:45:13 1 Q DID YOU HAVE A LAPTOP? 09:45:13 1 THE WITNESS: NO. 09:15:13 2 A YES. 09:45:13 2 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DOES VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT 09:45:13 3 Q AND DID YOU USE THAT SAME LAPTOP IN 2011? 3 CORPORATION OWN YOUR COMPUTER? 01:45:13 4 A I DON'T RECALL. 09:45:13 4 MR. BISNO; OBJECTIONI. RELEVANCE. OBJECTION. 09:45:13 5 Q DO YOU USE THAT SAME LAPTOP TODAY? 5 VAGUE AS TO TIME. 09:15:13 6 A JUST TO BE CLEAR, I HAVE A LAPTOP. I DON'T 09:45:13 6 THE WITNESS: NO. 7 KNOW WHEN IT WAS REPLACED. I DON'T KNOW. 09:45:13 7 Q BY MR. RUBIN3R: DOES YOUR -- IN 2010, DID MISS 09:45:13 8 Q WAS IT REPLACED SINCE THE BEGINNING OF 2012? 8 OGULNICK USE A COMPUTER FOR VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT 09:45:13 9 MR. BISNO: IF YOU RECALL. 0 BUSINESS? 09:45:13 10 THE WITNESS: NO, 09:15:13 10 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT THAT THE ANSWER 09:45:13 11 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WAS IT REPLACED SOMETIME IN 11 CALLS FOR REVEALING ATTORNEY -- PARDON ME -- EITHER 12 2011? 12 ATTORNEY -CLIENT OR SPOUSAL COMMUNICATION. 09:45:13 13 A I THINE 30. 09:45:13 13 THE WITNESS: DIRECTING ME NOT TO ANSWER? 09:45:13 14 Q DID YOU RETAIN THE -- WHEN YOU REPLACED IT, DID 09:45:13 14 MR. BISNO: IF YOUR ANSWER -- IF YOU ONLY HAVE THE 15 YOU MAINTAIN THE -- DO YOU STILL HAVE THE LAPTOP THAT 15 ANSWER BECAUSE OF INFORMATION RECEIVED FROM SPOUSAL 16 YOU WERE USING PRIOR TO IT BEING REPLACED? 16 COMMUNICATION I'M DIRECT -- OR INFORMATION YOU RECEIVED 09:45:13 17 A NO. 17 FROM YOUR ATTORNEY, I AM DIRECTING YOU NOT TO ANSPIER. 09:45:13 1S Q WHAT DID YOU DO WITH IT? 09:15:13 18 THE WITNESS: I RECEIVED THE INFORMATION FROM MY 09:45:13 19 MR, BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. HE TESTIFIED HE 19 SPOUSE. 20 DOESN'T HAVE IT. 09:45:13 20 MR, BISNO: I DIRECT YOU NOT TO ANSWER. 09:45:13 21 THE WITNESS: I DON'T KNOW, MY WIFE HANDLED IT. 09:45:13 21 Q BY MR, RUBINER: DID YOU EVER RECEIVE AN E-MAIL 22 I'M NOT SURE WHAT SHE DID WITH IT, 22 FROM RACHEL OGULNICK OR RACHEL FLANNAGAN THAT WAS ALSO 09:45:13 23 Q BY MR. RUBINER: IN 2010, WHAT WAS YOUR E-MAL 09:45;13 23 SENT TO MR. DA1ESANDRO? 24 ADDRESS? 09:45:13 24 MR. BISNO: I OBJECT TO THE EXTENT -- I'M SORRY. I 09:45:13 25 A RYANOGULNICKOHOTMAIL. 25 WITHDRAW THE OBJECTION. 25 1 27 PAGE 26 PAGE 28 09:45:13 1 Q DO YOU STILL USE THAT SAME ADDRESS? 09:45:13 1 THE WITNESS: NOT THAT I CAN SPECIFICALLY RECALL, 09:45:13 2 A NO. 2 ALTHOUGH I WOULD CONCEDE IT'S POSSIBLE. 09:45:13 3 Q WHAT E-MAIL ADDRESS DO YOU USE NOW? 09:45:13 3 Q BY MR, RUBINER: DID YOU EVER RECEIVE AN E-MAIL 09:15:13 4 A RYAN@VINEYARDSDC.COM. 4 FROM MISS OGULNICK OR MISS FLANNAGAN THAT WAS ALSO SENT 09:45:13 5 Q WHEN DID YOU START USING THE VINEYARDSDC.COM 5 TO MR. SCHOTTENSTEIN? 6 ADDRESS? 09:45:13 6 A YES. 09:45:13 7 A LATE 2010. 09:45:13 7 Q AND WHAT E-MAIL ACCOUNT DID THAT E-MAIL COME 09:15:13 8 Q DID YOU CREATE THE VINEYARDS DC E-MAIL ADDRESS? 8 FROM? 09:45:13 9 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 9 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS. 09:45:13 10 THE WITNESS: NO, 09:45:13 1D ANSWER IF YOU CAN, 09:45:13 11 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHO DID? 09:45:13 11 THE WITNESS: I DON'T KNOW. 09:1':13 12 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 12 Q BY MR, RUBINER: DID MISS OGUINICK MAINTAIN AN 09:45:13 13 THE WITNESS: I DON'T KNOW, 13 E-MAIL ACCOUNT ON THE VINEYARDS DC SERVER? 09:15:13 14 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DO YOU KNOW IF THE VINEYARDS 09:45:13 14 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. 15 DC -- STRIKE THAT. 15 OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT YOU CAN ONLY DIVULGE OR ONLY 01:45:13 16 IS THERE A SERVER THAT VINEYARDS DC HAS? 16 ANSWER THE QUESTION BY RELAYING INFORMATION YOU RECEIVED 09:15:13 17 A I DON'T KNOW. 17 FROM YOUR SPOUSE. 09:45:13 18 Q OTHER THAN YOUR LAPTOP COMPUTER, DOES VINEYARDS 09:45:13 18 THE WITNESS: YES, SHE HAS AN ACCOUNT WITH 19 DC HAVE ANY OTHER -- I'M SORRY. STRIKE THAT, 19 A -- WITH VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT SERVER. I'M NOT AN 09:45:13 20 DOES VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION HAVE ANY 20 EXPERT IN THIS MATTER BUT I THINK I ANSWERED YOUR 21 OTHER COMPUTERS? 21 QUESTION. 09:45:13 22 MR. DISKO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. 09:45:13 22 Q BY MR, RUBINER: AND WHO AT VINEYARDS IS . 23 OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 23 RESPONS13LE TODAY FOR MAINTAINING THE VINEYARDS SERVER? 09:45:13 24 PLEASE ANSWER IF YOU CAN AND IF YOU CAN PLACE 09:45:13 24 A RACHEL. 25 THE TIME. 09:45:13 25 Q AND HAVE YOU EVER OBSERVED MISS OGULNICK USING 26 � a Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew OguUck, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 SHEET 45:13 2 45:13 3 45:13 4 4 5: 13 5 45;13 45:13 :45:13 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 - PAGE 30 15:13 1 15:13 2 3 :45:13 :45:13 45:13 45:13 :45:13 45:13 15:13 4 S 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995,2449 PAGE 29 PAGE 31 A COMPUTER FOR VINEYARDS BUSINESS? F 1 CONTEXT OF AN EMPLOYEE? DO YOU MEAN IN THE CONTEXT OF A MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. HAVE YOU EVER. THAT WAS THE QUESTION. THE WITNESS: YES. Q BY MR. RUBINER: HAVE YOU OBSERVED 14ISS OGULNICK USING A COMPUTER FOR VINEYARDS BUSINESS IN THE LAST YEAR? A YES, Q OTHER THAN THE COMPUTER YOU USE AND THE C014POTER THAT YOU'VE OBSERVED MISS OGULNICH USE SINCE 2010, ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY OTHER COMPUTERS OWNED BY VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION? MR. BISNO: OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT THAT IT CALLS FOR REVEALING SPOUSAL COMMUNICATION. THE WITNESS: AS I TESTIFIED BEFORE, I DON'T BELIEVE VINEYARDS OWNS ANY COMPUTERS, BUT OTHER THAN THE COMPUTER I SAW RACHEL WORKING ON AND MY LAPTOP I MENTIONED BEFORE, THERE ARE NO OTHER COMPUTERS. Q BY MR. RUBINER: AND HAS MISS OGULNICK CHANGED COMPUTERS BETWEEN 2010 AND TODAY? MR, BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT THAT IT CALLS FOR REVEALING SPOUSAL COMMUNICATION AND I DIRECT YOU NOT TO THE ANSWER TO THE EXTENT THAT ANSWERING THE QUESTION CALLS FOR REVEALING SPOUSAL COMMUNICATION. THE WITNESS: I DON'T KNOW. Q BY MR. RUBINER: OTHER THAN -- NOW, YOU STATED EARLIER THAT VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION MAINTAINED AN OFFICE IN 2010 AND OTHER YEARS AT 37600 COLLEGE IN PALM DESERT; IS THAT RIGHT? A CORRECT. Q OTHER THAN YOU AND MISS OGULNICK, DID ANYONE ELSE WORE AT THAT OFFICE? A YES. Q WHO ELSE WORKED AT THAT OFFICE? A ROBERT WILKINSON AND EMPLOYEES OF THE CONTRACTOR CW DRIVER AND MY BROTHER, JEFFREY OGULNICK, Q AS FAR AS YOU'RE AWARE, DID ANY COMPANY OTHER THAN VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION USE THAT OFFICE ADDRESS IN 2010? A AS I JUST STATED, ROBERT WILKINSON. HE HAS HIS OWN COMPANY, SUNTEK. CW DRIVER. I BELIEVE THAT'S, THAT'S IT. Q YOU SAID MR, WILKINSON'S COMPANY IS SUNIEK? A CORRECT. Q DID MR, WILKINSON EVER WORK FOR VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION? MR. BISNO: VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS. PLEASE EXPLAIN, WHAT DO YOU MEAN 'WORK FOR," DO YOU MEAN IN THE CONTEXT OF AN INDEPENDENT CONTRACTOR? DO YOU MEAN IN THE 2 PARTNER? :45:13 3 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE 4 QUESTION? :45:13 5 A I HAVE THE SAME CONFUSION MY ATTORNEY HAS. :15:13 6 Q OKAY. :45:13 7 WAS MR. WILKINSON EVER EMPLOYED BY VINEYARDS 8 DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION? :45:13 9 . A NO. :15:13 10 Q WAS MR, WILKINSON EVER AN INDEPENDENT 11 CONTRACTOR FOR VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION? :45:13 12 A NO. :45:13 13 Q WAS MR. WILKINSON EVER AN OWNER OF VINEYARDS 14 DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION? :45:13 15 A NO. :45:13 16 Q ARE YOU FAMILIAR WITH A PROJECT CALLED 17 VINEYARDS OF PALM DESERT? ;45:13 16 A YES, :45:13 19 Q DID MR, WILKINSON HAVE ANY RESPDNSTBILTTIES FOR 20 VINEYARDS OF PALM DESERT? :45:13 21 A NOT FOR VINEYARDS OF PALM DESERT BUT THE 22 OWNERSHIP ENTITY, SINATRA & COON PROJECT LLC. :45:13 23 Q WAS MR. WILKINSON EMPLOYED BY SINATRA COOK LLC? :45:13 24 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. :45:13 25 THE WITNESS; NO. PAGE 32 13 1 2 :13 3 :13 4 :45:13 :45:13 :45:13 45:13 :45:13 :45:13 :45:13 :45:13 :45:13 5 6 7 9 l0 11 12 13 14 15 16 11 1B 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Q BY MR. RUBINER: NOW, YOU SAID BEFORE HE WAS -- WHAT DID YOU UNDERSTAND SUNTEE TO BE? A SUNTEE -- MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. THE WITNESS; SUNTEK, I BELIEVE, IS AN SPE THAT MR. WILKINSON CONTROLS. I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S A CORPORATION OR AN LLC. Q BY MR. RUBINER; DO YOU KNOW WHY MR. WILKINSON HAD AN OFFICE AT 3600 COLLEGE DRIVE AT, IN PALM DESERT IN 2010? MR, BISAO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. THE WITNESS: IT ALSO MISSTATES MY TESTIMONY. MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. MISSTATES THE WITNESS'S TESTIMONY. THE WITNESS: YOU SAID 3600. IT'S 37600. BE WORKED OUT OF THAT OFFICE IN HIS CAPACITY AS AN INDEPENDENT CONTRACTOR HIRED BY SINATRA. 4 COOK. Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID YOU ATTEND HIGH SCHOOL? A YES, MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHERE DID YOU ATTEND HIGH SCHOOL? MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. THE WITNESS: IN NEW YORK. Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHAT HIGH SCHOOL? Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 - SHEET 9 PAGE 33 PAGE 35 09:45:13 1 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 1 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 2 THE WITNESS: JOHN JAY HIGH SCHOOL. 09:45:13 2 Q BY MR. RUEINER: DID YOU GRADUATE? 00:45:13 3 Q BY MR. RUBINER: IS THAT IN NEW YORK CITY? 09:45:13 3 A YES, 09:45:13 4 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:15:13 4 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. D9:45:13 5 THE WITNESS: OUTSIDE THE CITY. 09:45:13 5 Q BY MR, EUBINER: WHAT WAS YOUR DEGREE IN? D9:45:13 6 Q BY MR. RUBINER: I'M SORRY? 09:45:13 6 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 00:45:13 7 A OUTSIDE THE CITY. 09:45:13 7 THE WITNESS: PRE -LAW, HISTORY, SOMETHING TO THAT 09:45:13 8 Q WHAT CITY WAS IT IN? 8 EFFECT. 09:15:13 9 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION, RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 9 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHAT YEAR DID YOU GRADUATE? 09:41:13 10 THE WITNESS: I THINK IT'S IN FISEKILL BUT NOT 09:45:13 10 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 11 CERTAIN. EXCUSE ME. 09:45:13 11 THE WITNESS: 1993. 09:45:13 12 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID YOU GRADUATE? 09:45;13 12 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID YOU TAKE ANY COURSES IN 09:15:13 13 A YES. 13 REAL ESTATE? 09:45:13 14 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 14 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 15 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHAT YEAR? 09:45:13 15 THE WITNESS: I DON'T RECALL. 09:45:13 16 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 16 Q BY MR, RUBINER: DID YOU TAKE ANY COURSES IN 09:45:13 17 THE WITNESS: 1989, 0 FINANCE? 09:15:13 18 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID YOU ATTEND COLLEGE? 09:45:13 16 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:15:13 19 A YES. 09:45:13 19 THE WITNESS: DON'T RECALL, 09:45:13 20 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 20 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID YOU ATTEND ANY OTHER, 09:45:13 21 Q BY MR, RUBINER: WHICH COLLEGE DID YOU ATTEND? 21 OTHER THAN ATTENDING THE STATE UNIVERSITY OF NEW YORK AT 09:45:13 22 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 22 ALBANY, DID YOU ATTEND ANY OTHER COLLEGES OR 09:45:13 23 THE WITNESS: UNIVERSITY OF NEW YORK. 23 UNIVERSITIES? 09:45:13 24 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHERE IS THAT LOCATED? 09:45:13 24 A N0, 09:45:13 25 MR. HISNO: COUNSEL, PLEASE TELL ME WHAT RELEVANT 09:45:13 25 Q OTHER THAN ATTENDING THE STATE UNIVERSITY OF 33 35 : 45 :15 :45 :45 :45 PAGE 34 - INFORMATION "HIS LINE OF QUESTIONING IS GOING TO REVEAL. :13 2 MR, RUBINER: HIS BACKGROUND INFORMATION IS - MAY 3 REASONABLY BE CALCULATED TO LEAD TO THE DISCOVERY OF 4 ADMISSIBLE EVIDENCE. IT'S IN FORM INTERROGATORIES, IT'S 5 IN A VARIETY OF THINGS AND IT'S SELF-EVIDENT HOW IT'S 6 REASONABLY CALCULATED TO LEAD TO THE DISCOVERY OF 7 ADMISSIBLE EVIDENCE. :13 8 MR. BISNO: COUNSEL, I'M YET TO HEAR FROM YOU ONE 9 WORD AS TO WHY WHERE MR. OGULNICK WENT OR DIDN'T GO TO 10 COLLEGE IS REASONABLY LIKELY TO LEAD TO RELEVANT 11 INFORMATION IN THIS CASE. :13 12 MR. RUBINER: HIS EDUCATION BACKGROUND, WHAT HE MAY 13 HAVE REPRESENTED TO MY CLIENT ABOUT IT, WHAT HE MAY HAVE 14 REPRESENTED TO OTHERS ABOUT IT IS RELEVANT. :13 15 MR. BISNO: YOU MAY ANSWER. :13 16 THE WITNESS: IT'S LOCATED IN NEW YORE. :13 17 Q BY MR. RUBINER: IN NEW YORK STATE? :13 18 A YES. :13 19 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. :13 20 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHAT CITY IN NEt YORK STATE? :13 21 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. :13 22 THE WITNESS: ALBANY. :13 23 Q BY MR. RUBINER: ALBANY. :13 24 IS THAT THE STATE UNIVERSITY OF NEW YORK AT 25 ALBANY? - PAGE 36 1 NEW YORK, DID YOU ATTEND ANY -- STRIKE THAT. :45:13 2 SUBSEQUENT TO ATTENDING THE STATE UNIVERSITY OF 3 NEW YORK, DID YOU ATTEND ANY TECHNICAL SCHOOLS? :45:13 4 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION, RELEVANCE. VAGUE AS TO 5 TIME, :45:13 6 THE WITNESS: NO. :45:13 7 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DO YOU HAVE ANY PROFESSIONAL 8 LICENSES? :45:13 9 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. :45:13 10 THE WITNESS: NO. :45:13 11 Q BY MR. RUBINER: HAVE YOU EVER TAKEN ANY 12 COURSES IN REAL ESTATE? :45:13 13 MR, BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. :45:13 14 THE WITNESS: YES. :45:13 15 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHEN DID YOU TAKE COURSES IN 16 REAL ESTATE? :45:13 0 A I DON'T RECALL. :45:13 1B Q WAS IT AFTER YOU ATTENDED THE STATE UNIVERSITY 19 OF NEW YORK AT ALBANY? :45:13 20 A LIKELY. :45:13 21 Q WAS IT IN CALIFORNIA? :45:13 22 A YES. :45:13 23 Q DO YOU KNOW WHO - DO YOU KNOW WHERE IN :45:13 24 CALIFORNIA YOU TOOK THE COURSE? :45:13 25 MR, BISNO: OBJECTION, RELEVANCE. Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 10 PAGE 37 PAGE 39 09:45:13 1 THE WITNESS: NO, 09:45:13 1 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION, RELEVANCE, 09:45:13 2 MR, BISNO: COUNSEL, WHERE IS OR HOW IS WHERE IN 09:45:13 2 THE WITNESS: YES. 3 CALIFORNIA LIKELY TO LEAD TO RELEVANT EVIDENCE? 09:45:13 3 Q BY MR, RUBINER: FOLLOWING YOUR GRADUATION WHAT 09:45:13 4 MR. RUBINER: IT COULD LEAD "IO THE PLACE THAT HE 4 WAS YOUR FIRST FULL-TIME JOB? 5 T00K THE COURSE AT WHICH COULD LEAD TO EVIDENCE AS TO 09:45:13 5 A WORKING FOR A KAPLAN FAMILY IN THEIR REAL 6 THE SUBJECT MATTER OF THE COURSE WHICH MAY OR MAY NOT BE 6 ESTATE BUSINESS. 7 RELEVANT TO THE REAL ESTATE TRANSACTIONS INVOLVED IN 09:45:13 7 0 WHERE WAS THAT? 8 THIS CASE TO WHICH YOUR CLIENT CLAIMS TO BE AA EXPERT. 09:15:13 8 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 9 MR. BISNO: DESPITE MY OBJECTION, HE'S ANSWERED 09:45:13 9 THE WITNESS: LOS ANGELES. 10 YOUR QUESTION. 09:45:13 10 Q BY MR, RUBINER: YOU SAID YOU WORKED FOR THE 09:11:13 11 Q BY MR. RUBINER: ARE YOU A MEMBER OF ANY 11 EAPLAN FAMILY. IS THERE A PARTICULAR ENTITY YOU WORKED 12 PROFESSIONAL SOCIETIES CONCERNING REAL ESTATE? 12 FOR? 09:15:13 13 A NO. 09:45:13 13 A I DON'T RECALL THE NAME OF THEIR ENTITY. 09:45:13 14 Q DO YOU HAVE A CONTRACTOR'S LICENSE? 09:45:13 14 Q WHO WAS YOUR SUPERVISOR? 09:45:13 15 A NO. 09:45:13 15 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. D9:45:13 16 Q OTHER THAN THE -- STRIKE THAT. 09:45:13 16 THE WITNESS: IT WAS OWNED BY BEN AND BILL KAPLAN. 09:45:13 17 HAVE YOU EVER TAKEN ANY COURSES IN FINANCE? 17 THEY WERE BROTHERS. 09:11:13 18 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. 09:45:13 18 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHAT WAS YOUR JOB? 09:45:13 19 THE WITNESS: I DON'T RECALL. 09:45:13 19 A IT WAS PROPERTY MANAGEMENT, PROPERTY 09:45:13 20 Q BY MR. ROBINER: WHAT WAS YOUR FIRST FULL-TIME 09:45:13 20 DEVELOPMENT. THERE WAS NO -- WHATEVER THEY ASKED FOR AT 21 JOB? 21 THE TIME. 09:45:13 22 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION, RELEVANCE. D9:45:13 22 Q HOW LONG DID YOU WORK FOR THE KAPLAN FAMILY? 09:45:13 23 THE WITNESS: PROBABLY WORKING AT A GOLF COURSE 09:15:13 23 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 24 WHEN I WAS 17 CALLED BEEKMAN COUNTRY CLUB. 09:45:13 24 THE WITNESS: TWO YEARS. 09:15:13 25 Q BY MR. RUBINER: AND WHERE WAS THAT? 09:45:13 25 Q BY MR. RUBINER: I BELIEVE YOU TESTIFIED THAT 37 39 PAGE 36 PAGE 40 09:45:13 1 MR, BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE, 1 YOU GRADUATED FROM THE STATE UNIVERSITY OF NEW YORE AT 09:45:13 2 COUNSEL, WORKING AT A GOLF COURSE AS HIS FIRST 2 ALBANY IN 1993, SO DID YOU WORK FOR THE KAPLANS FROM 3 JOB, HOW IS IT RELEVANT WHERE THE GOLF COURSE WAS? 3 1993 TILL 1995? 09:45:13 4 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHAT WAS THE NAME OF THE GOLF 09:45:13 4 A I THINK IT WAS '91 TO '96. 5 COURSE? 09:45:13 5 Q DID YOU HAVE AN OFFICE? 09:15:13 6 A BEEKMAN COUNTRY CLUB. 09:45:13 6 A YES. 09:15:13 7 Q AND THIS WAS A FULL-TIME JOB? 09:45:13 7 Q WHERE WAS THAT? 09:45:13 B A YEAH. 09:45:13 8 MR. PISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:15:13 9 Q WHAT WAS YOUR POSITION? 09:45:13 9 THE WITNESS: PALMS, CALIFORNIA. 09:45:13 10 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 10 Q BY MR. RUBINER: AND YOU WORKED FOR -- DID YOU 09:45:13 11 THE WITNESS: GREENSXEEPING. 11 REPORT -- WHO DID YOU REPORT TO WHILE YOU WORKED FOR THE 09:15:13 12 Q BY MR. RUBINER: HOW LONG DID YOU WORK THERE? 12 KAPLAN FAMILY IN 1991 TO 1996? 09:45:13 13 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 13 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE, OBJECTION. 09:15:13 14 THE WITNESS: I THINK, THERE FULL SUMMERS WHILE AT 14 VAGUE AS TO TIME. 15 COLLEGE. 09:45:13 15 THE WITNESS: BEN KAPLAN. 09:45:13 16 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHAT WAS YOUR NEXT FULL-TIME 09:45:13 16 Q BY MR, RUBINER: YOU SAID THAT YOU WERE IN 17 JOB? 17 PROPERTY MANAGEMENT AND PROPERTY DEVELOPMENT; IS THAT D9:45:13 18 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 18 RIGHT? 09:45:13 19 THE WITNESS: WORKING AT DUTCHESS COUNTRY CLUB. 09:15:13 19 A YES. 09:15:13 20 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHEN DID YOU WORK AT DUTCHESS 09:45:13 20 Q AND WHAT DID YOU DO WHILE WORKING FOR THE 21 COUNTRY CLUB? 21 KAPLAN FAMILY IN PROPERTY MANAGEMENT? 09:45:13 22 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 22 MR. BISND: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME, 09:45:13 23 THE WITNESS: DURING COLLEGE. 09:45:13 23 THE WITNESS: WE HAD A PORTFOLIO OF PROPERTIES AND 39:45:13 24 Q BY MR, RUBINER: WHAT WAS YOUR FIRST -- WERE 24 WE WORKED ON KEEPING THE PROPERTIES FULLY LEASED, 25 YOU A FULL-TIME STUDENT WHILE YOU WERE IN COLLEGE? 25 MARKETING THE PROPERTIES AND WORKED OUT A VARIETY OF 381 40 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 11 PAGE 41 PAGE 43 1 OTHER DEVELOPMENT OPPORTUNITIES TO BUILD AND ACQUIRE NEW 09:45:13 1 Q BY MR. REFINER: VENICE, CALIFORNIA? 2 SITES FOR APARTMENT DEVELOPMENT. 09:45:13 2 A YES, 1:45:13 3 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WAS THIS APARTMENT DEVELOPMENT 09:45:13 3 Q DID YOU WORK FOR PC INVESTMENTS BETWEEN 1996 4 IN LOU ANGELES COUNTY? 4 AND 1998? 1:45:13 5 A YES. 09:45:13 5 ME. BISND: OBJECTION• RELEVANCE. 1:45:13 6 Q YOU ALSO STATED THAT YOU DID PROPERTY 09:45:13 6 THE WITNESS: ROUGHLY, THAT'S ACCURATE. 7 DEVELOPMENT. WERE YOUR DUTIES AND RESPONSIBILITIES FOR 09:45:13 7 Q BY MR. RUBINER: IS THERE A DIFFERENT TIME 8 PROPERTY DEVELOPMENT THE SAME BETWEEN 1994 AND 1996? 8 FRAME THAT YOU WORKED FOR THEM? :45:13 9 MR. DISKO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE, 09:45:13 9 A I'M JUST NOT SURE. IT'S WITHIN THAT TIME. IT :15:13 10 THE WITNESS: I DON'T RECALL. 10 COULD BE SIX MONTHS LONGER, SIX MONTHS EARLIER, BUT :45:13 11 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHAT WERE YOUR DUTIES AND 11 THAT'S ROUGHLY ABOUT RIGHT. 12 RESPONSIBILITIES CONCERNING PROPERTY DEVELOPMENT WHILE 09:45:13 12 Q WHAT WAS YOUR POSITION WITH PC INVESTMENTS? 13 YOU WERE WORKING FOR THE KAPLAN FAMILY? 09:45:13 13 A SIMILAR TO THE KAPLAN FAMILY EXCEPT WE BEGAN TO :45:13 14 MR. BISND: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 14 ACQUIRE MULTI, EXISTING MULTI -FAMILY HOUSING. :45:13 15 THE WITNESS: LOCATE SITES, UNDERWRITE SITES, MAKE 09:45:13 15 Q WHO WAS YOUR SUPERVISOR AT PC INVESTMENTS? 16 A DETERMINATION OR RECOMMENDATION IF THE SITE WAS 09:45:13 16 MR, BISND: OBJECTION• RELEVANCE. OBJECTION. 17 VIABLE, FEASIBLE. 17 VAGUE AS TO TIME. :45:13 18 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WERE YOU PROVIDED ANY TRAINING 09:45:13 18 THE WITNESS: PAUL CHAN. 19 IN PROPERTY DEVELOPMENT WHILE YOU WORKED AT THE KAPLAN 09:45:13 19 Q BY MR. RUBINER: PAUL CHAN; IS THAT RIGHT? 20 FAMILY? 09:45:13 20 A CORRECT. :45:13 21 1•fR. BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME• 09:45:13 21 Q C-H-A-N? 22 OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 22 A CORRECT. :45:13 23 THE WITNESS: I DON'T RECALL. 09:45:13 23 Q WAS MR. CHAN YOUR SUPERVISOR THE ENTIRE TIME? :45:13 24 Q BY MR, RUBINER: DID YOU RECEIVE ANY TRAINING 09:45:13 24 A CORRECT. 25 CONCERNING PROPERTY MANAGEMENT WHILE YOU WORKED FOR THE 09:45:13 25 MR. BISND: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE, 41 43 PAGE 42 :45:13 45:13 45:13 :15 :13 :95:13 45:13 45:13 :15 13 5 1 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 KAPLAN FAMILY? MR. BISND: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME• OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. THE WITNESS: I WOULD SAY THAT THE KAPLAN BROTHERS WERE VERY EXPERIENCED AND I'M SURE I LEARNED MANY THINGS WORKING FOR THEM. Q BY MR. RUBINER: ARE YOU FAMILIAR WITH A PERSON NAMED LEWIS KAPLAN? A YES. 0 WAS LEWIS KAPLAN PART OF THE KAPLAN FAMILY? A NO. TWO DIFFERENT FAMILIES. DID NOT KNOW EACH OTHER. NO AFFILIATION'. Q WHY DID YOU STOP WORKING FOR THE KAPLAN FAMILY IN IMF MR. EISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. THE WITNESS: MOVED ON TO WORK FOR A NEW COMPANY. Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHAT NEW COMPANY DID YOU WORK FOR? PAGE 44 :15:13 1 45:13 45:13 5 45:13 6 7 8 45:13 9 10 45:13 11 12 45:13 13 45:13 14 A PC INVESTMENTS. 09:45:13 Q PC INVESTMENTS; IS THAT CORRECT? A CORRECT. 09:45:13 Q WHERE IS PC INVESTMENTS LOCATED? MR. BISND: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. THE WITNESS: '96 THROUGH 198 THEY WERE LOCATED IN 09:45:13 VENICE 15 17 16 19 20 21 22 23 25 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DO YOU RECALL WHAT MR. CHAN'S POSITION WITH PC'_NVESTMENT WAS? MR. BISND: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. THE WITNESS: I BELIEVE HE WAS THE SOLE OWNER. Q BY MR. RUBINER: NOW, YOU SAID THAT IN ADDITION TO THE -- WELL, WERE YOUR JOB DUTIES CONCERNING -- STRIKE THAT. DID YOU, WERE YOU RESPONSIBLE FOR PROPERTY MANAGEMENT AT PC INVESTMENTS? MR. BISND: OBJECTION, RELEVANCE, OBJECTION• VAGUE AS TO TIME, THE WITNESS: CORRECT, Q BY MR. RUBINER: WERE YOUR DUTIES AND RESPONSIBILITIES AS IT RELATES TO PROPERTY MANAGEMENT AT PC INVESTMENTS THE SAME AS IT WAS AT THE KAPLAN FAMILY? MR. BISND: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE, OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. THE WITNESS: THERE'S LIKELY DIFFERENCES, NUANCES, DIFFERENT THINGS I WOULD DO, Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHAT WERE THE DIFFERENCES IN WHAT YOU DID CONCERNING PROPERTY MANAGEMENT AT PC INVESTMENTS FROM THE KAPLAN FAMILY? MR, BISND: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 SHEET 4 5: 13 1 2 3 :13 ; 45:13 :15:13 45:13 45:13 45:13 15 13 :15 13 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 25 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 12 PAGE 45 PAGE THE WITNESS: I HAD NO EQUITY WITH THE KAPLAN 09:45:13 1 FAMILY. I HAD VARIOUS PROJECTS THAT WERE -- TREY WOULD 2 BE JV'S AND WE'D ACQUIRE THE SITE TOGETHER. I'D BE AN 09:45:13 3 EQUITY PARTICIPANT. 4 Q BY MR. RUBINER: THIS IS AT PC INVESTMENTS 5 YOU'D BE AN EQUITY PARTICIPANT? 09:45:13 6 A I THINK, TO BE PRECISE, THESE PROJECTS WERE 09:45:13 7 ACQUIRED UNDER NEW SPE'S SO IT WASN'T PC INVESTMENTS BUT 8 THE PRINCIPAL OF PC INVESTMENT AND MYSELF WOULD ACQUIRE 09;45:13 9 SITES AS PART OF A JV. 10 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WERE YOU AN EMPLOYEE AT PC 11 INVESTMENTS? 09:45:13 12 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. OBJECTION, 13 VAGUE AS TO TIME. 09:45:13 14 THE WITNESS: I THINK THAT'S ACCURATE, IN A DUAL 09:45:13 15 CAPACITY. THERE WAS -- YES, 50 THAT WOULD BE CORRECT. 16 Q BY MR, RUBINER: SO YOU WERE, JUST SO I 09:45:13 11 UNDERSTAND, BETWEEN -- WERE YOU AN EMPLOYEE THE ENTIRE 18 TIME BETWEEN '96 AND '98? 09:45:13 19 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 20 THE WITNESS: TO THE BEST OF MY RECOLLECTION. 21 Q BY MR. RUBINER: AND WHAT WAS YOUR JOB TITLE? 22 MR. BISNO; OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. 09:45:13 23 THE WITNESS: I DON'T RECALL THE SPECIFIC TITLE. 24 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID YOU HAVE THE SAME J08 09:45:13 25 47 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHEN YOU WERE AT PC INVESTMENTS, DID YOU -- STRIKE THAT. AT PC INVESTMENTS YOU ALSO SAID THAT THERE WAS A DIFFERENCE WITH KAPLAN IN THAT YOU ACQUIRED EXISTING MULTI -FAMILY UNITS; IS THAT RIGHT? A CORRECT. Q WHILE YOU WERE AT PC INVESTMENTS, DID YOU -- STRIKE THAT. HOW MANY - WHILE YOU WERE AT PC INVESTMENTS, DID YOU DEVELOP ANYTHING OTHER THAN MULTI -FAMILY PROJECTS? MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TD TIME. OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. THE WITNESS: NOT THAT I RECALL. Q BY MR. RUBINER: AND DID YOU DEVELOP ANY MULTI -FAMILY PROJECTS IN ORANGE COUNTY? MR. BISNO: DEJECTION. RELEVANCE. OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME, THE WITNESS: NO. Q BY 9. RUBINER: DID YOU DEVELOP ANY MULTI -FAMILY PROJECTS WHILE AT PC INVESTMENTS OUTSIDE OF LOS ANGELES COUNTY? MR. DISKO: OBJECTION, VAGUE AS TO TIME, OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. THE WITNESS: NOT THAT I RECALL, PAGE 46 PAGE 48 1 TITLE THE ENTIRE TIME BETWEEN '96 AND '98? 09:15:13 1 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DO YOU RECALL WHETHER YOU 09:45:13 2 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 2 BUILT ANY PROJECTS ''WHILE YOU WERE WORKING AT PC 09:45:13 3 THE WITNESS: I DON'T THINK I HAD A TITLE. 3 INVESTMENTS? 09:45:13 4 Q BY MR. RUBINER: OTHER THAN YOU AND MR. CHAN, 09:45:13 4 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE, OBJECTION, 5 DID ANYONE ELSE WORK FOR PC INVESTMENTS BETWEEN '96 AND 5 VAGUE AS TO TIME. 6 '98, AS FAR AS YOU KNOW? 09:45:13 6 THE WITNESS: YES. D9:45:13 7 MR, BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE, OBJECTION, 09:15:13 7 Q BY MR. RUBINER: NOW MANY PROJECTS DO YOU 8 VAGUE AS TO TIME. 8 RECALL THAT YOU WERE INVOLVED IN THAT YOU BUILT WHILE AT 09:45:13 9 THE WITNESS: THERE WAS AN OFFICE STAFF THERE THAT 9 PC INVESTMENTS? 10 SEEMED TO DO ACCOUNTING AND OTHER MANAGEMENT ROLES. 09:45:13 10 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION, RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 11 Q BY MR, RUBINER: NOW, YOU STATED THAT YOU ALSO 09:45:13 11 THE WITNESS: YOUR QUESTION "BUILT' IS A FUNNY 12 I'IERE, WORKING FOR THE KAPLAN FAMILY YOU DID PROPERTY 12 QUESTION TO ASK A DEVELOPER. I THINK YOU SHOULD SORT OF 13 DEVELOPMENT. DID YOU DO THE SAME, DID YOU HAVE THE SAME 13 FINE TUNE THE QUESTION. 14 DUTIES CONCERNING PROPERTY DEVELOPMENT WITH PC 09:45:13 14 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHAT IS CONFUSING ABOUT THE 15 INVESTMENTS? 15 QUESTION? 09:45:13 16 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. 09:45:13 16 A I DON'T, FOR THE MOST PART, IN MY CAPACITY, MY 17 OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 17 CAREER, I DON'T BUILD PROJECTS. I THINK OF THE WORD 09:45:13 18 THE WITNESS: THERE WERE DIFFERENT NUANCES TO IT. 18 "BUILD" AS WHAT A GENERAL CONTRACTOR WOULD DO. I DON'T 09:15:13 19 Q BY MR. RUBINER: HOW WERE THEY DIFFERENT? 19 HAVE A GENERAL CONTRACTOR'S LICENSE, 09:45:13 20 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. OBJECTION. 09:45:13 20 Q DID YOU HAVE ANY PROJECTS THAT YOU DEVELOPED 21 VAGUE AS TO TIME. 21 'WHERE THERE WAS NOT AN EXISTING BUILDING -- 09:45:13 22 THE WITNESS: THE KAPLAN FAMILY WAS CONSIDERED A 09:45:13 22 MR, BISNO: OBJECTION. 23 NUMBER OF THINGS BUT WAS NOT TRULY ACTIVE IN PURSUING 09:45:13 23 Q BY MR. RUBINER: -- WHILE AT PC INVESTMENTS? 24 NEW VENTURES WHEREAS PC WAS MORE ACTIVE, AGGRESSIVE AND 09:15:13 24 MR. BISNO: I'M SORRY. 25 WE ACTUALLY DID A NUMBER OF THINGS. 09:45:13 25 OBJECTION. VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS. WHAT DO YOU 461 46 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 13 PAGE 49 PAGE 51 1 MEAN BY THE WORD DID "YOU"? 09:45:13 1 THE WITNESS: THERE WAS ENTITLEMENTS, NOT 09:45:13 2 Q BY MR. RUBINER: YOU CAN ANSWER. 2 DEVELOPMENT, 09:45:13 3 MR. DISKO: DO YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT -- 09:45:13 3 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHEN YOU SAY THERE WERE 09:45:13 4 MR. RUBINER: COUNSEL -- 4 ENTITLEMENTS, WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? 09:45:13 5 MR. BISND: -- COUNSEL MEANS BY THE WORD -- 09:45:13 5 A TO TAKE AN EXISTING SITE WHICH FALLS UNDER A 09:15:13 6 MR, RUBINER: COUNSEL, I OBJECT TO YOUR 6 PARTICULAR ZONING PLOT AND HAVE A FORMAL APPLICATION 7 INTERRUPTING THE WITNESS BEFORE BE ANSWERS THE QUESTION. 7 WITH A JURISDICTION, A CITY, AND THAT RESULTS IN A B I TOLD HIM AT THE BEGINNING IF HE DOESN'T UNDERSTAND A B PROPERTY GETTING VESTED 4IITH CERTAIN DEVELOPMENT RIGHTS. 9 QUESTION HE CAN ASK, HE CAN TELL ME THAT HE DOESN'T 09:45:13 9 Q AND WERE YOU PERSONALLY INVOLVED IN ANY OF 10 UNDERSTAND IT, BUT FOR YOU TO SUGGEST REASONS WHY HE MAY 10 THOSE ENTITLEMENTS WHILE YOU WERE WORKING FOR THE KAPLAN 11 OR MAY NOT UNDERSTAND THE QUESTION IS HIGHLY IMPROPER. 11 FAMILY? G9:45:13 12 MR. BISND: COUNSEL, I DIDN'T UNDERSTAND THE 09:45:13 12 A YES. 13 QUESTION, 09:45:13 13 Q HOW MANY? 09:45:13 14 MR. RUBINER: THAT'S IRRELEVANT WHETHER YOU 09:45:13 14 A I DON'T RECALL. 15 UNDERSTOOD IT OR NOT. IT'S WHETHER THE WITNESS 09:45:13 15 Q MORE THAN TWO? 16 UNDERSTOOD IT, IF HE UNDERSTANDS IT HE CAN ANSWER. IF 09:45:13 16 A I DON'T RECALL. 17 HE DOESN'T UNDERSTAND IT HE CAN TELL ME. YOUR 09:45:13 17 Q MORE THAN TEN? 18 UNDERSTANDING IS COMPLETELY IMMATERIAL. 09:45:13 16 A I DON'T RECALL. 05:45:13 19 MR. BISND: COUNSEL, LET'S HAVE A PROTOCOL. I'It 09:45:13 19 Q MORE THAN A HUNDRED? 20 LET YOU FINISH YOUR RECORD, LET ME FINISH MINE. 09:45:13 20 MR. BISNO: COUNSEL, HE'S NOW ANSWERED TWICE AS TO 09:15:13 21 NOW TO ALLOW ME TO FINISH MINE, I DON'T DOUBT 21 "MORE THAN." HE'S TESTIFIED BOTH TIMES CONSISTENTLY "I 22 THAT MY CLIENT IS SMARTER THAN I All. I DIDN'T 22 DON'T RECALL." THIS IS BADGERING THE WITNESS. 09:15:13 23 UNDERSTAND THE QUESTION. I WANT TO MAKE SORE HE DID, 09:45:13 23 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WAS IT MORE THAN A HUNDRED 24 DO YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT COUNSEL MEANS WHEN HE 24 TIMES? 25 USES THE WORD, QUOTE, "YOU," CLOSE QUOTE? 09:45:13 25 MR. DISNO: OBJECTION. YOU'RE BADGERING THE 99 51 PAGE 50 PAGE 52 09:45:13 1 THE WITNESS: I DO NOT. 1 WITNESS. HE'S NOW TESTIFIED TWICE HE ➢DES NOT RECALL. 00:45:13 2 MR. BISND: OBJECTION. VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS. 5:13 2 Q BY MR. RUBINER: SO COULD YOU HAVE WORKED ON 09:45:13 3 MR. RUBINER: I'M SORRY. 3 ENTITLEMENTS FOR THE KAPLAN FAMILY ON MORE THAN A 09:15:13 4 CAN YOU GO BACK TO THE ORIGINAL QUESTION AND [09:45:13 4 HUNDRED SEPARATE OCCASIONS? 5 REPEAT IT FOR ME. 5:13 5 MR. BISND: COUNSEL, YOU'RE BADGERING THE WITNESS. 09:45:13 6 (QUESTION READ), 6 I'D ASK YOU TO MOVE ON, 09:45:13 7 MR. RUBINER: ONE SECOND. 7 Q BY MR, RUBINER: YOU CAN ANSWER THE QUESTION. 09:45:13 8 Q DID YOU UNDERSTAND THAT QUESTION? :5:13 B A I DON'T RECALL. 09:15:13 9 A I BELIEVE MY ATTORNEY'S COMMENT IS ACCURATE AND 09:45:13 9 Q DURING THE COURSE OF YOUR CAREER, HOW MANY 10 I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT THE WORD "YOU" MEANS, IN WHAT 10 TIMES HAVE YOU WORKED ON ENTITLEMENTS FOR AN EXISTING 11 CAPACITY. 11 SITE? 09:45:13 12 Q DID PC INVESTMENTS, IF I CHANGE 'YOU" TO PC 09:45:13 12 A I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE WORD "EXISTING SITE° 13 INVESTMENTS, DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE QUESTION? 13 MEANS. 09:45:13 14 A I DO. 09:45:13 14 Q WELL, WHEN YOU TESTIFIED -- CAN YOU REPEAT HIS 09:45:13 15 Q CAN YOU ANSWER THE QUESTION USING PC 15 PRIOR ANSWER? 16 INVESTMENTS TO MEAN YOU? 09:45:13 16 (ANSWER READI. 09:15:13 17 A I DON'T RECALL THERE BEING ANY SITES ACQUIRED 09:45:13 I7 Q BY MR. RUBINER: AND WHEN YOU USE THE PHRASE 18 THAT WERE VACANT PIECES OF DIRT. I THINK THEY WERE, 16 "EXISTING -- " CAN YOU READ THE QUESTION THAT THAT 19 THERE WAS SOME EXISTING STRUCTURE, AN OLD LIMITED 19 WAS -- I APOLOGIZE -- THAT THAT WAS IN RESPONSE TO. 20 DENSITY EXISTING MULTIFAMILY. 09:45:13 20 (QUESTION READ). 09:45:13 21 Q WHILE YOU WERE AT THE KAPLAN, WITH THE KAPLAN 09:45:13 21 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHEN YOU USED THE PHRASE 22 FAMILY, DID THE KAPLAN FAMILY DEVELOP ANY PROJECTS FROM 22 "EXISTING SITE" WEEK YOU WERE ANSWERING MY QUESTION 23 DIRT? 23 ABOUT ENTITLEMENTS, WHAT DID YOU MEAN BY EXISTING SITE? 09:45:13 24 MR, DISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. 09:45:13 24 A I THINK THE WORD IS PROBABLY INTERCHANGEABLE 25 OBJECTION, RELEVANCE. 25 WITH A PARTICULAR SITE. 501 52 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 14 PAGE 53 PAGE 55 09:45:13 1 Q AND WHEN YOU SAY 'PARTICULAR SITS," WHAT DO YOU I THE NEED TO CHANGE THE UNDERLYING ZONING, WHETHER IT WAS 2 MEAN BY THAT? 2 DISCRETIONARY IN NATURE OR NOT DISCRETIONARY IN NATURE, 09:45:13 3 A ANY PARTICULAR SITE. JUST A SITE, IN GENERAL. 3 TYPICALLY HIRE CONSULTANTS TO HELP US IN THAT 09:45:13 4 Q SO DOES THAT MEAN THE SITE WHERE IT COULD BE 4 DETERMINATION, WHETHER IT WAS A LAND USE ATTORNEY, CIVIL 5 BOTH A BUILDING OR DIRT ON A GIVEN SITE IN YOUR ANSWER? 5 ENGINEER, LAND PLANNER OR ARCHITECT. AND WE WOULD THEN 09:45:13 6 A CORRECT. 6 MAKE A DETERMINATION IF THE ECONOMICS AND THE UNDERLYING 09:45:13 7 Q AND IN YOUR CAREER, HOW MANY TIMES HAVE YOU 7 ENTITLEMENT RISK MADE SENSE TO ACQUIRE THE SITE. B WORKED ON ENTITLEMENTS FOR A PARTICULAR SITE? 09:45:13 B Q AND BETWEEN 1996 AND 1958 WHEN YOU WORKED 09:15:13 9 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS. 09:45:13 9 FOR PC INVESTMENTS, DID YOU HAVE THE SAME 09:45:13 10 DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE WORD 'WORKED ON' AND THE 10 RESPONSIBILITIES -- I1 CONTEXT IN WHICH IT IS MEANT BY COUNSEL? 09:45:13 11 MR, BISNO: OBJECTION. D9; 45:13 12 MR. RUBINER: COUNSEL, I OBJECT TO YOUR SPEAKING 09:45:13 12 MR. ROSINED: -- AS FAR AS ENTITLEMENTS GO? 13 OBJECTIONS. IF YOU HAVE A LEGAL OBJECTION I REQUEST 09:45:13 13 MR. BISNO: I'7•f SORRY. I INTERRUPTED YOU. 14 THAT YOU MARE THE LEGAL OBJECTION BUT NOT SUGGEST IN 09:45:13 14 OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 15 YOUR OBJECTION WHAT BASIS FOR THE OBJECTION MAY BE, n:45:13 15 MR, RUBINER: DID YOU GET THE QUESTION? 16 WHAT, IF YOU CAN -- IF YOUR OBJECTION IS VAGUE AND 09:45:13 16 THE REPORTER: YES. 17 AMBIGUOUS, I REQUEST YOU MAKE A VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS 09:45:13 17 THE WITNESS: I THINK THE RELATIONSHIP PROBABLY 1B OBJECTION AND LET THE WITNESS, IF HE DETERMINES IT TO BE 1B CHANGED FROM THE INCEPTION WHEREIN WE WOULD GO OUT AND 19 VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS, DO SO ON HIS OWN, 19 ACQUIRE SITES WHERE I WAS INITIALLY JUST AN EMPLOYEE AND 09:45:13 20 Q CAN YOU ANSWER THE QUESTION? 20 WHERE I BECAME A PRINCIPAL OR JOINT VENTURE PARTNER. 09:45:13 21 A I WOULD SAY MORE THAN 15, LESS THAN 50• 09:45:13 21 Q BY MR. REFINER: AND HOW DID YOUR 09:45:13 22 Q AND HOW MANY -- STRIKE THAT, 22 RESPONSIBILITIES CHANGE BETWEEN BEING AN EMPLOYEE AND 09:45:13 23 DID YOU WORK ON ENTITLEMENTS FOR ANY PARTICULAR 23 BEING A PRINCIPAL? 24 SITES WHILE YOU WORKED FOR THE KAPLAN FAMILY? 09:45:13 24 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 25 MR, BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. OBJECTION, 09:45:13 25 THE WITNESS: JUST IN THE CAPACITY THAT ONCE THE 53 5' - PAGE 54 PAGE 56 1 VAGUE AS TO TIME. 1 SITE WAS ACQUIRED THERE WERE VOTING RIGHTS VESTED TO ME 09:45:13 2 THE WITNESS: YES, 2 AS PART OF THE MANAGEMENT TEAM, D9:45:13 3 0 BY MR. RUBINER: HOW MANY? 09:45:13 3 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DO YOU RECALL HOW MANY SITES 09:45:13 4 A I DON'T RECALL SPECIFICALLY. IF YOU WANT 4 YOU HAD A PRINCIPAL RELATIONSHIP WITH AS IT RELATES TO 5 SPECIFIC THERE WAS A SITE ON NATIONAL IN PALMS, THERE 5 PC INVESTMENTS BETWEEN 1996 AND 1998? 6 WAS A SITE IN MAR VISTA ON AVON WAY AND THERE WAS 09:45:13 6 MR. HISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. OBJECTION. 7 ANOTHER SITE IN I'IEST LA ON NEBRASKA, THERE WERE MORE. 1 RIGHT TO PRIVACY, IF WE CONTINUE ON THIS ROAD I WILL B THOSE ARE THE THREE THAT JUMP OUT AT ME AT THE M011ENT. 8 HAVE TO INTERPOSE MORE OBJECTIONS AND INSTRUCT MY CLIENT 09:45:13 9 Q IN REGARDS TO THE THREE SITES YOU IDENTIFIED, 9 NOT TO ANSWER. 10 WERE YOUR RESPONSIBILITIES THE 21E FOR EACH SITE? 09:45:13 1D THE WITNESS: I BELIEVE THERE WERE THREE TO FOUR, 09:45:13 11 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 11 OFF THE TOP OF MY HEAD. 156D PURDUE IN WEST LA, ANOTHER D9:45:13 12 THE WITNESS: I THINK THEY WERE. 12 ADDRESS ON PURDUE AND A SITE IN MAR VISTA ON AERIAL WAY. 09: 45:13 13 Q BY MR. RUBINER: AND WHAT WERE YOUR 09:45:13 13 Q BY MR. RUBINER: NOW, YOU SAID THAT YOU STOPPED 14 RESPONSIBILITIES? 14 WORKING WITH PC INVESTMENTS IN 1998, APPROXIMATELY; IS 09:45:13 15 A AS I TESTIFIED PREVIOUSLY -- COULD 1 SUGGEST, 15 THAT RIGHT? 16 JOHN, THAT YOU, IF YOU COULD KEEP ME IN THAT TIME FRA12 09:45:13 16 MR. BISMO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE, 11 IT WOULD BE PROBABLY BETTER FOR MY MEMORY THAN JUMPING 09:45:13 11 THE WITNESS: LIKE I SAID BEFORE, IT COULD HAVE 18 BACK AND FORTH. IF YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT 2005 TO 2007, 18 BEEN '99. 19 FOR INSTANCE, TO STAY THERE I THINE WOULD BE BETTER FOR 09:45:13 19 Q BY MR, RUBINER: SO APPROXIMATELY 199B OR 1999 20 MY MEMORY. 20 YOU STOPPED WORKING WITH PC INVESTMENTS; IS THAT RIGHT? 39:45:13 21 MY RECOLLECTION WAS THAT EITHER I WOULD FIND A 09:45:13 21 A I THINK THAT'S RIGHT, YEAH. 22 SITE OR BEN KAPLAN WOULD FIND A SITE. WE WOULD 09:45:13 22 Q WHY DID YOU STOP WORKING WITH PC INVESTMENTS? 23 UNDERWRITE THE SITE FOR FUTURE DEVELOPMENT PLAY, WE 09:45:13 23 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 24 WOULD UNDERWRITE THE DIFFICULTIES OF ENTITLING THE SITE, 09:45:13 24 THE WITNESS: ON THE SITES WE HAD ACQUIRED, MY 25 SPECIFICALLY WHAT'S THE UNDERLYING ZONING FOLLOWED BY 25 RECOLLECTION WAS THAT CHAN DECIDED THAT ON ONE SITE WE 541 56 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818,995.2449 SHEET 15 PAGE 57 WERE GOING TO ENTITLE AND SELL TO ANOTHER DEVELOPER, ON 2 THE OTHER SITE HE WANTED TO BUY ME OUT, AND AS A YOUNG 3 MAN THE BUYOUT OF THESE SITES WAS A LOT OF MONEY AT THE 4 TIME AND I TOOK THE BUYOUT AND HE -- WE MOVED ON. 09:45:13 5 Q BY MR. RUBINER: SO DID YOU STOP WORKING WITH 6 MR. CHAN AFTER THOSE BUYOUTS? 09:15:13 7 A WE NEVER DID ANOTHER DEAL THAT I RECALL, THAT'S 8 CORRECT. 09:45:13 9 Q DID YOU BEGIN, AFTER WORKING FOR PC 10 INVESTMENTS, DID YOU START WORKING FULL TIME SOMEWHERE 11 ELSE? 09:45:13 12 A I WORKED FOR A COMPANY, I CAN'T RECALL IF IT 13 WAS FULL TIME, CALLED M&M INVESTMENTS FROM 2000 TO 2005. 09:45:13 14 Q M AND, IS IT M&M? 09:15:13 15 A RIGHT. 09:45:13 16 Q THE LETTER M? 09:45:13 17 A LIKE THE CANDY. I THINK IT'S AMPERSAND. M 18 AMPERSAND M. 01:45:13 19 Q M&M INVESTMENTS; IS THAT RIGHT? 00:45:13 20 A CORRECT. 09:15:13 21 Q AND YOU SAID THAT WAS FROM 2000 TO 2005? 09:45:13 22 A APPROXIMATELY, YES, 09:45:13 23 Q DID YOU WORE ANYWHERE FROM APPROXIMATELY 1998 24 OR '99 WHEN YOU STOPPED WORKING WITH PC INVESTMENTS AND 25 2000 WHEN YOU BEGAN WORRIED WITH M&M INVESTMENTS? 57 PAGE 59 1 13 2 3 45:13 45:13 :45:13 :45:13 :45:13 :45:13 13 13 45:13 :45:13 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A -- STRIEE THAT. DID MR. BENCHAY HAVE A TITLE WITH M&M INVESTMENTS? A I BELIEVE HE WAS THE SOLE OWNER OF HIS COMPANY, MR. RUBINER: WHY DON'T WE TAKE A FIVE-MINUTE BREAK. THE VIDEOGRAPHER: WE'RE OFF THE RECORD 11:52 A,M, (RECESS HELD), THE VIDEOGRAPHER: WE'RE ON THE RECORD 12:02 P.M, Q BY MR. RUBINER: I BELIEVE BEFORE WE TOOK A BREAK WE WERE TALKING ABOUT YOUR WORK FROM 2000 TO 2005 WITH M&M INVESTMENTS, WERE YOU EVER EMPLOYED BY M&M INVESTMENTS? A I DON'T THINK SO. Q YOU SAID THAT YOU HAD INVESTED WITH M&M INVESTMENTS IN A LARGE APARTMENT COMPLEX; IS THAT RIGHT? A CORRECT. Q HAD YOU PERSONALLY INVESTED IN THAT OR WAS THAT THROUGH AN ENTITY? A I -- MR. BISNO: OBJECTION, RIGHTS OF PRIVACY, OBJECTION. PARDON ME. OBJECTION. RIGHT TO PRIVACY. THE WITNESS: I, LIKE I SAID BEFORE, IT WAS A SYNDICATION DEAL AND I WAS THE SYNDICATOR AND HE WAS THE EQUITY. PAGE 58 PAGE 60 09: 15:13 1 A NO. 09:45:13 1 Q BY MR. 3UBINER: OKAY. 09:15:13 2 Q AND 14&M INVESTMENTS, WHAT WAS YOUR POSITION 09:45:13 2 AND WERE YOU PERSONALLY THE SYNDICATOR OR DID 3 WITH M&M INVESTMENTS? 3 YOU HAVE A, DO THAT THROUGH A COMPANY? 09:45:13 4 A I WOULDN'T SAY SO MUCH IT STARTED OUT AS A 09:45:13 4 A WE FORMED AN SPE TO ACQUIRE THE SITE. 5 POSITION, I HAD PUT UNDER CONTRACT SOME LARGE APARTMENT 09:45:13 5 Q WHAT WAS THE SPE? 6 COMPLEXES ON THE WEST SIDE OF LOS ANGELES ON ROCHESTER 09:15:13 6 A DON'T RECALL. 7 AVENUE AND I WAS SYNDICATING THE SITES TO INVESTORS AND 09:45:13 7 Q WHAT WAS THE SITE? 8 THERE WERE SEVERAL INVESTORS,. AND THE PRINCIPAL OF M&M 09:45:13 8 A IT'S ON ROCHESTER, 9 WANTED TO COME ON AND TARE THE ENTIRE INVESTMENT PIECE, 09:15:13 9 Q IF I REFER TO IY AS THE ROCHESTER SITE, WILL 10 SO WE CAME TO TERMS. 10 YOU ENOW WHAT I'M REFERRING TO? 09:45:13 11 I ACTUALLY THINK THAT WAS IN MID '99, NOW THAT 09:45:13 11 A 1 WILL. 09:45:13 12 MY MEMORY -- IT WAS IN MID '99 THAT THAT DEAL TOOK PLACE 09:45:13 12 Q DID YOU -- WHAT PERSONALLY, WHAT DID YOU, 13 AND WE CLOSED ON THE, TOGETHER CLOSED ON THE ACQUISITION 13 MR. OGULNICK, PERSONALLY DO AS IT RELATED TO THE 14 OF THE APARTMENT COMPLEXES. 14 ROCHESTER SITE? 09:45:13 15 Q WHO WAS THE PRINCIPAL THAT YOU'RE REFERRING TO? 09:45:13 15 A I ACQUIRED THE SITE UNDER MY -- STRIKE THAT. 09:45:13 16 A LEE BENCHAY. 09:45:13 16 I PLACED THE SITE UNDER CONTRACT WITH MY OWN 09:45:13 17 Q HOW DO YOU SPELL THAT? 17 CONTRACT, WITH MY OPIA FUNDS FOR A. DEPOSIT, PUT TOGETHER 09:45:13 18 A B-E-N-C-H-A-Y. 18 AN OFFERING, SENT IT OUT TO MARKET AND PUT TOGETHER THE 09:45:13 19 Q AND YOU CONTINUED TO WORK WITH M&M INVESTMENTS 19 SPE WITH THE INVESTOR, M&M INVESTMENTS, TO ACQUIRE THE 20 UNTIL 2005? 20 SITE. 09:45:13 21 A CORRECT. 09:45:13 21 Q WHEN YOU SAID YOU PUT THE SITE UNDER CONTRACT 09:45:13 22 Q OKAY, 22 UNDER YOUR OWN COMPANY, WHAT COMPANY WAS THAT? 00:45:13 23 AND DID YOU HAVE A TITLE WITH M&M INVESTMENTS? 09:45:13 23 A I BELIEVE IT WAS A DBA AT THE TIME. IT WAS NOT 09:15:13 24 A NO. 24 A FILE➢ ENTITY WITH THE STATE AID I DON'T RECALL THE 09:45:13 25 Q WHAT WAS MR, -- DID MR. BENCHAY OR BENCHAY HAVE 25 NAME OF THE DBA. 581 1 60 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 16 PAGE 61 PAGE 63 09:15:13 1 Q AND THE DBA WAS FOR YOU PERSONALLY? 1 MANAGEMENT? 09:45:13 2 A I WAS THE SOLE OWNER, IF YOU CAN BE AN OWNER OF 09:45:13 2 MR, BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 3 A USA. I'M NOT SDRE, 09:45:13 3 THE WITNESS: YES. 09:45:13 4 Q AND THIS WAS IN 1999 OR 2000 WHEN YOU OBTAINED 09:45:13 4 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHAT WERE YOUR DUTIES AND 5 THE SITE AND POT IT OUT FOR AN OFFER? 5 RESPONSIBILITIES IN YOUR INVOLVEMENT IN THE MANAGEMENT 09:15:13 6 A IT WAS '99. 6 FROM 2000 TO 2005? 09:45:13 7 Q OKAY, 09:45:13 7 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 8 DID YOU NEED TO DO ENTITLEMENT WORK ON THE 09:45:13 8 THE WITNESS: TYPICAL PROPERTY MANAGEMENT, KEEPING 9 ROCHESTER SITE AS YOU DESCRIBED EARLIER WHAT EENTITLEMENT 9 THE PROPERTY LEASED, KEEPING IT WELL 14M NTAINED, HAVING 10 WORK WAS? 10 AN ONSITE MANAGER EMPLOYED DOING HIS JOB. 09:15:13 11 A IT WAS A CONDO CONVERSION PLAY, 09:45:13 11 0 BY MR. RUBINER: ANYTHING ELSE? 09:45:13 12 Q CONVERTING CONDOMINIUMS TO APARTMENTS OR THE 09:45:13 12 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 13 OTHER WAY AROUND? 09:45:13 13 THE WITNESS: I DON'T RECALL. 09:45:13 14 A THE OTHER WAY AROUND, 09:45:13 14 Q BY MR. RUBINER: OTHER THAN THE MANAGEMENT, DID 09:45:13 15 Q CONVERTING APARTMENTS TO CONDOMINIUMS? 15 YOU HAVE ANY OTHER INVOLVEMENT WITH THE ROCHESTER SITE D9:45:13 16 A CORRECT. 16 BETWEEN 2000 AND 2005? 09:45:13 17 Q DID YQU NEED TO DO -- DID YOU PERSONALLY WORK 09:45:13 17 A I RECALL AT A CERTAIN POINT BE DECIDED HE 18 WITH THE CITY CONCERNING ANY ZONING ISSUES RELATED TO 18 WANTED TO SELL AND WE TOOK A LOOK AT SOME OFFERS AND I 19 THE ROCHESTER SITE? 19 ADVISED HIM ON THOSE OFFERS BUT NEVER, NEVER CLOSED ON 09:45:13 20 A ZONING ISN'T THE APPROPRIAIE MEANS OF DOING THE 20 THE SITE. 21 CONVERSION. IT'S DONE THROUGH THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA, 09:45:13 21 Q BUT YOU STOPPED WORKING WITH M&M IN 2005? 22 THROUGH A TENTATIVE, THEN A FINAL, THE CITY NEEDS TO 09:45:13 22 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION, RELEVANCE. 23 SIGN OFF ON THAT. BUT IT'S NOT THROUGH A CHANGE OF 09:45:13 23 Q BY MR. RUBINER: IS THAT RIGHT? 24 ZONING, THE ZONING DOESN'T CHANGE. 09:45:13 24 A NO, I WOULDN'T SAY STOPPED. LEE AND I 09:15:13 25 Q DID YOU PERSONALLY DO WORK WITH THE STATE OF 25 CONTINUED TO VET DEALS AND CONSIDER DIFFERENT 611 63 _ PAGE 62 1 CALIFORNIA -- :45:13 2 A YES. :45:13 3 Q -- CONCERNING THE CONVERSION? :45:13 4 A YES. :45:13 5 MR. BISNO: IT WOULD BE HELPFUL IF YOU ALLOWED THE 6 QUESTION TO BE COMPLETED. :15:13 7 THE WITNESS: RIGHT. :45:13 B Q BY MR. RUBINER: AND WAS THAT CONVERSION 9 ACCOMPLISHED IN 1999 OR 2000? :45:13 10 A MY RECOLLECTION IS WE NEVER FINISHED THE 11 CONVERSION BECAUSE M&M BOUGHT ME OUT AND IT'S POSSIBLE 12 THEY DID BUT IF THEY DID I DIDN'T FINISH IT AND I 13 DON'T -- MY RECOLLECTION WAS THAT THEY TOLD ME THAT THEY 14 WERE JUST GOING TO KEEP IT AS APARTMENTS, THEY DIDN'T 15 WANT TO DO CONDOS. :15:13 16 Q WHEN DID M&M BUY YOU OUT? :45:13 17 A 2000. :45:13 18 Q FROM 2000 THROUGH 2O05, DID YOU HAVE ANY 19 RESPONSIBILITIES, PERSONALLY, AS IT RELATES TO THE 20 ROCHESTER SITE? :15:13 21 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. :45:13 22 THE GIITNESS: YES. I WAS INVOLVED IN THE 23 MANAGEMENT OF THE PROPERTIES. :45:13 24 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WAS YOUR -- WAS THAT DURING 25 THE ENTIRE TIME FROM 2000 TO 2005 YOU WERE INVOLVED IN PAGE 64 1 INVESTMENTS. WE DID ACQUIRE A PIECE OF PROPERTY IN THE 2 HOLLYWOOD HILLS AND RE -ENTITLED THAT PROPERTY FOR SINGLE 3 FAMILY HOMES. i:45:13 4 Q ➢ID THE PIECE OF PROPERTY IN THE HOLLYWOOD 5 HILLS HAVE A NAME? i:15:13 6 A I ACQUIRED IT UNDER AN SEN. I BELIEVE IT WAS 7 CALLED DEEP DELL, COMMA, LLC BECAUSE THAT WAS THE STREET 8 IT WAS ON, AND LEE HAD A SMALL INVESTMENT IN THAT 9 ENTITY, :45:13 10 Q OKAY, :45:13 11 OTHER THAN YOUR RESPONSIBILITIES RELATED TO THE 12 ROCHESTER SITE, DID YOU HAVE ANY OTHER RESPONSIBILITIES 13 BETWEEN 2000 AND 2005 WITH M&M INVESTMENTS? :45:13 14 MR, BISYO: VAGUE AS TO TIME, OBJECTION, 15 RELEVANCE. :45:13 16 THE WITNESS: LEE WAS AN ELDERLY MAN APPROACHING 17 80. LEE WANTED ME TO DISPOSE OF HIS LARGE ESTATE. AT 1B ONE POINT LEE WANTED ME TO ENT-TLE AND DISPOSE OF HIS 19 ESTATE. THERE WAS A NUMBER OF PLAYS THAT WE CONSIDERED, 20 A COUPLE WE DID. IT WAS A LOT OF DIFFERENT DETAILS 21 INVOLVING HIS HOLDINGS. :45:13 22 Q BY MR. RUBINER: OKAY. :45:13 23 AND IN YOUR LAST ANSWER YOU USED THE WORD 24 "PLAYS." 4';HAT DOES THAT MEAN? :45:13 25 A TO ME, I DON'T THINK THERE'S A DEFINITE, Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 SHEET T 2 3 45:13 4 5 6 :15 13 7 :4513 8 9 45:13 10 45:13 1. 45:13 12 45:13 13 14 15 :15:13 16 17 45:13 18 45:13 19 45:13 20 21 15 13 22 45:13 23 :15 13 24 :15 13 25 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 17 PAGE 65 PAGE 67 DEFINITIVE DEFINITION BUT FOR ME YOU HAVE AN EXISTING 09:45:13 1 STRUCTURE AND IT'S UNDERUTILIZED AND YOU DETERMINE IF -- 09:45:13 2 WHAT THE HIGHEST AND BEST VALUE IS. 09:45:13 3 Q SO IN ADDITION TO YOUR WORK FOR THE ROCHESTER 09:45:13 4 SITE, YOU ASSISTED MR. BENCHAY IN MANAGING SOME OF HIS 5 PERSONAL AFFAIRS AS HE WAS GETTING OLDER -- 03:45:13 6 MR, BIEED: OBJECTION. IRRELEVANT. 09:45:13 7 Q BY MR. RUBINER: - BETWEEN 2000 AND 2005; IS 09:45:13 B THAT RIGHT? MR. BISNO: PARDON ME, OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. THE WITNESS: I THINK IT WENT TO 2005 AND INTO 2006. LEE AND I ACQUIRED ANOTHER SITE IN SANTA MONICA, APARTMENT BUILDING IN BRENTWOOD. WE DID A NUMBER OF THINGS, Q BY MR. RUBINER: AT SOMZ POINT DID YOU STOP DOING WORK WITH M&M INVESTMENTS? A I DID. Q WHEN WAS THAT? A THERE WAS SOME -- WE HAD SOME DISPUTE AND I THINK THAT WAS IN 2006. Q YOU HAD A DISPUTE WITH MR, BENCHAY? A YES. Q WHAT WAS THE NATURE OF THE DISPUTE? MR. BISKO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE, 45:13 45:13 45:13 15 13 45:13 45:13 45:13 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 25 Q NOW, YOU SAID YOU GOT SUED PERSONALLY? MR. HISAO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE, THE WITNESS: YES. Q BY MR. RUBINER: ➢O YOU RECALL WHERE THAT LAWSUIT WAS FILED? MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. THE WITNESS: LA COUNTY. Q BY MR. RUBINER: DO YOU RECALL WHAT THE CLAIMS WERE AGAINST YOU? A NO. Q DO YOU RECALL IF THERE WAS A CLAIM THAT YOU MADE FALSE STATEMENTS? A T DON'T RECALL. Q DO YOU RECALL WHO THE PARTY WAS THAT SUED YOU? A DARREN WEINGARTEN. Q DID YOU KNOW MR. WEINGARTEN PRIOR TO BEING SUED BY HIM? A YES, Q DO YOU RECALL WHAT THE CONTEXT WAS THAT YOU :4E'. MR. WEINGARTEN? MR, BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. THE WITNESS: HE WAS A FRIEND OF MY BROTHER'S. Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID MR. WEINGARTEN INVEST IN MR. KAPLAN'S SEAFOOD BUSINESS? A HE -- PAGE 66 PAGE 68 D9:45:13 1 THE WITNESS: GO AHEAD AND ANSWER? 09:45:13 1 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION, RELEVANCE, 09:45:13 2 MR. BISNO: YEAH, YOU CAN ANSWER. 09:45:13 2 THE WITNESS: HE DID, 09:15:13 3 THE WITNESS: LEWIS KAFTAN, WHO I HAD MENTIONED TO 09:45:13 3 Q BY MR, RUBINER: DID YOU INTRODUCE 4 YOU BEFORE, WAS LEE BENCHAY'S SON-IN-LAW. LEE 4 MR. WEINGARTEN TO MR. EAPLAN? 5 INTRODUCED ME TO LEWIS. LEWIS WAS SHIPPING SOME SORT OF 09:45:13 5 MR, BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE, 6 PRODUCE AND SEAFOOD TO VEGAS, 09:45:13 6 THE WITNESS: I DID. 09:15:13 7 LEE SAID I WANT YOU TO INVEST WITH ME IN THIS 09:45:13 7 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID MR. WEINGARTEN EVER TELL 8 THING AND WE DID A NUMBER OF DEALS IN WHICH WE BOTH PUT 8 YOU THAT HE BELIEVED YOU -- STRIKE THAT. 9 UP MONEY, WE'D GET A RETURN. I THINE WE DID TWO OF 09:45:13 9 DO YOU RECALL WHAT THE RESULT OF THE LAWSUIT 10 THEM. THE RETURNS WERE ALMOST TOO GOOD TO BE TRUE AND 10 WAS? 11 EVENTUALLY THE LAST INVESTMENT DIDN'T COME BACK. 09:45:13 11 MR, BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE, 09:15:13 12 IT WAS LEE'S FAMILY. LEE AND I SUED LEWIS, WE 09:45:13 12 THE WITNESS: I BELIEVE MR. WEINGARTEN HAD PUT IN 13 GOT A JUDGMENT. WE BEGAN COLLECTING. AND ONE OF THE 13 TO THE DEAL $12,000. HIS STEPFATHER WAS All AGGRESSIVE 14 INVESTORS WOUND UP SLING ME BECAUSE THEY SAID I TOLD 14 ATTORNEY AND WE DECIDED TO JUST PAY THE $12,000 BACK. 15 THEM ABOUT LEWIS KAPLAN AND HIS COMPANY UNITED FOODS AND 09:45:13 15 Q BY MR, RUBINER: WHEN YOU SAY "WE," WHO IS THE 16 SO I WAS NO. 12 OF 12 DIFFERENT SUITS. 16 'WE" YOU'RE REFERRING TO? 09:45:13 17 LEE GOT CALLED IN TO A DEPOSITION. HE THOUGHT 09:45:13 17 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 18 I SHOULD PAY FOR IT BECAUSE HE HAD WARNED ME THAT THE 09:15:13 18 THE WITNESS: AT THE TIME IT WAS J. T. FOX AS MY 19 ONLY WAY THIS WOULD WORK PROPERLY IS IF HE CONTROLLED 19 ATTORNEY ADVISED ME IT WAS THE RIGHT THING TO DO. 20 MR. KAPLAN AND SD HE WAS NOT PLEASED THAT SOMEBODY WAS 09:45:13 20 Q BY MR. RUBINER: I'M NOT ASKING YOU -- I 21 INTRODUCED TO LEWIS AND EITHER HE - I DON'T REMEMBER IF 21 UNDERSTAND THAT YOU JUST DISCLOSED TO ME YOUR 22 HE DIDN'T KNOW ABOUT IT OR JUST OBJECTED TO IT AND SO HE 22 COMMUNICATION WITH MR, FOX, BUT WHEN I -- I'LL CAUTION 23 WANTED ME TO PAY HIS LEGAL FEES, AND SO I SAID I DON'T 23 YOU AS YOUR COUNSEL WILL, AS WELL, TO NOT DISCUSS WITH 24 THINK THAT WAS FAIR AND THAT SORT OF SPOILED THE 24 ME YOUR COMMUNICATIONS WITH YOUR COUNSEL WHETHER IT'S IN 25 RELATIONSHIP. 25 THIS CASE OR ANY OTHER CASE. 661 68 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 18 PAGE 69 PAGE 71 0 9 : 45:13 1 OTHER THAN YOU AND -- STRIKE THAT, 1 WITH M&M INVESTMENTS, RAVE Y09 HAD ANY OTHER EMPLOYMENT? 09:45:13 2 WERE YOU THE ONLY PERSON SUED? 09:45:13 2 MR. BISND: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. DEJECTION• 09:45:13 3 MR. BISND: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 3 VAGUE AS TO TIME. 09:45:13 4 THE WITNESS: I DON'T RECALL. 09:15:13 4 THE WITNESS: NO. 09:45:13 5 Q BY MR. ROSINED: DO YOU STILL HAVE A 09:45:13 5 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID YOU BEGIN WORKING BY 6 RELATIONSHIP TODAY WITH MR. WEINGARTEN? 6 YOURSELF IN 2005 OR 20067 09:45:13 7 MR, BISND: OBJECTION• RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 7 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 8 THE WITNESS: 10. 09:45:13 8 THE WITNESS: MYSELF IN THE SENSE THAT I AM A SOLE 09:45:13 9 Q BY MR. RUBINER: OTHER THAN MR. WEINGARTEN, DID 9 PROPRIETOR, NO. IN THE SENSE THAT I WAS NOT EMPLOYED BY 10 ANYONE ELSE -- STRIKE THAT. 10 A COMPANY, YES. VARIOUS ENTITIES WERE FORMED TO PURSUE 09:45:13 11 NOW, YOU SAID MR. KAPLAN WAS INVOLVED IN THE 11 REAL ESTATE VENTURES. 12 SEAFOOD BUSINESS; IS THAT RIGHT? 00:45:13 12 Q BY MR. RUBINER: SO FROM 20D5 OR 2006 TILL NOW, 09:45:13 13 MR. BISND: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 13 HAVE YOU WORKED IN ANY BUSINESS OTHER THAN REAL ESTATE? 09:45:13 14 THE WITNESS: CORRECT. 09:45:13 14 MR. BISND: OBJECTION• RELEVANCE. OBJECTTDN. 09:45:13 15 Q BY MR. RUBINER: OKAY. 15 PRIVACY. 09:45:13 16 AND WAS IT LOBSTER THAT HE WAS INVOLVED WITH? 09:15:13 16 THE WITNESS: NO. 09:45:13 11 MR. BISND: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 17 Q BY MR. RUBINER: NOW, EARLIER WE TALKED ABOUT A 09:15:13 18 THE WITNESS: I THINK HE WAS INVOLVED IN A LOT OF 18 CO;•1PAKY, I THINK, VINEYARDS DEVELOPME17 CORPORATION; IS 19 DIFFERENT SEAFOODS AND PRODUCE. 19 'HAT RIGHT? 09:15:13 20 Q BY MR. RUBINER: AND OTHER THAN MR. WEINGARTEN, 09:45:13 20 A UH-HUH. 21 DID YOU BRING OTHER INVESTORS IN TO INVEST IN 09:45:13 21 Q THAT'S A YES? 22 MR. KAPLAN'S BUSINESS? 09:15:13 22 A YES. 09:45:13 23 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 23 Q AND YOU, I BELIEVE YOU SAID -- WHAT'S YOUR 09:45:13 24 THE WITNESS: NOT ME PERSONALLY. 24 POSITION WITH VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION? 09:45:13 25 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHAT WAS YOUR 09:45:13 25 A CEO. 69 PAGE 70 PAGE 72 1 INVOLVEMENT -- STRIKE THAT. 09:45:13 I Q HAVE YOU ALWAYS BEEN THE CEO OF VINEYARDS 09:15:13 2 DO YOU REMEMBER THE COMPANY NAME THAT 2 DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION? 3 MR. KAPLAN WORKED WITH? 09:45:13 3 A CORRECT. D9:45:13 4 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:15:13 4 Q IS THERE A COMPANY CALLED VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT 01:45:13 5 THE WITNESS: UNITED FOODS. 5 INCORPORATED? 09:45:13 6 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID YOU INVEST IN UNITED 09:45:13 6 A THEY'RE ONE IN THE SAME. 7 FOODS? 09:15:13 7 Q SO YOU'RE THE CEO OF THAT COMPANY? 09:45:13 8 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE, OBJECTION• 09:45:13 8 A CORRECT. 9 PRIVACY. 09:45:13 9 Q AND MISS FLANNP.GAN OR MISS DGULNICK, DEPENDING 09:45:13 10 INSOFAR AS TEAT REVEALS PERSONAL INFORMATION 10 ON TIME, IS THE, IS OR WAS THE CFO OF THE COMPANY; IS 11 ABOUT YOURSELF AS OPPOSED TO AN SPE, I AM DIRECTING YOU 11 THAT RIGHT? 12 NOT TO ANSWER. 09:45:13 12 MR. BISND: OBJECTION• ASKED AND ANSWERED. 09:45:13 13 THE WITNESS: WE INVESTED IN UNITED FOODS FOR THE 09:45:13 13 THE WITNESS: DO I RESPOND AFTER YOU SAID THAT? 14 LAST INVESTMENT WHICH WAS THE INVESTMENT THAT DID NOT 09:45:13 14 MR. BISNO: YES. YES, YOU MAY RESPOND. 15 C014E BACK, THE INVESTMENT WHICH WE SUED ON AND RECEIVED 09:45:13 15 THE WITNESS: CORRECT, 16 JUDGMENT AGAINST MR. KAPLAN AND UNITED FOODS, 09:15:13 16 Q BY MR. RUBINER: AND ARE THERE ANY EMPLOYEES 09:45:13 17 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHEN YOU SAY "WE," WHO IS THE 17 OTHER -- STRIKE THAT. 18 WE YOU WERE -- WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY "WE"? 09:45:13 18 DOES VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT INCORPORATED HAVE 09:45:13 19 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 19 ANY EMPLOYEES? 09:45:13 20 THE WITNESS: LEE BENCHAY AND MYSELF SUED LEWIS 09:45:13 20 MR. BISND: OBJECTION. ASKED AND ANSWERED. i 21 KAPLAN. 09:45:13 21 THE WITNESS: NO. 09:45:13 22 Q BY MR. RUBINER: FOLLOWING -- IN 2005 YOU SAID 09:45:13 22 Q BY MR. RUBINER: OTHER THAN VINEYARDS 23 YOU -- OR 'SIX YOU STOPPED WORKING WITH M&M INVESTMENTS• 23 DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION AND VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT 24 HAVE YOU EVER BEEN EMPLOYED BY ANY OTHER -- STRIKE THAT. 24 INCORPORATED, ARE YOU CURRENTLY THE CEO OF ANY OTHER 09:15:13 25 SINCE 2005 OR 2006 WHEN YOU STOPPED WORKING 25 COMPANIES? 10 12 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 19 PAGE 73 PAGE 75 09:45:13 1 A N0, 09:45:13 1 )WHEREUPON, THE ABOVE -MENTIONED DOCUMENT WAS 09:45:13 2 Q ARE YOU FAMILIAR WITH THE A COMPANY CALLED 2 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION BY THE SHORTHAND REPORTER AND 3 VD — VDB? 3 ATTACHED HERETO). 09:45:13 4 A YES. 09:45:13 4 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DO YOU GAVE EXHIBIT 4 IN FRONT 09:45:13 5 Q AND WHAT -- DO YOU HAVE A POSITION WITH VDB? 5 OF YOU, SIR? 09:45:13 6 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RIGHT TO PRIVACY. 09:45:13 6 A I DO. 09:41:13 7 YOU MAY ANSWER THAT QUESTION, I WILL MOST 09:45:13 7 Q CAN YOU "AKE A MOMENT AND REVIEW EXHIBIT 4. 8 LIKELY OBJECT TO THE NEXT ONE, 8 LET ME KNOW WHEN YOU'VE FINISHED. 09:15:13 9 THE WITNESS: YES. 09:45:13 9 A OKAY. 09:45:13 10 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHAT'S YOUR POSITION? 09:45:13 10 Q HAVE YOU EVER SEEN EXHIBIT 4 BEFORE? 09:45:13 11 A MANAGER. 09:45:13 11 A NO. 01:45:13 12 Q MANAGER? 09:45:13 12 Q EXHIBIT 4 IS TITLED 'ORGANIZATIONAL CHART.' 09:15:13 13 A UH-HUH, 09:45:13 13 DO YOU SEE THAT? 09:15:13 14 Q AND WHAT BUSINESS IS VDB IN? 09:45:13 14 A YES. 09:15:13 15 A ENTITLING AN ORANGE COUNTY SITE AND THE 09:45:13 15 Q OKAY. 16 SUBSEQUENT DEVELOPMENT OF THE SITE FOR 271 APARTMENT 09:45:13 16 AND IT APPEARS TO BE AN ORGANIZATIONAL CHART AS 17 UNITS. 17 IT RELATES TO VDC AT THE MET. IS EXHIBIT 4 AN ACCURATE D9:45:13 18 Q AND WAS THE ORANGE COUNTY SITE ORIGINALLY 18 CHART OF THE OWNERSHIP OF VDC AT THE MET, AS YOU 19 CALLED GENEV.A COMMONS? 19 UNDERSTAND IT? 09:45:13 20 A CORRECT. 09:45:13 20 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION, VAGUE AS TO TIME. 09:15:13 21 Q AND IS IT, THE ORANGE COUNTY SITE NOW CALLED 09:45:13 21 Q BY MR, RUBINER: AS OF RIGHT NOW. 22 VDC AT THE MET? 09:45:13 22 A YES, 09:45:13 23 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION, VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS. 01:45:13 23 Q 30 VDC, IF I REFER TO — WELL, IF I REFER TO 24 ANSWER IF YOU CAN. 24 VDC AT THE MET LLC AS VDC AT THE MET, WILL YOU KNOW WHAT 09:45:13 25 THE WITNESS: I THINK TT HAS SEVERAL NAMES. 25 I'M TALKING ABOUT? 731 15 PAGE 74 PAGE 76 09:45:13 1 Q BY MR. RUBINER: ARE YOU FAMILIAR WITH A 09:45:13 1 A YES, 2 COMPANY CALLED VDC AT THE MET? 09:45:13 2 Q SO ONE OF THE MEMBERS ON THIS CHART IS VDB. 09:45:13 3 A YES. 09:45:13 3 DO YOU SEE THAT? 09:15:13 4 Q DO YOU HAVE A POSITION WITH VDC AT THE MET? 09:45:13 4 A YES. 09:45:13 5 A YES, 09:45:13 5 Q DOES VDB HAVE -- IS IT AN LLC; DO YOU KNOW? 09:15:13 6 Q WHAT'S YOUR POSITION? 09:45:13 6 A YES. 09:45:13 7 A MANAGER. 09:45:13 7 Q 50 IT SHOULD BE VDB LLC IS ITS FULL NAME; IS 09:45:13 8 Q ARE THERE ANY OTHER MANAGERS AT VDC AT THE MET? 8 THAT RIGHT? 04:45:13 9 A YES, 09:45:13 9 A YEAH, I THINK SO. 09:45:13 10 Q WHO ARE THEY? 09:45:13 10 Q AND YOU'RE A MEMBER OF VDB LLC; IS THAT RIGHT? 09:15:13 11 A A GROUP CALLED ILUS, 09:45:13 11 A YES. 09:45:13 12 Q ANYONE ELSE? 09:45:13 12 Q OKAY. 09:45:13 13 A NO. 09:45:13 13 ARE THERE ANY OTHER MEMBERS OF VDB LLC? 09:45:13 14 MR, RUBINER: I'M GOING TO ASK THE COURT REPORTER 09:45:13 14 A NO, 15 TO MARK AS EXHIBIT -- CAN WE GO OFF THE RECORD JUST ONE 09:45:13 15 Q AND ARE YOU A MEMBER, ARE YOU, RYAN OGULNICK, A 16 SECOND? 16 MEMBER OF VDB LLC OR IS THERE AN ENTITY THAT HAS THE 09:45:13 11 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: WE'RE OFF THE RECORD 12:23 P.M. 17 MEMBERSHIP IN VDB LLC? 09:45:13 1B (RECESS HELD). 09:45:13 18 MR, BISNO: I'M GOING TO OBJECT ON THE GROUNDS OF 09:45:13 19 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: WE'RE ON THE RECORD 12:24 P.M. 19 PRIVACY BUT NOT IF YOU ARE A MEMBER THROUGH AN ENTITY, 09:45:13 20 MR. RUBINER: I'D LIKE TO MARK AS EXHIBIT 4 A 20 BUT IF YOU ARE A MEMBER PERSONALLY I'M GOING TO OBJECT 21 ONE -PAGE DOCUMENT THAT ACTUALLY HAS THE TITLE EXHIBIT A, 21 ON THE GROUNDS OF PRIVACY AND INSTRUCT YOU NOT TO 22 ORGANIZATIONAL CHART, AND ASK THE COURT REPORTER TO HAND 09:45:13 22 ANSWER. 23 THAT TO THE WITNESS. 09:15:13 23 THE WITNESS: I HONESTLY DON'T -- 09:45:13 24 MR. BISNO: THANK YOU. 09:45:13 24 MR, RUBINER: I THINK THAT WAS MY QUESTION AS TO 09:45:13 25 111 25 HOW IS HE A MEMBER OF IT. 19 ,a Dalesandro vs. Ogulmck Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 20 PAGE 77 09:15:13 1 THE WITNESS: I HONESTLY DON'T KNOW. I DON'T KNOW 2 IF IT'S ME PERSONALLY OR IF IT'S A COMPANY. 09:45:13 3 Q BY MR. RUBINER: OKAY. 09:15:13 4 AND DO YOU HAVE, DO YOU PERSONALLY HAVE ANY 5 DUTIES AND RESPONSIBILITIES FOR VDC AT THE MET? 09:15:13 6 A YES. 09:45:13 7 Q WHAT ARE THEY? 09:45:13 8 A IT WAS TO ACQUIRE -- STRIKE THAT. 09:45:13 9 IT WAS TO -- INITIALLY, I PLACED THE PROPERTY 10 UNDER CONTRACT, I PUT A S200,000 DEPOSIT DOWN. I THEN 11 SPENT THE NEXT SEVERAL MONTHS WITH PRELIMINARY 12 ENTITLEMENT WORK, AN APPLICATION TO THE CITY, HIRING OF 13 ANY AND ALL CONSULTANTS, THIRD -PARTY CONSULTANTS, 14 CAPITALIZING THE DEAL TO ACQUIRE THE SITE, 140VING THE '.. 15 SITE THROUGH THE DISCRETIONARY PROCESS WITH THE CITY OF 16 SANTA ANA. 09:15:13 17 MR. DISKO: COUNSEL, IT IS 12:29 AND A HALF. 09:45:13 18 MR. RUBINER: OKAY. 09:45:13 19 LET ME JUST ASK A FEW MORE QUESTIONS. 09:45:13 20 Q ANYTHING ELSE? D9:45:13 21 A YES, 09:45:13 22 Q WHAT ELSE? 09:15:13 23 A IT WAS MOVING THE ENTITY THROUGH CITY COUNCIL 24 AND EVENTUALLY A LIQUIDATION EVENT. 09:45:13 25 Q DO YOU HAVE ANY OTHER DUTIES AND 77 _ PAGE 78 1 45:13 2 3 45:13 4 45:13 5 45:13 6 7 4 5: 13 45;13 45:13 8 9 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 RESPONSIBILITIES FOR VDC AT THE MET LLC? MR. BISNO: OBJECTION.. VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS. OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. THE WITNESS: YES. Q BY MR. RUBINER: AND WHAT ARE THEY? A THE SITE WAS CONDITIONED THAT RYAN OGULNICK PERSONALLY AND MY COMPANY MUST DEVELOP THE SITE AS VESTED AND DETERMINED IN THE DEVELOPMENT AGREEMENT. SO THERE, THE ONLY PATH TO PROCEED IS THROUGH A DEVELOPMENT OF THE ENTITLEMENTS VESTED THROUGH THE CITY OF SANTA ANA. MR. BISNO: COUNCIL, I WILL NOW WANT TO TAKE A BREAK. IT'S 12:31 AND I HAD SET UP A 12:30 CONFERENCE CALL BASED ON OUR EARLIER UNDERSTANDING WE WERE GOING TO BREAK AT 12:30. MR, RUBINER: THAT'S FINE, CAN WE STARS AGAIN AT 1:15? MR. BISNO: THAT'S FINE. THE VIDEOGRAPHER: WE'RE OFF THE RECORD 12:30 P.M. (LONCH RECESS). THE VIDEOGRAPHER: WE'RE ON THE RECORD 1:23 P.M. MR. RUBINER: LET'S GO BACK ON THE RECORD. WE ARE ON THE RECORD. Q YOU UNDERSTAND YOU'RE STILL UNDER OATH? A YES. PAGE 79 09:45:13 1 Q DO YOU KNOW STEVE GILFENBAIN? 09:45:13 2 A YES, 09:45:13 3 Q WHEN DID YOU FIRST MEET STEVE GILFENBAIN? 09:45:13 4 MR, BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 5 THE WITNESS: 1999, 09:45:13 6 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHAT WERE THE CIRCUMSTANCES? 09:45:13 7 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 8 THE WITNESS: HE WAS LOOKING AT INVESTING IN A DEAL 9 OR TWO THAT I WAS THE LEAD DEVELOPER ON. 09:45:13 10 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHERE WERE YOU WORKING WHEN 11 YOU MET MR. GILFENBAIN? 09:45:13 12 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:15:13 13 THE WITNESS: I THINK, IN THE INCEPTION IT WAS !*M 14 INVESTMENTS. 09:45:13 15 Q BY MR, RUBINER: DO YOU RECALL EVER HAVING A 15 CONVERSATION WITH MR. GILFENBAIN WHERE YOU DISCUSSED 17 YOUR EDUCATION? 09:45:13 16 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. 19 OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 20 THE WITNESS: NO. 09:45:13 21 Q BY M.R. RUBINER: DO YOU RECALL EVER TELLING 22 MR. GILFENBAIN ABOUT ANY REAL ESTATE PROJECTS YOU HAD 23 WORKED ON? 09:45:13 24 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. 25 OBJECTION. RELEVANCE, 79 PAGE 80 09:45:13 1 THE WITNESS: MO. 09:45:13 2 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID YOU EVER GO INTO BUSINESS 3 WITH MR. GILFENBAIN? 09:45:13 4 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION, RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 5 THE WITNESS: YES. 09:45:13 6 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHEN WAS THAT? 09:45:13 7 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE, 09:45:13 8 THE WITNESS: 2003, 09:45:13 9 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WAS THAT IN A REAL ESTATE 10 PROJECT? 09:45:13 11 A YES. 09:45:13 12 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 13 Q BY MR, RUBINER: WHAT REAL ESTATE PROJECT 'WAS 14 THAT? 09:45:13 15 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:15:13 16 THE WITNESS: IT WAS A -- TO ENTITLE A DEVELOPMENT 17 SITE IN LOS ANGELES. 09:45:13 18 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DO YOU RECALL THE NAPE OF 19 THE -- WHERE THE SITE WAS? 09:45:13 20 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 21 COUNSEL, YOU'RE ASKING ABOUT A 2003 22 TRANSACTION? 39:45:13 23 MR. RUBIKER: YES. I'M ASKING ABOUT HIS WORK WITH 24 MR. GILFENBAIN WHO HE LATER WENT INTO PARTNERSHIP WITH 25 AT PALM DESERT, AT LEAST I UNDERSTAND, AND WHO HE, IN BO Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Oguhuck, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 SHEET I 13 2 4 5: 13 4 S 6 45:13 7 15 13 8 45:13 9 10 11 45:13 12 45t13 13 14 45:13 15 45:13 17 4 5: 13 18 19 20 21 45:13 22 45:13 23 45:13 24 45:13 25 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 21 PAGE 81 - PAGE 83 - ADDITION TO MAKING VARIOUS MISREPRESENTATIONS TO MY CLIENTS AND PERHAPS OTHERS, HE ALSO MADE MISREPRESENTATIONS TO MR. GILFENBAIN. IT'S CLEARLY REASONABLY CALCULATED TO LEAD TO THE DISCOVERY OF ADMISSI31E EVIDENCE CONCERNING ISSUES IN THIS CASE OR YOUR CLIENT'S CREDIBILITY OR MR. GILFENBAIN'S CREDIBILITY, MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. TO MAKE SURE THE RECORD FAIRLY REFLECTS, YOU'RE ASKING ABOUT A 2003 TRANSACTION BASED ON MY CLIENT'S PREVIOUS TESTIMONY. YOU MAY ANSWER. THE WITNESS: I BELIEVE IT WAS A SITE IN THE HOLLYWOOD VICINITY. Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID YOU, IN FACT, DEVELOP A SITE IN THE HOLLYWOOD VICINITY WITH MR. GILFENBAIN? MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. COUNSEL, YOU'RE ASKING ABOUT A 2003 TRANSACTION IN NOT A WAY WHICH WOULD HAVE ANYTHING TO ➢O WITH A REPRESENTATION AS YOU PREVIOUSLY LAID OUT THAT MY CLIENT MAY OR MY NOT HAVE MADE. 45:13 45:13 45:13 4 5: 13 45:13 45:13 :45:13 Q BY MR. RUBINER: YOU CAN ANSWER THE QUESTION. I I09:45:13 A I BOUGHT MR. GILFENBAIN OUT OF THE PROJECT. 09:45:13 Q WHAT WAS THE PROJECT? 09:45:13 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 1 MEMBER OR A COMPANY OF YOURS WAS A MEMBER? 2 A INITIALLY IT WAS ME. 3 Q AND SUBSEQUENT DID THAT CHANGE? 4 A YES. 5 Q WHAT DID IT CHANGE TO? 6 A IT WAS ASSIGNED TO VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT, INC. 7 Q AND VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT, INC., WAS THE 8 COMPANY YOU DISCUSSED THIS MORNING? 9 A CORRECT. 10 Q AND I BELIEVE, AM I CORRECT THAT VINEYARDS 11 DEVELOPMENT, INC., AND VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION 12 ARE THE SAME COMPANY? IS THAT CORRECT? 13 MR, BISNO: OBJECTION. ASKED AND ANSWERED. 14 YOU MAY ANSWER. 15 THE WITNESS: YES. 16 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHAT OWNERSHIP INTEREST IN 17 SINATRA COOK ➢ID YOU HAVE? 18 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION, RIGHT OF PRIVACY INSOFAR AS 19 IT RELATES TO YOU PERSONALLY. IF IT RELATES TO AN 20 ENTITY, IF THE QUESTION WERE REPHRASED, I WOULDN'T HAVE 21 AN OBJECTION. 22 Q BY MR. RUBINER: YOU CAN ANSWER THE QUESTION. 23 MR. BISNO: YOU CAN ANSWER THE QUESTION. 24 THE WITNESS: FROM THE INCEPTION I HAD 25 PERCENT, 25 FORDP.R HAD 25 PERCENT, STEVE GILFENBAIN HAD 50 PERCENT, PAGE 82 PAGE 84 09:45:13 1 THE WITNESS: IT WAS A SINGLE-FAMILY HOME PROJECT 1 EACH ONE OF US HAD ONE-THIRD VOTING RIGHTS. TWO-THIRDS, 2 AND AFTER ENTITLEMENTS I BOUGHT HIM OUT, 2 OF COURSE, WAS REQUIRED ON ANY AND ALL DECISIONS. 09:45:13 3 Q BY MR. ROBINER: DID YOU ENTER INTO ANY OTHER 3 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID YOU HAVE DUTIES AND 4 BUSINESS TRANSACTIONS WITH MR. GILFENBAIN? 4 RESPONSIBILITIES AS IT RELATES TO SINATRA COOK? D9:45:13 S MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. 09:45:13 5 A YEAH, 6 OBJECTION. RELEVANCE, 09:45:13 6 Q WHAT WERE THEY? 09:15:13 7 THE WITNESS: WE ACQUIRED A SITE IN THE COUNTY OF 09:45:13 7 MR, BISNO: OBJECTION, THE DOCUMENT DESCRIBING THE 8 RIVERSIDE IN THE CITY OF PALM DESERT IN 2005, 20.1 GROSS 8 DUTIES SPEAKS FOR ITSELF AS THE BEST EVIDENCE, MY 9 ACRES, 19.6 NEI ACRES, TO BUILD 250 APARTMENTS AND A 9 CLIENT IS NOT AN ATTORNEY AND TO ASK HIM A QUESTION AS 10 40,000-SQUARE FOOT SHOPPING CENTER. 10 TO HIS DUTIES REQUIRES HE GIVE YOU HIS OPINION WHICH 09:45:13 11 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHEN YOU SAY "WE," WHO IS THE 11 IMPLICATES LEGAL TRAINING, AND TO THE EXTENT THAT YOU 12 WE YOU'RE REFERRING TO? 12 CAN NOT ANSWER THAT QUESTION WITHOUT RELAYING 09:15:13 13 A STEVE AND MYSELF. 13 INFORMATION YOU'VE RECEIVED FROM YOUR COUNSEL T DIRECT 09:15:13 14 Q AND DID YOU INVEST IN A -- WAS IT A COMPANY 14 YOU NOT TO ANSWER IT. 15 THAT PURCHASED THE PROPERTY? 09:45:13 15 Q BY MR, RUBINER: YOU CAN ANSWER THE QUESTION. 09:45:13 16 A YES. 09:45:13 16 A I -- I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THE QUESTION. 09:45:13 17 Q WHAT WAS THE NAME OF THE PROPERTY? 09:45:13 17 Q DID YOU HAVE AN UNDERSTANDING AS TO WHAT YOU D9:45:13 18 A SINATRA COOK PROJECT LLC, 09:15:13 18 WERE SUPPOSED TO DO FOR SINATRA COON? 09:45:13 19 Q WERE YOU A MEMBER OF SINATRA COOK LLC? 09:45:13 19 A I THINK THE DOCUMENTS SPOKE FOR THEMSELVES. 09:15:13 20 A YES. 20 OTHER THAN A PARTNERSHIP AGREEMENT THERE WAS A 09:45:13 21 Q WHO WERE THE OTHER MEMBERS? 21 DEVELOPMENT SERVICES FEE AGREEMENT SIGNED BY THE 09:45:13 22 A FORDAR LLC AND RANCHO MIRAGE TRUST. IT WAS 22 PARTNERSHIP TO ME OR MY COMPANY -- I DON'T RECALL -- 23 STEVE GILFENBAIN'S TRUST. 23 WHICH OUTLINED WHAT I WAS SUPPOSED TO DO. 09:15:13 24 Q AND WHAT WERE YOUR DUTIES -- WERE YOU THE, WHEN 09:45:13 24 Q SO YOU HAVE NO UNDERSTANDING AS YOU SIT HERE 25 YOU SAY YOU WERE A MEMBER, WAS IT YOU PERSONALLY WAS A 25 NOW AS TO WHAT YOUR DUTIES AND RESPONSIBILITIES WERE AT 821 84 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 - SHEET 22 PAGE 85 PAGE 87 1 SINATRA COOK; IS THAT RIGHT? 09:45:13 1 THE WITNESS: NO. :45:13 2 MR. BISND: OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT THAT ANSWERING 09:45:13 2 Q BY MR, RUBINER: DID YOU INVEST 25 PERCENT OF 3 THIS QUESTION WOULD DISCLOSE INFORMATION YOU RECEIVED 3 THE FUNDS NECESSARY TO CREATE SINATRA COOK? 4 FROM YOUR COUNSEL OR ANY ONE OF YOUR COUNSEL. TO THE 09:45:13 4 MR. BISND: OBJECTION, PRIVACY. 5 EXTENT YOU CANNOT ANSWER THIS QUESTION WITHOUT 09:45:13 5 THE WITNESS: I DON'T RECALL THE SPECIFIC MATH BUT 6 DISCLOSING INFORMATION YOU HAVE RECEIVED FROM YOUR 09:45:13 6 110, I WOULD SAY THAT'S NOT ACCURATE. 7 COUNSEL, I DIRECT YOU NOT TO ANSWER IT. 09:45:13 7 Q BY MR. RUBINER: SO WHAT, WHEN YOU SAY IT'S NOT :45:13 B THE WITNESS: I CANNOT ANSWER THE QUESTION. B ACCURATE, WHAT'S INACCURATE ABOUT IT? :15:13 9 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID YOU HAVE A DISCUSSION WITH 09:45:13 9 A I DON'T KNOW THAT THE CAPITAL CONTRIBUTIONS 10 MR. GILFENBAIN UPON THE CREATION OF SINATRA COOK AS TO 10 WERE DIRECTLY TIED TO THE OWNERSHIP PERCENTAGE, 11 THE CREATION OF THE ENTITY? 09:45:13 11 Q DID YOU MAKE ANY CAPITAL CONTRIBUTION TO :45:13 12 A 100 VAGUE, I DON'T RECALL THAT. 12 SINATRA COOK? :45:13 13 Q YOU DON'T RECALL THAT? 09:45:13 13 A YES. :45:13 14 A NO, 09A5:13 14 Q PRIOR TO ENTERING INTO THE SINATRA COOK :45:13 15 Q DO YOU RECALL EVER :HAVING A DISCUSSION 91ITH 15 TRANSACTION, DID YOU TELL MR. GILFENBAIN THAT YOU WERE 16 MR. GILFENBAIN ABOUT WHAT YOUR DUTIES WOULD BE AS IT 16 AFFLUENT? 17 RELATES TO SINATRA COOK? 09:45:13 17 A NO. :15:13 18 MR, BISND: OBJECTION. ASKED AND ANSWERED, MY 09:45:13 18 Q DID YOU TELL MR. GILFENBAIN THAT YOU HAD 19 CLIENT HAS ANSWERED THAT QUESTION AND YOUR PREVIOUS 19 EXPERIENCE IN BUILDING APARTMENT BUILDINGS? 20 QUESTION. 09:45:13 20 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. HEARSAY. OBJECTION. :45:13 21 THE WITNESS: THERE WERE CONVERSATIONS, HUNDREDS. 21 RELEVANCE. 22 T DON'T RECALL SPECIFICALLY ONE SPECIFIC CONVERSATION. 09:45:13 22 THE WITNESS: I DON'T RECALL. :15:13 23 Q BY MR. RUBINER: ➢O YOU RECALL ANY 09:45:13 23 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID YOU EVER SAY ANYTHING 24 CONVERSATIONS WHERE YOU AND MR. GILFENBAIN WOULD DISCUSS 24 UNTRUTHFUL TO MR. GILFENBAIN? 25 WHAT YOU WOULD DO AS IT RELATES TO SINATRA COOK? 09:4$:13 25 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. HEARSAY. _ PAGE 86 PAGE 88 09: 45:13 1 MR. BISND: OBJECTION. ASKED AND ANSWERED. 09:45:13 1 THE WITNESS: NO, 09:45:13 2 THE WITNESS: NOT ONE SPECIFIC QUESTION, NO. 09:45:13 2 MR, RUBINER: COUNSEL,BY THE WAY, HEARSAY IS NOT A 09:45:13 3 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DO YOU RECALL GENERALLY WHAT 3 PROPER OBJECTION AT DEPOSITION AND COMING OUT OF HIS 4 YOU AND MR. GILFENBAIN DISCUSSED AS IT RELATES TO 4 MOUTH IT WOULDN'T BE HEARSAY, ANYWAY. BUT, YOU KNOW, 5 SINATRA COOK? 5 I'M NOT GOING TO TEACH YOU HOW TO PRACTICE LAW BUT YOU D9:45:13 6 MR, BISND: OBJECTION. ASKED AND ANSWERED. 6 MIGHT WANT TO LOOK THAT UP. 09:45:13 7 THE WITNESS: GENERALLY, YES. 09:15:13 7 Q YOU CAN GO AHEAD AND ANSWER THE QUESTION. 09:4$:13 8 Q BY MR. RUBINER: AND GENERALLY, WHAT DID YOU 09:45:13 8 A NO. 9 UNDERSTAND THAT -- WHAT DID YOU AND MR. GILFENBAIN 09:45:13 9 Q SO EVERYTHING YOU SAID TO MR. GILFENBAIN WAS 10 DISCUSS CONCERNING YOUR ROLE IN SINATRA COOK? 10 TRUTHFUL; IS THAT CORRECT? 09:45:13 11 MR, BISND: OBJECTION, ASKED AND ANSWERED. 09:45:13 11 A CORRECT. 09:15:13 12 THE WITNESS: THE PARTNERSHIP LAID OUT THE 09:45:13 12 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. HEARSAY. 13 GUIDELINES WITH WHICH THE PROJECT WAS RUN. I WAS 09:45:13 13 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID MR. -- DO YOU RECALL EVER 14 CERTAINLY THE GUY OUT ON THE SITE AND MAKING SURE THINGS 14 HAVING ANY DISCUSSIONS WITH MR, GILFENBAIN ABOUT THE 15 WERE GOING IN A CERTAIN DIRECTION, BUT ULTIMATELY I HAD 15 CONDITION OF THE PARKING LOT AT THE PALM DESERT SITE? 16 NO POWERS. I HAD ONE VOTE AMONG THREE AND THE TWO VOTES 09:45:13 16 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. HEARSAY. 17 WOULD DICTATE ALL DECISIONS. 09:45:13 17 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DO YOU RECALL ANY? 09:45:13 18 Q DO YOU RECALL DISCUSSING THAT WITH 09:45:13 18 A N0, 19 MR. GILFENBAIN? 09:45:13 19 Q DID YOU EVER TELL MR. GILFENBAIN THAT A PARKING 09:45:13 20 MR. BISND: OBJECTION. ASKED AND ANSWERED. 20 LOT HAD BEEN BLACK TOPPED AT THE SITE WHEN, IN FACT, IT 09:45:13 21 THE WITNESS: NO. 21 HAD NOT? 09:45:13 22 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID YOU EVER DISCUSS WITH 09:45:13 22 MR, BISND: OBJECTION. HEARSAY. 23 MR. GILFENBAIN THAT YOU WOULD PROVIDE SERVICES TO THE 09:45:13 23 THE WITNESS: NO. 24 PARTNERSHIP FOR YOUR INVESTMENT? 09:45:13 24 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID YOU EVER TELL 09:45:13 25 MR. BISND: OBJECTION. HEARSAY. 25 MR. GILFENBAIN THAT YOU WOULD BE PRESENT FULL TIME AT 86 BB Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 SHEET 1 45:13 2 45:13 3 4 5: 13 4 5 45;13 6 13 :45:13 :45:13 :15:13 45:13 45:13 is 13 l 8 9 1➢ 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 23 PAGE 89 THE SINATRA COOK SITE? MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. HEARSAY. THE WITNESS: NO. Q BY MR. RUBINER; p1ERE YOU PRESENT FULL TIME AT THE SINATRA COOK SITE? A I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE DEFINITION OF 'FULL TIME' IS. Q WELL, WHEN I -- WHAT'S YOUR DEFINITION OF 'FULL TIME'? A I WOULD SAY WHAT'S REQUIRED TO FULFILL OR SATISFY A TASK. Q DID YOU HAVE ANY DISCUSSIONS WITH MR. GILFENBAIN ABOUT HOW MUCH TIME YOU WOULD SPEND ONSITE AT THE SINATRA COOK SITE? A NOT THAT I RECALL. Q DID THE -- WERE YOU INVOLVED IN MANAGING THE CONSTRUCTION AT THE SINATRA COOK SITE? A NO. Q WERE YOU THE CONSTRUCTION MANAGER? A MY COMPANY OVERSAW MR. WILKINSON WHO WAS AN OWNER'S REP CONSTRUCTION MANAGER. I DON'T THINK HIS TITLE WAS EXACTLY CONSTRUCTION MANAGER. 0 SO YOUR COMPANY -- WHAT COMPANY IS THAT? A VINEYARDS DEVELOPMENT. Q AND AT THE TIME OF THE VINEYARDS OF PALM DESERT R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995,2449 PAGE 91 _ 09:45:13 1 Q BY MR. RUBINER: AS YOU UNDERSTAND IT, WAS THE VINEYARDS OF PALM DESERT COMPLETED UNDER THE BUDGET THAT WAS CREATED FOR IT? MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME AS TO WHICH BUDGET. THE WITNESS: IT WAS -- THE PROJECT CAME IN OVER BUDGET. Q BY MR. RUBINER: SO IF SOMEONE SAID THAT THE PROJECT CAME IN ON BUDGET OR UNDER BUDGET, WOULD THAT BE FALSE? A I BELIEVE SO. Q DID THE PROJECT, WAS THE PROJECT COMPLETED IN THE TIME THAT -- STRIKE THAT. WHEN YOU FIRST ENTERED INTO THE PROJECT AT SINATRA COOK, DID YOU HAVE A TIME LINE THAT YOU BELIEVED IT WOULD TAKE FOR THE PROJECT TO BE FINISHED? A NO, NOT ME PERSONALLY, Q WAS THERE ONE THAT ANYONE HAD? A LIKE ANY GMAX CONTRACT, THERE IS A SCHEDULE ATTACHED TO THE CONTRACT AND THAT LIKELY WAS THE OPERABLE TIME FRAME SCHEDULE FOR THE PROJECT. Q AS YOU UNDERSTAND IT, WAS THE PROJECT COMPLETED ON TIME? MR, BISYO: OBJECTION, VAGUE AS TO TIME AS TO THE TIME OF YOUR UNDERSTANDING. :45;13 :13 :45:13 45:11 45:13 45:13 9 la 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PAGE 90 PAGE 92 1 PROJECT, OTHER THAN YOU AND MISS OGULNICK, DID ANYONE 09:45:13 1 THE WITNESS: I 3ELI3VE THE PROJECT CAME IN BEFORE 2 ELSE PROVIDE OVERSIGHT OF THE CONSTRUCTION MANAGEMENT 2 TIME WHEN CALCULATING THE ACTUAL DAYS THAT THE 3 FOR THE VINEYARDS OF PALM DESERT? 3 CONTRACTOR WAS 'WORKING, 09:15:13 4 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. 09:45:13 4 Q BY MR, RUBINER: WHEN YOU SAY 'BEFORE TIME WHEN 09:45:13 5 COUNSEL, THE PROJECT TOOK OVER A YEAR. 5 CALCULATING THE DAYS THE CONTRACTOR WAS ACTUALLY 09:15:13 6 THE GAYNESS: AS I TESTIFIED PREVIOUSLY, MY BROTHER 6 WORKING," WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY THAT? 7 WAS AROUND DURING THAT TIME. CW DRIVER, WE DETERMINED, 09:45:13 7 A THERE WAS A CONSTRUCTION STOPPAGE AND BASED ON 8 DID NOT NEED AN OFFICIAL THIRD -PARTY CONSTRUCTION 8 THE NUMBER OF DAYS THE GC WAS WORKING, THOSE DAYS DID 9 MANAGER, 9 NOT EXCEED THE SCHEDULE, 09:45:13 10 Q BY MR. RUBINER: SO WOULD IT BE INCORRECT TO 09:45:13 10 Q WHY WAS THERE A CONSTRUCTION STOPPAGE? 11 SAY YOU ACTED AS CONSTRUCTION MANAGER FOR THE VINEYARDS 09:45:13 11 A THERE WAS A DISPUTE OVER COSTS. I BELIEVE THE 12 OF PALM DESERT? 12 ORIGINAL SHP, THE OWNER FELT THAT COSTS SHOULD BE ON 09:45:13 13 114R. BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. THE 13 BUDGET, THE GC FELT THE DEFINITIVE CONSTRUCTION 14 PROJECT TOOK OVER A YEAR, 14 DOCUMENTS WERE NOT SPELLED OUT PROPERLY WHEN WE STARTED 09:45:13 15 THE WITNESS: I WOULD NOT CONSIDER MYSELF A 15 THE CONTRACT, HE HAD CHANGE ORDERS, OWNERSHIP DISPUTED 16 CONSTRUCTION MANAGER. 16 THE CHANGE ORDERS, IT'S MY RECOLLECTION NONE OF US 09:45:13 11 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WAS THE VINEYARDS OF 17 BELIEVED THEY WERE ON THE OWNERSHIP SIDE VALID AND WE 18 PALM -- STRIKE THAT, 18 WENT INTO A DISPUTE OVER CHANGE ORDERS. SO I BELIEVE WE 09:45:13 19 ARE YOU FAMILIAR WITH THE BUDGET FOR 19 WERE ON BUDGET BUT IN THE END WE WOUND UP IN LITIGATION 20 CONSTRUCTION OF THE VINEYARDS OF PALM DESERT? 20 AND A CHECK WAS CUT THAT PUT US OVER BUDGET. 09:V5:13 21 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AND AM31000US AS TO 09:15:13 21 Q SO A SINGLE CHECK PUT YOU OVER BUDGET; IS THAT 22 THE WORDS "FAMILIAR WITH," 22 YOUR UNDERSTANDING? 09:15:13 23 THE WITNESS: AT SOME POINT IN TIME I'M CERTAIN I 09:45:13 23 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. ASKED AND ANSWERED. 24 WAS. I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE REFERRING TO SO I CAN'T 09:45:13 24 THE WITNESS: I DON'T KNOW THAT WE WERE OVER 25 ANSWER THAT QUESTION. 25 BUDGET. WE NEVER WENT TO COURT TO HEAR A JUDGE DECIDE, 90 92 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995,2449 - SHEET 24 PAGE 93 PAGE 95 1 WE JUST DECIDED IT MADE SENSE TO PAY THE CONTRACTOR MORE I AND RELEASE WHERE HE WOULD INDEMNIFY ME AGAINST ANY 2 THAN THE GNP TO SETTLE THE CASE. 2 CLAIMS, HE WOULD ACCEPT 15 PERCENT EXCHANGE FOR :45:13 3 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHEN YOU SAID OWNERSHIP WAS 3 INDEMNITY AND 1 FELT AN OBLIGATION TO GILFENBAIN AS THE 4 MAKING DECISIONS IN YDUR PRIOR ANSWER, WHAT DOES 4 GUY CHIEFLY RESPONSIBLE FOR THE RECOURSE LOAN TO MAKE 5 OWNERSHIP MEAN IN THE CONTEXT OF THAT ANSWER? 5 HIM FEEL COMFORTABLE AND PUT HIM IN A POSITION TO TAKE :45:13 6 A I ALREADY EXPLAINED THIS, COUNSEL. 6 CARE OF THE WELLS FARGD LOAN. :45:13 1 Q I DON'T THINK YOU HAD THAT ANSWER PREVIOUSLY SO 09:45:13 7 Q DID MR. GILFENBAIN EVER TELL YOU BE WAS UNHAPPY 8 IF YOU COULD TELL ME WHAT YOU MEANT BY OWNERSHIP IN YOUR 8 WITH YOUR WORK ON THE PROJECT? 9 LAST ANSWER I'D APPRECIATE IT. THAT'S MY QUESTION. ARE 09:45:13 9 MR. BISYO: OBJECTION. HEARSAY, OBJECTION. 10 YOU REFUSING TO ANSWER IT? 10 RELEVANCE. :45:13 11 A NO, I JUST THINK IT'S A WASTE OF TIME BUT I'LL 09:45:13 11 THE WITNESS: NEVER. QUITE THE OPPOSITE. 12 ANSWER II. THERE WERE THREE PARTIES THAT OWNED THE 09:45:13 12 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHEN YOU SAY "QUITE THE 13 PROJECT. THERE WERE THREE PARTIES WHO MADE THE 13 OPPOSITE,' WHAT DO YOU MEAN? 14 DECISIONS. I EXPLAINED THAT 20 MINUTES AGO, 09:15:13 14 A HE TOLD ME I DID A FANTASTIC JOB AND I WAS :45:13 15 Q DID YOU BELIEVE -- DID YOU VOTE THAT YOU SHOULD 15 FACED WITH ADVERSITY AND CAME OUT COMPLETING THE 16 PAY THE CONTRACTOR? 16 PROJECT, THE PROJECT'S TODAY 98 PERCENT OCCUPIED AND HE :15:13 11 A I VOTED -- I DON'T BELIEVE THERE WAS AN 17 THOUGHT I HAD DONE A STELLAR JOB. 18 OFFICIAL VOTE. I THINK WE LEFT THE DECISION TO 09:45:13 1B Q WHEN DID HE TELL YOU HE THOUGHT YOU DID A 19 GILFENBAIN BECAUSE HE WAS PAYING PER THE PARTNERSHIP THE 19 STELLAR JOB? 20 MAJORITY OF THE OVERAGES. HE WAS -- SIGNED A PERSONAL 09:45:13 20 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 21 GUARANTEE AND I BELIEVE WE RESPECTED HIS DECISION. IT 09:45:13 21 THE WITNESS: 2005 ALL THE WAY TO MY LAST 22 WASN'T NECESSARILY WE AGREED WITH THE ➢ECISION, SO I 22 CONVERSATION IN LATE 2010. 23 THINK WE ALLOWED HIM TO MAKE THE DECISION. 09:15:13 23 Q BY MR. RUBINER: SO MR. GILFENBAIN NEVER SAID :45:13 24 Q WERE MECHANIC'S LIENS PLACED ON THE PROPERTY? 24 HE WAS UNHAPPY WITH YOUR PERFORMANCE; IS THAT RIGHT? :45:13 25 A YES. 09:45:13 25 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. ASKED AND ANSWERED. _ PAGE 94 PAGE 96 09:45:13 1 Q HOW MANY? 1 OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. D9:45:13 2 A DON'T KNOW. 09:45:13 2 THE WITNESS: I DD NOT RECALL A SINGLE INSTANCE D9:45:13 3 Q WERE THERE AS MANY AS 40 MECHANIC'S LIENS 3 WHERE HE TOLD ME HE NAB UNHAPPY WITH MY PERFORMANCE. 4 PLACED ON THE PROPERTY? 09:45:13 4 Q BY MR. RUBINER: THEM DID YOU FIRST MEET SEAN 09:15:13 5 A i DON'T KNOW. 5 DALESANDRO? 09:15:13 6 Q AT SOME POINT DID THE OWNERSHIP REDUCE YOUR 09:45:13 6 A SUMMER OF 2010. 1 PERCENTAGE OWNERSHIP IN THE VINEYARDS OF PALM DESERT 09:45:13 1 Q WHERE DID YOU MEET HIM? 8 PROJECT? 09:45:13 8 A T DON'T RECALL. 09:45:13 9 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 9 Q WHAT WERE THE CIRCUMSTANCES? '.. 09:45:13 10 THE WITNESS: NO. 09:45:13 10 A MY ONLY RECOLLECTION IS A FRIEND OF MINE WHO I '.. 09:15:13 11 Q BY MR. RUBINER: SO AS OF TODAY YOUR COMPANY 11 PLAY GOLF WITH SAID HE KNEW SOMEBODY WHO WAS BROKERING 12 STILL HAS A 25 PERCENT INTEREST IN SINATRA CODE; IS THAT 12 CAPITAL. 13 RIGHT? 09:45:13 13 Q WHO WAS THE FRIEND? 09:45:13 14 MR, BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 09:45:13 14 A CARLOS CASTRO. 09:45:13 15 THE WITNESS: NO. 09:15:13 15 Q DID MR. CASTRO INTRODUCE YDU TO MR. DALESANDRO? 09:45:13 16 Q BY MR. RUBINER: AS OF TODAY, WHAT PERCENTAGE 09:45:13 16 A I DON'T REMEMBER THE EXACT MECHANICS. 11 INTEREST DOES YOUR COMPANY HAVE IN SINATRA COOK? 09:45:13 17 Q DO YOU REMEMBER WHEN YOU FIRST TALKED TO )9:45:13 18 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. RELEVANCE. 18 MR. DALESANDRO? )9:45:13 19 THE WITNESS: 10 PERCENT. 09:45:13 19 A I DO NOT. )9:45:13 20 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHEN WAS THE AMOUNT REDUCED 09:45:13 20 Q DID YOU TALK TO MR. DALESANDRO ON THE TELEPHONE 21 FROM 25 TO 10', 21 FIRST? )9:45:13 22 A I THINE, JUNE, 2011. 09:45:13 22 A I DON'T RECALL. )9:45:13 23 Q WHY WAS IT REDUCED? 09:45:13 23 Q ➢O YOU RECALL THE CIRCUMSTANCES OF YOUR FIRST )9:45:13 24 A MR. GILFENBAIN ASKED ME, IN EXCHANGE FOR 24 MEETING MR. DALESANDRO? 25 PUTTING UP ADDITIONAL CAPITAL, SIGNING A FULL INDEMNITY 09:45:13 25 A IT'S VAGUE. COULD YOU ASK A MORE SPECIFIC 99 96 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 25 PAGE 97 PAGE 99 1 QUESTION? 1 HE USED THAT YOU SHOULD EXPECT TERM SHEETS REGARDING THE 09:45:13 2 0 DD YOU RECALL THE FIRST TIME YOU EVER SET EYES 2 PROPERTY? 3 ON MR. DALESANDRO? 09:45:13 3 A GENERALLY, YES. 09:45:13 4 A I DO NOT. 09:45:13 4 Q DID HE SAY ANYTHING ELSE? 09:45:13 5 Q DO YOU RECALL EVER HAVING A DISCUSSION WITH 09:45:13 5 A WITHDUT YOU GIVING 14E SOMETHING TO CONJURE OP A 6 MR. DALESANDRO ABOUT WORKING TOGETHER? 6 MEMORY, I DON'T KNOW ANYTHING AT THIS TIME. 09:45:13 7 A EVER? YES. 09:45:13 7 Q DID YOU DISCUSS HOW MR, DALESANDRO WOULD GET 09:45:13 8 Q WHEN IS THE FIRST TIME THAT YOU RECALL? 8 PAID? 09:15:13 9 A IT WOULD BE SUMMER OF 2010, DISCUSSING MY 09:15:13 9 A YES. 10 PROJECT, ROYAL CANYON. 09:45:13 10 Q WHAT DID YOU DISCUSS ABOUT THAT? 09:15:13 11 Q WHERE DID THE CONVERSATION TAKE PLACE? 09:45:13 11 A HE WOULD PROVIDE A FEE AGREEMENT AND I BELIEVE 09:45:13 12 A I DON'T RECALL IF IT WAS ON THE PHONE OR IN 12 WE NEGOTIATED IT AND I SIGNED THE FEE AGREEMENT. 13 PERSON. 09:45:13 13 Q WHEN YOU SAY YOU -- DID YOU NEGOTIATE THE FEE 09:15:13 14 Q WAS ANYONE ELSE PRESENT OR ON THE PHONE? 14 AGREEMENT IN THAT FIRST CONVERSATION? 09:45:13 15 A I DON'T RECALL, 09:45:13 15 A I DOUBT IT. 09:45:13 16 Q DID YOU CALL MR. DALESANDRO OR DID HE CALL YOU? 09:45:13 16 Q DURING THAT FIRST CONVERSATION, WHAT D1D YOU 09:45:13 17 A I DON'T RECALL. 17 DISCUSS ABOUT THE FEE AGREEMENT? 09:45:13 18 Q DO YOU RECALL WHAT 'WAS DISCUSSED ABOUT THE 09:45:13 18 A 1 DIDN'T KNOW WE WERE AT THE FIRST 19 ROYAL CANYON PROJECT? 19 CONVERSATION. 09:45:13 20 A I -- GENERALLY SPEARING, YES. I REQUIRED A 00:45:13 20 Q WAS THERE A CONVERSATION PRIOR TD DISCUSSING 21 CERTAIN AMOUNT OF CAPITAL TO PURCHASE THE LAND AND 21 THE ROYAL CANYON PROJECT THAT YOU RECALL? 22 CERTAIN AMOUNT OF CAPITAL TO PURSUE ENTITLEMENTS AND HE 09:45:13 22 A COUNSEL, YOU HAD ASKED ME IS THERE ANYTHING YOU 23 REPRESENTED TO ME THAT HE HAD VARIOUS SOURCES THAT WOULD 23 RECOLLECT AND YOU DIDN'T TALK ABOUT JUST THE FIRST 24 BE INTERESTED IN THAT TYPE OF VENTURE, 24 CONVERSATION, SO -- 09:45:13 25 Q YOU SAY HE REPRESENTED TO YOU HE HAD SOURCES. 09:45:13 25 Q WHAT'S THE FIRST CONVERSATION THAT YOU RECALL 97 99 PAGE 98 PAGE 100 1 WHAT DID HE SPECIFICALLY SAY? 1 WITH MR. DALESANDRO? 5:13 2 A HE PROVIDED ME WITH A LIST OF POTENTIAL 09:45:13 2 A APOLOGIZE FOR HIM TALKING OVER ME. 3 COMPANIES THAT WOULD GO OUT -- HE WOULD GO OUT TO AND 09:45:13 3 I DON'T RECALL A SPECIFIC CONVERSATION. [09:45:13 4 MAKE INTRODUCTIONS TO AND MAKE A DETERMINATION IF THE 09:45:13 4 0 WHAT'S THE TOPIC IN THE EARLIEST CONVERSATION 5 DEAL MADE SENSE FOR THEIR COMPANY. 5 YOU CAN RECALL HAVING HAD WITH MR. DALESANDRO ABOUT 5:13 6 Q NOW, DID HE ACTUALLY SHOW YOU A LIST? 6 ANYTHING? 7 A I SAW A LIST. I DON'T REMEMBER EXACTLY WHAT 09:45:13 7 A THE TOPIC WOULD HAVE BEEN ROYAL CANYON. 8 POINT IN TIME I SAN THE LIST BUT AT ONE POINT, YES. 09:45:13 8 Q AND IS THAT THE CONVERSATION THAT YOU'VE BEEN 09:15:13 9 Q AND WHAT DID YOU -- YOU SAID YOU NEEDED -- DID 9 TESTIFYING ABOUT THAT WAS EITHER ON THE PHONE OR IN 10 YOU ALREADY HAVE THE ROYAL CANYON PROJECT? DID YOU 10 PERSON WHERE YOU TOLD HIM YOU HAD CERTAIN NEEDS .AND HE 11 ALREADY OWN IT? 11 SAID THAT THERE WAS A LIST OF POTENTIAL COMPANIES HE 09:45:13 12 A NO AND NO. 12 WOULD CONTACT? 09:45:13 13 Q SO YOU WERE -- YOU SAID YOU WERE DISCUSSING THE 09:45:13 13 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. MR. OGULNICK HAS TESTIFIED 14 ROYAL CANYON PROJECT. WHERE IS ROYAL CANYON? 14 ABOUT VARIOUS CONVERSATIONS AND SO YOUR QUESTION IS 09:15:13 15 A IT'S AT THE POINT WHERE COLDWATER MEETS 15 VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS. 16 ROYALTON DRIVE AND EXTENDS NORTH TOWARDS MULHOLLAND, 09:45:13 16 THE WITNESS: I THOUGHT UP UNTIL THIS POINT YOU 09:45:13 11 0 OTHER THAN TELLING YOU THAT HE HAD A LIST OF 17 WERE REFERRING TO THE FIRST INTERACTIONS AND THAT WOULD 18 POTENTIAL COMPANIES TO CONTACT, DID MR. DALESANDRO TELL 18 BE ROYAL CANYON, 19 YOU ANYTHING ELSE? 09:45:13 19 Q BY MR. RUBINER: I NOTICED WHILE YOU WERE 09:45:13 20 MR. BTSNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. 20 ANSWERING THAT QUESTION YOU STOPPED AND LOOKED AT YOUR 09:45:13 21 THE WITNESS: HE TOLD ME THAT HE LIKED THE DEAL, 21 PHONE. WAS THERE SOMETHING 01 YOUR PHONE THAT YOU WERE 22 THE DEAL WAS EASILY CAPITALIZED AND SOME SORT OF 22 READING? 23 INSTITUTIONAL EQUITY WOULD GOBBLE THIS UP AND I SHOULD 09:45:13 23 MR. BIDED: OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT THAT IT CA7,LS 24 EXPECT TERM SHEETS REGARDING THE PROPERTY, 24 FOR YOU TO REVEAL ATTORNEY -CLIENT COMMUNICATION, 01:45:13 25 Q BY MR. RUBINER: HE SAID -- WAS THAT THE WORDS 25 OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT IT CALLS FOR YOU TO REVEAL 981 100 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 SHEET 26 PAGE 101 SPOUSAL COM'ONICATION, OBJECTION TO T 2 CALLS FOR YOD TO REVEAL MATTERS WHICH 3 YOU. 9:41:13 4 MR. RUBTNER: COUNSEL, BY THE WAY 5 OBJECTIONS WOULD BE WAIVED BY HIM REV! 6 COURSE OF HIS DEPOSITION. IF HE WANTS 7 ATTORNEY IS COMMUNICATING WITH HIM DUE 8 A DEPOSITION THAT'S A SERIOUS PROBLEM 9 TO THE JUDGE'S ATTENTION THAT HIS AITO 10 COMMUNICATING WITH HIM BY E—MAIL DURIN 11 SO I'M BESTUNNED IF THAT'S WHAT IT IS. 12 ELSE I WOULD BELIEVE IT'S STILL SUBJEC 13 BECAUSE HE'S LOOKING AT IT WHILE QUEST 3:45:13 14 MR. BISNO: COUNSEL, YOU'VE WITNE 15 NOT ENGAGED MY PHONE. I CAN'T SPEAK 1 16 WHO MAY BE REPRESENTING MR. OGULNICK I 17 I CAN'T SPEAK TO COMMUNICATIONS HE MAY 18 WIFE. MY OBJECTION AND INSTRUCTION RE d:45:13 19 MR. RUBINER: I'M SORRY, DID YOU 20 TO ANSWER? 1:45:13 21 MR. BISNO: TO THE EXTENT THAT IT 22 TO REVEAL ATTORNEY —CLIENT COMMUNICATIO 23 IT WOULD CAUSE YOU TO REVEAL COMMUNICA 24 PROTECTED BY SPOUSAL PRIVILEGE OR TO T 25 WAIVE YOUR RIGHTS OF PRIVACY, I AM INS R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 PAGE 103 HE EXTENT THAI IT 09:45:13 1 ARE PRIVATE TO 2 QU 3 EN ALL OF THOSE 09:45:13 4 EWING IT IN THE 09:45:13 5 TO -- IF HIS 6 MR. ING THE CONTENT OF 7 MR. THAT I WOULD BRING 09:15:13 8 RNEY IS 09:45:13 9 C THE DEPOSITION, 09:45:13 10 IF IT'S ANYTHING 09:45:13 11 T TO DISCOVERY 09:45:13 12 IONS ARE PENDING. 09:45:13 13 SSED ME, I HAVE 09:45:13 14 0 OTHER COUNSEL 09:45:13 15 N OTHER MATTERS. 09:45:13 16 HAVE WITH HIS 09:45:13 17 MAINS, 18 HAS INSTRUCT HIM NOT 19 AND 20 IHA WOULD CAUSE YOU 09:45:13 21 N, TO THE EXTENT 09:45:13 22 TION WHICH IS 09:45:13 23 HE EXTENT IT WOULD 09:45:13 24 TRUCTING YOU NOT 25 DEP PAGE 102 1 TO ANSWER. - :45:13 2 IF YOU CAN ANSWER THE QUESTION WITHOUT THE :45:13 3 ABOVE DESCRIBED, PLEASE DO SO. :45:13 4 THE WITNESS: IT'S AN E—MAIL FROM MY WIFE ASKING ME 5 WHEN I'M GOING TO BE DONE. ON. I THINK IT'S ACTUALLY A 6 TEXT MESSAGE. :45:13 7 Q BY MR, RUBINER: WHEN WAS THE FIRST 8 CONVERSATION YOU HAD WITH MR. DALESANDRO ABOUT THE ROYAL 9 CANYON PROJECT? :45:13 10 A I BELIEVE IT WAS JULY OR AUGUST, 2010. :45:13 11 Q WHERE DID THE CONVERSATION TAKE PLACE? :45:13 12 A I TESTIFIED I DON'T RECALL THE FIRST 13 CONVERSATION, WHETHER IT WAS ON THE PHONE, IN PERSON. I 14 DON'T RECALL. :45:13 15 Q IN THE EARLIER TESTIMONY WHERE YOU DESCRIBED 16 MR. -- YOUR DISCUSSIONS WITH MR. OGULNICK -- I'M SORRY. 17 STRIKE THAT -- YOUR DISCUSSION WITH MR. DALESANDRO AND 18 EVENTUALLY DISCUSSING A RETAINER AGREEMENT OF SOME SORT, 19 HOW MANY CONVERSATIONS WAS THAT? :45:13 20 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE, AMBIGUOUS, 21 INCOMPREHENSIBLE. :45:13 22 YOU CAN ANSWER IF YOU UNDERSTOOD IT. :45:13 23 THE WITNESS: I DON'T UNDERSTAND THE QUESTION. :45:13 24 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHAT DIDN'T YOU UNDERSTAND 25 ABOUT IT? A YOU'RE REFERRING TO A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF ESTIONS WITHIN A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF TIME AND I DON'T OW WHAT EITHER — Q ALL RIGHT. I'LL WITHDRAW IT. HOW MANY CONVERSATIONS DID YOU HAVE WITH DALESANDRO PRIOR TO YOUR SIGNING AN AGREEMENT WITH JALESANDRO? A I DON'T RECALL. Q MORE THAN ONE? A YES. Q MORE THAN FIVE? A I DON'T RECALL. Q MORE THAN TEN? A I DON'T RECALL. Q MORE THAN 30? MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. COUNSEL, YOU ARE BADGERING THIS FATNESS. HE NOW ANSWERED °I DON'T RECALL' IN RESPONSE TO FIVE TEN AND NOW YOU'RE PILING ON WITH 3C. I REQUEST T YOU MOVE ON. Q BY MR. RUBINER: YOU CAN ANSWER THE QUESTION. A I DON'T RECALL. Q MORE THAN A HUNDRED? MR. BISNO: COUNSEL, I API GOING TO TERJINATE THE OSITION IF YOU CONTINUE TO BADGER THIS WITNESS. PAGE 104 1 YOU'VE ASKED THIS WITNESS IF TT WAS MORE THAN FIVE, MORE 2 THAN TEN, MORE THAN 30, I HAVE ALERTED YOU THAT YOU ARE 3 BADGERING THIS WITNESS AND NOW YOU ARE CONTINUING TO 4 BADGER THIS WITNESS. T WOULD URGE YOU TO MOVE ON. :45:13 5 Q BY MR. RUBIN"AR: YOU CAN ANSWER THE QUESTION. :45:13 6 A I DON'T RECALL. :45:13 7 Q MORE THAN A THOUSAND? :45:13 8 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION, I'LL INSTRUCT YOU NOT TO 9 ANSWER. :45:13 10 MR. RUBINER: WHAT'S THE BASIS FOR THE INSTRUCTION? :45:13 11 MR. BISNO: YOU'RE BADGERING THE WITNESS, COUNSEL, :45:13 12 MR, RUBINER: I'M GOING TO ASK THE COURT REPORTER 13 TO MARK AS EXHIBIT 5 -- ONE, TWO -- SIX —PAGE DOCUMENT 14 ENTITLED PARALLEL REAL ESTATE ADVISORS LLC CONSULTING 15 AND ADVISORY AGREEMENT. :45:13 16 MR. BISNO: THANK YOU. :45:13 17 (WHEREUPON, THE ABOVE MENTIONED DOCUMENT WAS 18 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION BY THE SHORTHAND REPORTER AND 19 ATTACHED HERE101. :45:13 20 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DO YOU HAVE EXHIBIT 5 IN FRONT 21 OF YOU, SIR? :45:13 22 A I DO. :45:13 23 Q TAKE A MOMENT, LOOK THROUGH EXHIBIT 5 AND LET 24 ME KNOW WHEN YOU FINISH. :45:13 25 A OKAY, I'VE REVIEWED IT. Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 _ SHEET 27 PAGE 105 PAGE 107 09:45:13 1 Q DO YOU RECOGNIZE EXHIBIT 5? 1 DOCUMENTS? 09:45:13 2 A YES. 09:45:13 2 A NO. 09:45:13 3 Q WHAT IS EXHIBIT 5? 09:45:13 3 Q DID YOU EVER AUTHORIZE ANYONE TO PUT YOUR D9:45:13 4 A IT'S A FEE AGREEMENT I SIGNE➢ FOR PROCUREMENT 4 ELECTRONIC SIGNATURE ON EXHIBIT 5? 5 OF CAPITAL TO ACQUIRE AND ENTITLE THE ROYAL CANYON 09:45:13 5 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT THAT IT WOULD 6 PROPERTY. 6 CAUSE YOU TO REVEAL THE CONTENTS OF SPOUSAL 09:45:13 7 Q IF YOU COULD TURN TO THE -- 7 COMMUNICATIONS. 09:45:13 8 THE VIDEDGRAPHER: COUNSEL. COUNSEL, YOUR PAPER IS 09:45:13 8 THE WITNESS: I DON'T RECALL BUT I DO RECALL THIS 9 ON YOUR MIKE. 9 AGREEMENT. 09:41:13 10 MR. BISNO: I'M SORRY. 09:45:13 10 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DO YOU HAVE ANY REASON TO 09:45:13 11 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: IT'S MAKING DEEP NOISES. 11 BELIEVE IF IT'S AN ELECTRONIC SIGNATURE ON EXHIBIT 5 09:15:13 12 MR. BISNO: THANK YOU. 12 THAT YOU DID NOT AUTHORIZE THAT SIGNATURE? 09:45:13 13 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: THANK YOU. 09:45:13 13 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT THAT ANSWERING 09:45:13 14 0 BY MR. RUBINER: WOULD YOU TURN TO THE FOURTH 14 THE QUESTION WOULD CAUSE YOU TO REVEAL SPOUSAL 15 PAGE, THE PAGE WITH THE TITLE SIGNATURE PAGE ON IT. 15 COMMUN'ICATIONS. 09:45:13 16 DO YOU SEE THAT? 09:45:13 16 THE WITNESS: NO. 09:45:13 17 A YES. 09:45:13 17 Q BY MR. RUBINER: AND PRIOR TO AUTHORIZING 09:45:13 18 Q IF YOU LOOK ABOUT HALFWAY DOWN THE PAGE, THERE 18 SOMEONE TO PUT AN ELECTRONIC SIGNATURE ON EXHIBIT 5, DID 19 APPEARS TO BE A SIGNATURE. 19 YOU REVIEW EXHIBIT 5? D9:45:13 20 DO YOU SEE THAT? 09:45:13 20 A PROBABLY. 01:45:13 21 A YES. 09:45:13 21 Q IS IT YOUR PRACTICE TO REVIEW DOCUMENTS PRIOR 09:45:13 22 Q DO YOU RECOGNIZE THAT SIGNATURE? 22 TO SIGNING THEM? 09:45:13 23 A I DO. 09:45:13 23 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. 09:15:13 24 Q WHOSE SIGNATURE IS THAT? 09:45:13 24 THE WITNESS: I WOULD SAY THE MAJORITY OF THE TIME, 09;15:13 25 A IT'S MINE. 25 YES. THERE'S PROBABLY SOME CIRCUMSTANCES WHERE I RELY 1051 107 PAGE 106 :15:13 1 Q DID YOU SIGN THIS PAGE OF EXHIBIT 5 ON OR ABOUT 2 AUGUST 20, 2010? :45:13 3 A I DON'T RECALL WHEN I SIGNED IT. I ALSO HAVE 4 AN ELECTRONIC SIGNATURE THAT MY OFFICE USES AND THAT 5 LOOKS LIKE THAT ONE, SO TO SAY T ACTUALLY SIGNED IT, I 6 DON'T THINE SO. :45:13 7 Q ARE PEOPLE AT YOUR OFFICE -- WHEN YOU SAY YOUR 8 OFFICE USES, WHO AT YOUR OFFICE IS AUTHORIZED TO USE 9 YOUR ELECTRONIC SIGNATURE? :45:13 10 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT THE ANSWER TO 11 THE QUESTION WOULD INVOLVE EITHER ATTORNEY -CLIENT 12 COMMUNICATION OR WOULD INVOLVE COMMUNICATION BETWEEN YOU 13 AND YOUR SPOUSE. :15:13 14 THE WITNESS: I THINK IT WOULD DEPEND ON WHAT 15 MOMENT IN TIME AND WHAT CIRCUMSTANCE, SO I DON'T RECALL 16 AT THIS TIME. :45:13 17 Q BY MR. RUBINER: IN AUGUST OF 2010, WHO AT YOUR 1B OFFICE WAS AUTHORIZED TO USE YOUR ELECTRONIC SIGNATURE? :15:13 19 MR. DISKO: OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT THAT YOUR 20 TESTIMONY WOULD REVEAL SPOUSAL COMMUNICATIONS. :45:13 21 THE WITNESS: IT WOULD REVEAL SPOUSAL 22 COMMUNICATIONS. :45:13 23 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID YOU EVER AUTHORIZE ANYBODY 24 TO USE -- STRIKE THAT. :45:13 25 DO YOU EVER PUT AN ELECTRONIC SIGNATURE ON PAGE 108 1 ON EITHER SOMEBODY WHO WORKS FOR ME OR SOMEBODY LIKE AN 2 ATTORNEY TO ADVISE ME THAT IT'S OKAY TO EXECUTE A 3 DOCUMENT. 09:15:13 4 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DO YOU 3ECALL DISCUSSING 5 EXHIBIT 5 WITH ANYONE PRIOR TO SIGNING IT OR AUTHORIZING 6 SOMEONE TO SIGN IT ON YOUR BEHALF? 09:45:13 7 A I DO NOT. 09:45:13 8 Q DO YOU RECALL DISCUSSING EXHIBIT 5 WITH 9 MR. DALESANDRO? 09:45:13 10 A I THINK I DO RECALL A CONVERSATION. 09:45:13 11 Q WHEN WAS THE CONVERSATION? 09:45:13 12 A I WOULD NOT KNOW OF THE DATE OF THE 13 CONVERSATION. 39:45:13 14 Q WAS IT AT OR AROUND THE TIME YOU SIGNED OR 15 AUTHORIZED SOMEONE TO SIGN] EXHIBIT 5 FOR YOU? )9:45:13 16 A I BELIEVE SO. 39:45:13 17 Q WAS IT BEFORE YOU SIGNED EXHIBIT 5? 39:45:13 18 A I BELIEVE SO. )9:45:13 19 Q WHERE DID THE CONVERSATION TAKE PLACE? )9:45:13 20 A I BELIEVE I WAS IN MY CAR AND HE WAS SOMEWHERE 21 ELSE. IT WAS ON THE TELEPHONE. )9:45:13 22 Q WAS ANYONE ELSE IN THE CAR? )9:45:13 23 A N0. )9:45:13 24 Q AS FAR AS YOU KNOW, WAS ANYONE ELSE ON THE 25 TELEPHONE CONVERSATION? 108 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 28 PAGE 109 PAGE 111 09:45:13 1 A NO. 09:15:13 1 Q FOLLOWING THE CONVERSATION, DID YOU TELL 09:15:13 2 Q HOW LONG DID THE CONVERSATION LAST? 2 ANYBODY ABOUT THE CONVERSATION YOU HAD WITS 09:45:13 3 A FIVE OR TEN MINUTES. 3 MR. DALESANDRO? 09:15:13 4 Q WHAT WAS DISCUSSED? 09:45:13 4 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT THAT IT 09;15:13 5 A I BELIEVE IN GENERAL THIS AGREEMENT AND 5 REQUIRES YOU TO REVEAL ATTORNEY -CLIENT COMMUNICATION. 6 SPECIFICALLY SOME OF THESE - THE TERM REGARDING UPFRONT 6 OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT THAT IT CAUSES YOU TO REVEAL 1 FEE, A REGISTERED INVESTOR VERSUS A NON REGISTERED 7 SPOUSAL COMMUNICATION. 8 INVESTOR. I THINE I WAS FAIRLY CONFUSED AS TO WHEN HE 03:45:13 B THE WITNESS: IT WOULD REQUIRE ME TO GIVE SPOUSAL 9 WOULD EARN A FEE. I DID NOT UNDERSTAND THAT NOT A 9 COMMUNICATION, 10 REGISTERED INVESIOWS A REGISTERED INVESTOR AND I 09:45:13 10 MR. EISNO: I DIRECT YOU NOT TO ANSWER, 11 BELIEVE HE EXPLAINED TO ME HIS INTERPRETATION OF THAT. 09:45:13 11 THE WITNESS: OKAY, 12 AND FOR SOME REASON I HAVE A RECOLLECTION, ALTHOUGH NOT 09:45:13 12 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHEN WAS THE NEXT CONVERSATION 13 PRECISELY, THAT I THOUGHT THERE WAS SOMETHING AT ODDS 13 YOU HAD WITH YOUR SPOUSE FOLLOWING THE FIVE- TO 14 ABOUT TT, 14 TEN-MINUTE PHONE CONVERSATION WITH MR. DALESANDRO? D9:45:13 15 Q DO YOU RECALL ANY OTHER TOPICS THAT YOU 09:45:13 15 A PRETTY 16UCH RIGHT AWAY. 09:45:13 16 DISCUSSED DURING THE FIVE- TO TEN-MINUTE PHONE 09:45:13 16 Q IF YOU COULD TURN TO THE SECOND PAGE OF EXHIBIT 17 CONVERSATION? 17 5. D9:45:13 18 A NO, 09:45:13 18 DO YOU HAVE THAT PAGE IN FRONT OF YOU? 09:45:13 19 Q WHAT DID YOU SAY ABOUT FEES DURING THE FIVE- TO 09:45:13 19 A I DO. 20 TEN-MINUTE PHONE CONVERSATION? 09:45:13 20 Q LOOK AT THE FIRST SENTENCE AI THE TOP OF THE 09:41:13 21 A I RECALL HE TRIED TO EXPLAIN TO ME THAT THERE 21 PAGE -- WELL, STRIKE THAT. 22 WAS A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A REGISTERED AND A NOT 09:45:13 22 PRIOR TO RECEIVING EXHIBIT 5, HAD YOU EVER 23 REGISTERED INVESTOR. 23 HEARD OF PARALLEL REAL ESTATE ADVISORS LLC? 09:45:13 24 Q WHAT DID HE TELL YOU? 09:45:13 24 A COUNSEL, COULD YOU REPEAT THE QUESTION? PRIOR ''.09:45:13 25 A I THINK HE SAID THAT IN THE EVENT THAT IT WAS 25 TO? 109 111 - PAGE 110 PAGE 112 1 SOMEBODY THAT HE HAD REGISTERED WITH ME THAT THERE WOULD 09:45:13 1 Q PRIOR TO RECEIVING A COPY OF EXHIBIT S, HAD YOU 2 BE A DIFFERENT FEE VERSUS SOMEBODY THAT DIDN'T REGISTER 2 EVER HEARD OF PARALLEL REAL ESTATE ADVISORS LLC? 3 WITH ME, BUT I DON'T EXACTLY RECALL THE CONVERSATION. 09:45:13 3 A NEVER, 05:45:13 4 Q SO OTHER THAN HAVING A DISCUSSION ABOUT THE 09:15:13 4 Q AT ANY TIME DID YOU ASK MR. DALESANDRO WHAT 5 TERM "REGISTERED INVESTOR," DO YOU RECALL ANYTHING ELSE 5 PARALLEL REAL ESTATE ADVISORS LLC WAS? 6 ABOUT THE DISCUSSION DURING THE FIVE- TO TEN-MINUTE 09:45:13 6 A I THINK THE ANSWER WOULD BE YES AT ANY TIP', I 7 PHONE CONVERSATION WHILE YOU WERE IN YOUR CAR? 7 DON'T RECALL ONE, AND AS I TESTIFIED BEFORE HE TOLD ME 09:45:13 8 A YEAH. T ASKED HIM TO BE UP FRONT I'IITH ME WITH 8 HIS CHIEF FUNCTION WAS TO RAISE CAPITAL FOR DEVELOPERS 9 THE LIKELIHOOD OF SUCCESS, I ASKED HIM TO DISCLOSE TO ME 09:45:13 9 OR SYNDICATORS OF LAND TO ACQUIRE TITLE. 10 IF HE WAS GOING TO BE SUCCESSFUL AND I RECALL DISTINCTLY 09:45:13 10 Q SO IF YOU, AGAIN, IF YOU COULD GO BACK TO THE 11 TELLING ME I7 WAS A FANTASTIC DEAL, A GREAT DEAL AND IT it FIRST PAGE -- SECOND PAGE OF EXHIBIT 5, THE FIRST 12 WOULD BE EASY FOR HIM TO ACCOMPLISH THIS. 12 SENTENCE ON THAT PAGE SAYS "NEITHER PARALLEL NOR ANY OF 09:15:13 13 I THEN ASKED HOW MUCH CAPITAL AN INVESTOR WOULD 13 ITS REPRESENTATIVES OR AGENTS SHALL BE DEEMED TO HAVE 14 REQUIRE ME TO PUT UP AND I THINE I RECALL HIM TELLING ME 14 MADE OR MAKE ANY REPRESENTATION OR WARRANTY THAT THE 15 ANYWHERE FROM 0 TO 10 PERCENT, LIKELY CLOSER TO ZERO, 15 CLIENT WILL SUCCESSFULLY EXTEND OR RENEGOTIATE ITS 16 AND I REMEMBER FEELING LIKE, WELL, IF HE'S RIGHT THAT 16 EXISTING DEBT, ACQUIRE ANY NEW SENIOR OR SUBORDINATE 17 WOULD BE A DEAL I'D BE HAPPY TO TAKE. 17 DEBT, ACQUIRE THE REAL PROPERTY OR ENTER INTO A JOINT 09:45:13 18 Q DO YOU RECALL DISCUSSING ANYTHING ELSE DURING 18 VENTURE DEVELOPMENT AGREEMENT." 19 THE FIVE- TO TEN-MINUTE PHONE CONVERSATION WITH 09:45:13 19 WAS THAT SENTENCE THERE WHEN YOU SIGNED EXHIBIT 20 MR. DALESANDRO? 20 5? 09:45:13 21 A NO. 09:45:13 21 A I DON'T RECALL. D9:45:13 22 Q DID YOU TAKE ANY NOTES DURING THE CONVERSATION? 09:45:13 22 Q DID YOU HAVE AN UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT THAT 09:45:13 23 A NO. 23 SENTENCE MEANT WHEN YOU SIGNED EXHIBIT 5? 09:45:13 24 Q DID YOU TAKE ANY NOTES AFTER THE CONVERSATION? 09:45:13 24 A I DON'T RECALL READING THAT SENTENCE AND COMING 09:45:13 25 A NO. 25 TO A CONCLUSION. 110 112 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R, Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 29 PAGE 113 PAGE 115 09:15:13 1 Q IS THERE ANYTHING IN EXHIBIT 5 THAT LED YOU TO 09:45:13 1 A NO. 2 BELIEVE MR. DALESANDRD WAS PR@4ISING THAT HE WOULD BE 09:45:13 2 Q DID YOU CONTINUE TO WORK WITH MR. DALESANDRD 3 SUCCESSFUL IN OBTAINING FINANCING FOR THE ROYAL CANYON 3 AFTER HE WAS NOT SUCCESSFUL IN THE ROYAL CANYON PROJECT? 4 PROJECT? 09:45:13 4 A YES. D9:45:13 5 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT THAT IT CAUSES 09:45:13 5 Q WHY? 6 YOU TO REVEAL THE CONTENT OF ATTORNEY -CLIENT 09:45:13 6 A AT THAT TI14E HE SOUNDED AS IF HE WAS SOMEBODY 7 COMMUNICATION, 7 WHO UNDERSTOOD REAL ESTATE, HAD CERTAIN AMOUNT OF 09:45:13 8 THE WITNESS: I WOULD SAY YES. ON PAGE 3 HE 09:45:13 E CONNECTIONS. HE CERTAINLY REPRESENTED THAT. HE SPEAKS 09:45:13 9 DISCUSSES A SUCCESS FEE SO I ASSUME I INFERRED THAT HE 9 IN SUCH A MANNER THAT AT THAT TIME I BELIEVED HE WOULD 10 WOULD HAVE SUCCESS IN REACHING HIS OBJECTIVE OF GETTING 10 BE ABLE TO BE SUCCESSFUL, 11 MY COMPANY CAPITAL TO DO THE PROJECT WE WERE SEEKING TO 09:45:13 11 THEN AS TIME WENT ON HE REVEALED THAT HE HAD NO 12 DO. 12 MONEY, NEEDED LOANS TO STAY IN THE CITY, AND I STARTED D9:45:13 13 Q BY MR, RUBINER: OTHER THAN MR. DALESANDRD, DID 13 TO FEEL, WELL, I'M FORTUNATE ENOUGH TO HAVE A FEW 14 YOU EVER HIRE A CONSULTANT FOR ONE OF YOUR COMPANIES 14 DOLLARS. I'LL GIVE HIM A CHANCE TO SEE DESPITE NOT 15 BEFORE? 15 BEING SUCCESSFUL ON THESE TWO VENTURES, SEE IF HE CAN 09:45:13 16 A YES. 16 DIG SOMETHING ELSE UP, 09:45:13 17 Q AND HAD THE CONSULTANTS YOU HIRED FOR YOUR 09:45:13 17 I HAD NOT REALIZED THAT HE WAS OF THE NATURE HE 18 COMPANIES, HAD YOU EVER HIRED A CONSULTANT FOR THE 16 IS UNTIL LATER ON DOWN THE ROAD. 19 PURPOSE QF OBTAINING A LOAN FOR ONE OF YOUR COMPANIES? 09:45:13 19 Q WHEN YOU SAY 'OF THE NATURE HE IS,' WHAT DOES 09:45:13 20 A YES. 20 THAT MEAN? 09:45:13 21 Q AND HAVE THE CONSULTANTS YOU HIRED ALWAYS BEEN 09:45:13 21 A MISREPRESENTS, TELLS ME HE CAN DO SOMETHING AND 22 SUCCESSFUL? 22 DOESN'T SUCCEED. 09:45:13 23 MR, BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. 09:45:13 23 Q SO WHAT WAS THE NEXT PROJECT YOU AND 09:45:13 24 Q BY MR. RUBINER: EVER. 24 MR. DALESANDRD WORKED ON AFTER THE ROYAL CANYON PROJECT? 09:15:13 25 A I WOULD SAY NOT ALWAYS. 09:45:13 25 A THE NEXT AGREEMENT I SIGNED WAS FOR THE 113 115 - PAGE 119 PAGE 116 DO:45:13 1 Q WHEN YOU MET WITH MR, DALESANDRO, DID HE TELL 09:45:13 1 SINATRA & COOK PROJECT BUT I THINK IT'S A STRETCH TO SAY 2 YOU ANYTHING ABOUT HIS BACKGROUND? 2 WE WORKED ON IT. 09:15:13 3 A I DON'T RECALL. 09:45:13 3 Q WHY DID YOU ENTER INTO AN AGREEMENT WITH HIM 09:45:13 4 Q DID YOU TELL MR. DALESANDRD ANYTHING ABOUT YOUR 4 ABOUT SINATR.A COOK? 5 BACKGROUND? 09:45:13 5 A WE WERE COMING -- THE SINATRA & COOK PROJECT 09:15:13 6 A I DON'T RECALL. 6 BAD A LOAN COME DUE AND THE LENDER WAS ASKING FOR 09:45:13 7 Q DO YOU RECALL EVER TELLING MR. DALESANDRO THAT 7 PAYMENT, FILED AN NOD AND WE WERE LOOKING FOR CAPITAL TO 8 YOU WERE A MEMBER OF THE URBAN LAND INSTITUTE? 8 TAKE THEM OUT. THEY WERE WILLING TO STAY IN THE DEAL D9:45:13 9 MR, BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME. 9 AND EXTEND THE LOAN BUT IN THAT ENVIRONMENT IN LATE 2010 09:45:13 10 THE WITNESS: I DON'T RECALL THAT AND I WOULDN'T 10 THERE WAS A LOT OF DEVELOPERS GETTING DPO'S AND WE 11 SAY BECAUSE I'M NOT. 11 THOUGHT WE WOULD GO OUT TO MARKET, AND WE HAD TALKED TO 09:45:13 12 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WERE YOU EVER A MEMBER OF THE 12 THE GUYS AT GEORGE SMITH, A GUY NAMED ALLAN FRIEDMAN, A 13 URBAN LAND INSTITUTE? 13 GUY NAMED HACKMAN, I FORGOT MR. HACKMAN'S FIRST NAME. 09:15:13 14 A NOT THAT I RECALL. 14 MICHAEL HACKMAN. AND WE WERE LOOKING TO GET A SUM OF 09:45:13 15 Q DID YOU EVER REPRESENT TO ANYBODY YOU WERE A 15 MONEY TOGETHER TO TARE OUT THE EXISTING LENDER BECAUSE 16 MEMBER OF THE URBAN LAND INSTITUTE? 16 THE ENVIRONMENT WAS SUCH THAT WE THOUGHT IT WAS FEASIBLE )9:45:13 17 A NOT THAT I RECALL. 17 TO DO SO. IN OUR CONVERSATIONS WITH THE LENDER UP UNTIL )9:15:13 18 0 DID YOU EVER SUBMIT A BIOGRAPHY TO ANYBODY 18 THAT TIME THERE CERTAINLY SEEMED TO BE "YOU CAN COME 19 WHERE YOU IDENTIFIED YOURSELF AS A MEMBER OF THE URBAN 19 TALK TO US." 20 LAND INSTITUTE? 09:45:13 20 Q SO WHY DID YOU, - DID YOU RAISE THE ISSUE OF )9:45:13 21 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TIME, 21 WORKING ON SINATRA COOK WITH MR, DALESANDRD? )9:45:13 22 THE WITNESS: NOT THAT I RECALL. 09:45:13 22 A MY RECOLLECTION IS HE ASKED ME ABOUT FINDING A )9:45:13 23 Q BY MR. RUBINER: IN YOUR VIEW, WAS 23 BUYER AND HE WOULD GET A FEE TO GET A BUYER AND I 24 MR. DALESANDRD SUCCESSFUL IN HIS WORK FOR THE ROYAL 24 BELIEVED THAT WE DISCUSSED IT BUT THE FUNDS THAT WERE 25 CANYON PROJECT? 25 DUE TO WELLS FARGO LIKELY MADE THAT VIRTUALLY 1141 116 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 30 PAGE 117 PAGE 119 1 IMPOSSIBLE. 09:45:13 1 A I DO NOT RECALL THE FIRST TIME. 09:45:13 2 Q WHY DID THE FUNDS AVAILABLE FROM WELLS FARGO 09:45:13 2 Q OTHER THAN YOU, BIG ANYONE ELSE FROM - WERE 3 MAKE THAT VIRTUALLY IMPOSSIBLE? 3 YOU AWARE THAT ANYONE ELSE FROM SINATRA COOK HAD 09:45:13 4 A BECAUSE IN 201D WE WERE 50 PERCENT OCCUPIED AND 4 DISCUSSIONS WITH MR. DALESANDRO ABOUT OBTAINING 5 THE PERCEIVED VALUE WAS PROBABLY LOWER THAN WHAT WAS 5 FINANCING FOR SINATRA COOK? 6 OWED TO THE LENDER. 09:45:13 6 A I RECOLLECT THAT KAMBIZ KAMDAR ASKED ME FOR 09:15:13 7 Q AND DID YOU DISCUSS WITH OTHERS AT SINATRA COOK 7 INFORMATION BECAUSE HE HAD SOMEBODY THAT WAS MAYBE 8 RETAINING MR. DALESANDRO? B INTERESTED IN FINANCING AND HAD THE BROKER THAT WOULD 09:15:13 9 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT THAT ANSWERING 9 HAVE BEEN HIRED PRODUCED SOMETHING AND COULD HE HAVE 10 THE QUESTION WOULD CAUSE YOU TO REVEAL ATTORNEY -CLIENT 10 THAT INFORMATION, AND I RECALL SENDING HIM THAI 11 COMMUNICATION OR CAUSE YOU TO REVEAL COMMUNICATION WITH 11 TNFOTIATION. AND HE ASKED NE IF IT WAS OKAY EITHER TO 12 YOUR SPOUSE. 12 CONTACT THE BROKER OR TO GIVE INFORMATION TO A NEW D9:45:13 13 THE WITNESS: IT WAS AGREED INTERNALLY AMONG THE 13 FINANCIER, AND I RECALL SAYING IT WAS FIME, 14 THREE PARTNERS, ME ONE OF THEM, THAT WE MIGHT AS WELL 09:45:13 14 Q DID MR, KAMDAR EVER TELL YOU HE SPOKE WITH 15 MAKE A RUN AT TAKING OUT WELLS FARGO IF THAT ENVIRONMENT 15 MR. DALESANDRO? 16 BECAUSE WE HAD BEEN HEARING FROM ADVISORS, ATTORNEYS 09:45:13 16 A I DON'T RECALL THAT, NO. 17 THAT WELLS AND OTHER BANES WERE LOOKING AT DISCOUNTED 09:45:13 17 Q DO YOU RECALL EVER DISCUSSING 41ITH 1B PAYOFFS. WE REALIZED WE HAD A VERY SHORT WINDOW BECAUSE 18 MR. GILFENBAIN RETAINING MR. DALESANDRO? 19 SOMETIME IN AUGUST OR SEPTEMBER THEY FILED AN NOD AND 09:45:13 19 A YES. 20 THAT WOULD RESULT IN A 150-DAY FORECLOSURE PROCEEDING. 09:45:13 20 Q WHEN DID YOU HAVE DISCUSSIONS WITH 21 SO WE KNEW WE WOULD GO OUT TO CAPITAL WITH SOME BROKERS, 21 MR, GILFENBAIN ABOUT RETAINING MR. DALESANDRO? 22 SEE HOW MUCH THEY COULD COME UP WITH AND THEN PRESENT IT 09:45:13 22 A ROUGHLY, AUGUST/SEPTEMBER, 2010• 23 TO WELLS. 09:45:13 23 Q WAS THAT IN PERSON? 09:15:13 24 I THINK WE WOUND UP PRESENTING AN OFFER IN THE 09:45:13 24 A NO. 25 MID -THIRTIES AND THEY WERE OWED $51 MILLION AND THEY 09:45:13 25 Q OVER THE PHONE? 117 119 PAGE 118 PAGE 120 1 SAID BELL, NO, AND WE REALIZE➢ THAT THERE WAS FO WAY 09:45:13 1 A CORRECT. 2 POSSIBLE TO GET A SUM OF MONEY TOGETHER IN LIGHT OF 09:45:13 2 Q WAS ANYONE ELSE ON THE LINE? 3 WHAT -- WHO WE WERE DEALING WITH AT WELLS IN ORDER TO 09:45:13 3 A I DON'T RECALL. 4 TAKE OUT WELLS AT A DISCOUNT. 09:45:13 4 Q WHERE WERE YOU WHEN YOU MADE THIS PHONE CALL? 09:45:13 5 WE HAD ENGAGED AT THE BEGINNING OF THE YEAR 09:45:13 5 A I'M NOT REFERRING TO ONE PHONE CALL. I114 6 GEORGE SMITH, WE HAD ENGAGED A GUY NAMED ALLAY FRIEDMAN, 6 REFERRING TO PERHAPS SEVERAL PHONE CALLS IN WHICH 7 WE HAD ENGAGED MICHAEL HACRMAN, AND I THINK SEAN WAS THE 7 MR. GILFENBAIN TOLD MR "YOU BETTER FIGURE OUT HOW TO GET 8 LAST IN THE GROUP THAT WE TOOK A STAB AT TO SEE IF 8 US OUT OF THIS WITH WELLS FARGO AND YOU BETTER FIND A 9 SOMEBODY COULD COME UP WITH A SUM OF MONEY TO TAKE OUT 9 NEW LOAN WHILE THE MARKET ALLOWS US TO PERHAPS BUY THIS 10 WELLS. 10 AT A DISCOUNTED PAYOFF." 09:15:13 11 WE REALIZED -- WE SOON BEGAN TO REALIZE THAT 09: 45:13 11 AND I RECALL MR. GILFENBAIN IMPLORING ME, HE 12 THE STATE OF THE PROJECT AND THE STATE OF THE MARKET WAS 12 WAS -- HE'S A BIT OF A SCREAMER AND I REMEMBER HIM 13 NOT GOING TO LINE UP TO DO THAT AND WE WERE GOING TO 13 SCREAMING "DON'T RELY ON WELLS TO EXTEND OUR LOAN. YOU 14 HAVE TO DO A NEW LOAN WITH WELLS FARGO, WHICH WE DID, 14 BETTER HAVE ANOTHER OPTION•° 15 AND WE WORKED ON FOR WELL OVER A YEAR. 09:45:13 15 AND I HAD EXPLAINED TO MR. GILFENBAIN WE HAD 09:15:13 16 Q BY MR. RUBINER: AND WHEN DID YOU FIRST DISCUSS 16 TRIED ALREADY WITH THREE. HE SAID 'TRY AGAIN. MARKETS 17 EMPLOYING MR. DALESANDRO? 17 CHANGE. FIND SOMEBODY WHO COULD TAP INTO A NEW LENDER." 09:15:13 18 A MUST HAVE BEEN SOMETIME AROUND THE END OF 18 AND THAT WAS THE IMPETUS OF HIRING SEAN. I 19 SUMMER, 2010. 19 NEVER BELIEVED HE COULD GET AN AMOUNT TO TAKE OJT THE 09:45:13 20 Q AND HAD MR. DALESANDRO ALREADY BEEN 20 BANK. 21 UNSUCCESSFUL WITH ROYAL CANYON? 09:45:13 21 Q DID MR. -- DID YOU EVER DISCUSS MR. DALESANDRO 09:15:13 22 A I DON'T THINK SO, I THINK THEY OVERLAPPED. I 22 WITH MR. GILFENBAIN? 23 DON'T THINK IT BLEW UP YET, 09:45:13 23 A YES. 09:15:13 24 Q DO YOU RECALL THE FIRST TIME YOU DISCUSSED THE 09:45:13 24 Q WHEN? 25 PALM DESERT PROJECT WITH MR. DALESANDRO? 09:45:13 25 A AUGUST/SEPTEMBER, 2C10. 1181 1201 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 31 PAGE 121 PAGE 123 09:45:13 1 Q 50 DURING THESE CONVERSATIONS WHEN 00:45:13 1 Q OFAY. 2 MR. GILFENBAIN SAID NOT TO RELY ON WELLS, YOU SAID HE 09:45:13 2 COULD YOU TAKE A LOOK AT EXHIBIT 6 AND REVIEW 3 WAS YELLING, DO YOU RECALL DISCUSSING MR. DALESANDRO 3 IT AND LET ME KNOW WHEN YOU FINISH. 4 SPECIFICALLY DURING ANY OF THOSE CONVERSATIONS? 09:45:13 4 A OKAY. 09:15:13 5 A YES. 09;45:13 5 Q DO YOU RECOGNIZE EXHIBIT 6? D9:45:13 6 Q WHAT DID YOU SAY ABOUT MR. DALESANDRO? 09:45:13 6 A I'VE SEEN SOMETHING LIKE THIS BEFORE. I CAN'T 09:45:13 7 A I SAID THAT HE HAD SENT SOME INFORMATION TO A 7 TELL YOU IF IT'S THE PRECISE DOCUMENT, 8 LENDER -- I'M NOT SURE IF THEY'RE A LENDER. IT'S 09:45:13 8 Q AND YOU SAID YOU E-MAILED A COPY OF -- STRIKE 9 PROBABLY MORE JUST CAPITAL. I DON'T THINK IT'S A 9 THAT, 10 TRADITIONAL LENDER. MY RECOLLECTION WAS, IT WAS CANYON 09:15:13 10 WHAT IS EXHIBIT 6? 11 CAPITAL, 09:45:13 11 A CONSULTING AND ADVISORY AGREEMENT. 09:95:13 12 AND CANYON HAD TAKEN INTEREST, INTEREST IN THE 09:45:13 12 Q IS THAT BETWEEN VINEYARDS AND PARALLEL REAL 13 PROJECT AND I HAD MET WITH CANYON IN THAT CANYON WAS 13 ESTATE ADVISORS? IS THAT RIGHT? 14 SENDING SOMEBODY TO THE SITE AND THAT CANYON WAS DOING 09:15:13 14 A WELL, IT'S AN UNSIGNED VERSION OF AN AGREEMENT, 15 THEIR UNDERWRITING AND WE'LL SEE WHEN, IF AND WHEN A 15 I HAVE NO IDEA IF THIS IS THE ACTUAL AGREEMENT I SIGNED, 16 TERM SHEET COMES WHAT THEY'RE INTERESTE➢ IE DOING. 16 I WOULD SIGN AN AGREEMENT IF I WAS READY TO EXECUTE IT. 09:45:13 11 Q DO YOU RECALL MENTIONING MR. DALESANDRO'S NAME 09:45:13 17 Q SO, WELL, YOU SAID YOU SENT AN UNSIGNED VERSION 18 DURING THAT CONVERSATION? 18 TO YOUR PARTNERS. 01:45:13 19 A I DON'T KNOW IF I MENTIONED PARALLEL OR SEAN. 09:45:13 19 IS THAT RIGHT? 09;45:13 20 Q DO YOU RECALL MENTIONING EITHER? 09:45:13 20 A THAT'S RIGHT, 09:45:13 21 A I SENT THE AGREEMENT BEFORE I SIGNED IT TO BOTH 09:45:13 21 Q AND YOU SAID YOU SENT IT BY E-MAIL? 22 OF MY PARTNERS VIA E-MAIL SO I WOULD SAY YES, T DO 09:45;13 22 A CORRECT. 23 RECALL A REFERENCE TO THE NAME. 09:45:13 23 Q DID EITHER PARTNER EVER RESPOND TO THE E-MAIL? 09:41:13 24 Q SO YOU RECALL SENDING AN UNSIGNED COPY OF THE 09:45:13 24 A YES, 25 AGREEMENT TO BOTH PARTNERS PRIOR TO YOUR SIGNING IT? 09:45:13 25 Q WHO RESPONDED? 121 123 PAGE 122 PAGE 129 09:15:13 1 A YES, 09:45:13 1 A KAMBIZ K41DAR RESPONDED AND SAID IF THIS IS 09:45:13 2 MR. RUBINER: I'M GOING TO ASK THE COURT REPORTER 2 WHAT YOU WANT TO DO I AM FINE WITH THAT AND SUBSEQUENT 3 TO MARK AS EXHIBIT 6 A MULTI -PAGE DOCUMENT TITLED 3 TO THAT THEN ASKED ME FOR A PACKAGE IF ONE WAS PUT 4 CONSULTING AND ADVISORY AGREEMENT, ASK HER TO HAND THAT 4 TOGETHER FROM -- BY THE BROKER TO GIVE TO POTENTIAL 5 TO THE WITNESS. 5 FINANCIERS. 09:15:13 5 MR. BISNO: THANK YOU. 09:45:13 6 Q DID MR. GILFENBAIN EVER RESPOND TO YOUR E-MAIL? 09:45:13 7 (WHEREUPON, THE ABOVE -MENTIONED DOCUMENT WAS 09;45:13 7 A YES. 8 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION BY THE SHORTHAND REPORTER AND 09:45:13 8 Q AND DID -- I'M SORRY. DID MR. KAMDAR RESPOND 9 ATTACHED 0ET01, 9 BY E-MAIL? 09:45:13 10 Q BY MR. RUBINER: NOW, DID YOU EARLIER 09:45:13 10 A YEAH. 11 SAY -- BEFORE WE GET TO EXHIBIT 6 -- THAT WHILE YOU 09:45:13 11 Q WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME YOU SAW THAT E-MAIL? 12 HOPED MR. DALESANDRO WOULD BE SUCCESSFUL, YOU DIDN'T 09:45:13 12 A I DON'T RECALL. 13 ACTUALLY THINK THAT HE WOULD BE SUCCESSFUL AS THE OTHER 09:45:13 13 Q DO YOU STILL HAVE A COPY OF IT? 14 THREE PEOPLE YOU HAD CONTACTED FAILED? IS THAT RIGHT? 09:45:13 14 A I DON'T KNOW. 09:45:13 15 A NO. THAT MISSTATES WHAT I -- MY INTENT OF MY 09:15:13 15 Q HAVE YOU LOOKED FOR A COPY OF IT SINCE THIS 16 STATEMENT WAS, IT WASN'T THAT THERE WEREN'T ANY LENDER 16 LITIGATION WAS FILED? I FINANCIER THAT WOULDN'T LOAN MONEY ON THIS ASSET. 09:45:13 17 A AS I TESTIFIED BEFORE, I DIDN'T LOOK FOR 18 EVERY -- IT'S A CLASS A BRAND-NEW APARTMENT BUILDING, 18 ANYTHING. RACHEL PRODUCED THE DOCUMENTS. 19 CLASS A RETAIL, ANYBODY COULD GET A LOAN FROM ANY 09:45:13 19 Q HOW DO YOU KNOW RACHEL PRODUCED THE DOCUMENTS? 20 ENTITY. IT WAS MORE ABOUT THE LOAN AMOUNT. AND I 09:45:13 20 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT THAT YOUR 21 WASN'T CONVINCED THAT THE MATRIX WOULD LINE UP, THAT THE 21 ANSWER WOULD CALL FOR YOU TO REVEAL SPOUSAL 22 LOAN AMOUNT FROM THE NEW FINANCING WOULD BE SUFFICIENT 22 COMMUNICATION, AND IF IT WILL THEN I AM INSTRUCTING YOU 23 TO PAY OFF 'WELLS FARGO. 23 NOT TO ANSWER. 09:15:13 24 Q WAIT A MINUTE. WHICH DOCUMENT DID I GIVE YOU? 09:45:13 24 MR. RUBINER: I WOULD POINT OUT, COUNSEL, "HAT TO 09:15:13 25 A (INDICATING). 25 THE EXTENT THERE WOULD HAVE BEEN ANY PRIVILEGE RELATED i22 129 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 32 PAGE 125 PAGE 127 1 TO THAT HE WAIVED IT BY VOLUNTARILY DISCUSSING PART OF 1 SIGN THIS EXHIBIT 7 ON OR ABOUT SEPTEMBER 20TH, 2010? 2 THAT CONVERSATION THAT RACHEL PRODUCED THE DOCUMENTS, SO 09:45:13 2 A N0, 3 ANY PRIVILEGE WOULD OTHERWISE BE WAIVED. 09:45:13 3 Q AND DID YOU EVER DISCUSS EXHIBIT 7 WITH 09:45:13 4 MR. BISNO: I DISAGREE AND MY INSTRUCTION STANDS. 4 MR, DALESANDRD PRIOR TO YOUR SIGNING IT ON OR ABOUT 09:45:13 5 THE WITNESS; I RECALL TELLING RACHEL TO PRODUCE 5 SEPTEMBER 20TH, 2010? 6 THE DOCUMENTS AS REQUIRED IN THE SUBPOENA. 09:45:13 6 A LIKELY. 09:45:13 7 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHEN DID YOU TELL RACHEL THAT? 09:45:13 7 Q WHEN WAS THE FIRST TIME YOU DISCUSSED EXHIBIT 7 D9:45:13 8 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT AS I HAD 8 WITH MR. UALESANDRO? 9 EARLIER ADVISED YOU THAT ANSWERING THE QUESTION WLL 09:45:13 9 A I HAVE NO DEFINITIVE RECOLLECTION OF A SPECIFIC 10 CAUSE YOU TO REPORT SPOUSAL COMMUNICATIONS. 10 CONVERSATION. 09:45:13 li THE WITNESS: I DON'T RECALL. 09:45:13 Il Q HOW MANY CONVERSATIONS DO YOU BELIEVE YOU HAD 09:45:13 12 MR. RUBINER; LET'S TAKE A FIVE-MINUTE BREAX. 12 WITH MR. DALESANDRD ABOUT EXHIBIT 7? 09:15:13 13 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: WE'RE OFF THE RECORD 2:32 P.M. 09:45:13 13 A TWO OR THREE. 09:15:13 14 (RECESS HELD). 09:45:13 14 Q WHEN WAS THE FIRST CONVERSATION YOU HAD? 09:45:13 IS THE VIDEOGRAPHER: WE'RE ON THE RECORD 2:45 P.M. 09:45:13 15 MR, BISND: OBJECTION. ASKED AND ANSWERED. THE 09:45:13 16 Q BY MR. RUBINER: LET'S GO BACK ON THE RECORD. 16 WITNESS TESTIFIED HE HAS NO DEFINITIVE RECOLLECTION OF 09:45:13 11 OFF THE RECORD I ASKED THE COURT REPORTER TO 17 ANY CONVERSATION. 18 MARK AS EXHIBIT 7 A MULTI -PAGE -- 09:45:13 16 THE WITNESS: I RECOLLECT TELLING MR. DALESANDRD D9:45:13 19 MR. BISNO: THANK YOU, 19 THAT WE HAD A LOAN WITH WELLS FARGO, THE LOAN HAD COME 09:45:13 20 MR. RUBINER: -- DOCUMENT TITLED CONSULTING AND 20 DUE FEBRUARY OF 2010, WE WERE DISCUSSING THE LOAN WITH 21 ADVISORY AGREEMENT AND ASKED HER TO HAND THAT TO THE 21 THE LOAN OFFICERS AND TRYING TO GET TO A RESOLUTION. 22 WITNESS. 22 THEIR RESOLUTION WAS TO HAVE US EXTEND THE LOAN, 09:45:13 23 (WHEREUPON, THE ABOVE -MENTIONED DOCUMENT WAS 23 STABILIZE THE ASSET AND SEE WHERE WE ARE IN A FEW YEARS, 24 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION BY THE SHORTHAND REPORTER AND 09:45:13 24 OUR INITIAL RESOLUTION WAS TO BRING NEW MONEY 25 ATTACHED BERETS). 25 AND WE HAD HIRED AT LEAST TWO BROKERS BEFORE SEAN AND 125 1 127 PAGE 126 PAGE 128 D9:45:13 1 THE WITNESS: YOU SAID -- THIS IS SIX. DID YOU 1 DECIDED TO HIRE A THIRD TO FIND NEW MONEY TO SEE IF WE 2 JUST SAY SEVEN? ON. I'M SORRY. 2 COULD GET TO AN AMOUNT POSSIBLY THE PARTNERSHIP WOULD 09:45:13 3 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DO YOU HAVE EXHIBIT 7 IN FRONT 3 PUT SOME EQUITY ON TOP OF IT, AS WELL, AND BE IN A 4 OF YOU? - 4 POSITION TO CO A DISCOUNTED PAYOFF WITH WELLS. 09:45:13 5 A I DO. 09:45:13 5 AS I TESTIFIED EARLIER, I WAS SKEPTICAL THAT 09:15:13 6 Q TURN TO THE LAST PAGE OF EXHIBIT 7, DO YOU 6 THE NEW MONEY WOULD GET TO A PLACE THAT WOULD BE 7 HAVE THE LAST PAGE IN FRONT OF YOU? 7 SUFFICIENT OR CLOSE TO IT BASED ON HAVING SPOKE TO A 09:45:13 8 A I DO. 8 COUPLE OTHER BROKERS AND MAYBE EVEN SIGNING AN AGREEMENT 09:15:13 9 Q YOU'LL SEE THERE'S A SIGNATURE ON THAT PAGE, 9 WITH ANOTHER BROKER TO GO GET NEW MONEY. 10 DO YOU SEE THAT? 09:45:13 10 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WHO WAS THE -- WHEN YOU SAY 09:45:13 11 A I DO. 11 'MAYBE EVEN SIGNING AN AGREEMENT,° WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY 09:45:13 12 Q DO YOU RECOGNIZE THAT SIGNATURE? 12 TEAT? 09:45:13 13 A I DO. 09:45:13 13 A I THINK WE SIGNED AN AGREEMENT WITH GEORGE 09:45:13 14 Q WHOSE SIGNATURE IS THAT? 14 SMITH. 09:45:13 15 A THAT'S MINE. 09:45:13 15 Q WHEN DID YOU SIGN AN AGREEMENT WITH GEORGE 09:45:13 16 Q OKAY. 16 SMITH? 09:45:13 17 AND YOU SEE NEXT TO THAT THERE IS A 9/20AD? 09:45:13 17 A WOULD HAVE BEEN MID SPRING, SAY MARCH OR APRIL 18 DO YOU SEE THAT? 18 OF 2010. 09:15:13 19 A I DO, 09:45:13 19 Q WAS MR, SMITH -- STRIKE THAT. IS GEORGE SMITH 09:45:13 20 Q AND DID YOU WRITE THAT ON EXHIBIT 7? 20 A PERSON OR A COMPANY? D9:45:13 21 A IT SURE LOOKS LIKE MY HANDWRITING. 09:45:13 21 A GEORGE PASSED AWAY A30UT FIVE YEARS AGO. IT 09:45:13 22 Q AND IS IT YOUR PRACTICE TO HANDWRITE A DATE THE 22 USED TO BE A COMPANY AND NOW IT'S -- IT'S A COMPANY. 23 SAME DAY THAT YOU ACTUALLY SIGN THE DOCUMENT? 09:45:13 23 Q 50 RHO AT GEORGE SMITH IN THE SPRING OF 2010 09:15:13 24 A YES. 24 WAS IT THAT YOU MERE WORKING WITH? 09:45:13 25 Q DO YOU HAVE ANY REASON TO BELIEVE YOU DIDN'T 09:45:13 25 A GEORGE SMITH HAD, WAS THE BROKER WHO 3ROUGHT US 126 128 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 SHEET 1 2 3 45:13 :15:13 7 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 25 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 33 PAGE 129 PAGE TO WELLS FARGO IN 2005 TO GET THE INITIAL LOAN. THAT 09:45:13 1 GENTLEMAN WAS A GUY NAMED NOAH. I CAN'T REMEMBER NDAH'S 2 LAST NAME, NOAH LEFT THE COMPANY. SO WE WERE WORKING 3 WITH ONE OF THE PRINCIPALS, STEVE BRAM, TO FIND MONEY TO 4 TAKE OUT WELLS, 5 THEY BELIEVED BASED ON WHAT THEY HAD BEEN 6 HEARING IN THE MARKET IT WAS FEASIBLE, SO WE WERE 7 PLAYING A GAME WITH THE BANK TO A CERTAIN DEGREE THAT WE 8 COULD OUTLAST THEM AND THEY'D COME TO THE TABLE AND WE'D 9 BE IN A SITUATION WHERE WE COULD RECEIVE A DISCOUNT. 10 Q WAS GEORGE SMITH STILL WORKING ON OBTAINING 11 FINANCING WHEN YOU ENTERED INTO EXHIBIT 7 WITH 12 MR. DAIESANDRO? 13 A I THINK THEY WERE JUST COMING TO THE END OF 09:45:13 14 HAVING TOLD US WE COULDN'T GET YOU TO THE NUMBER THAT 15 THE GROUP BELIEVED WAS REQUIRED TO TREE OUT THE LENDER, 16 WHICH WE THOUGHT STARTED WITH A FOUR IN FRONT OF IT, 17 FOLLY UNDERSTANDING THE LOAN WAS $51,350,000, THAT WE 09:95:13 18 NEEDED AT LEAST FORTY PLUS SOME EQUITY FROM THE PARTNERS 09: 19 WE MIGHT GET TO A POINT WHERE THE NEW MONEY ANN THE 20 EQUITY COULD TAKE OUT THE LENDER. 21 SO TOWARDS THE -- WHEN I HAD SET SEAN IT WAS 22 COMING TO AN END WHERE THEY HAD SORT OF RUN OUT OF 23 DIFFERENT FINANCIERS TO GO TO. Q AFTER SIGNING EXHIBIT 7, DID SINATRA COOK WORK 95:13 25 131 A PARALLEL WORKED ON THIS FOR SUCH A SNORT AMOUR' OF TIM1IE AND CAME AND REPORTED BACK TO ME AFTER MEETING WITH CANYON THAT THERE WAS SUCH A BIG DELTA BETWEEN WHAT WE NEEDED AND NEW MONEY TO TAKE OUT WELLS AND BETWEEN WHAT WAS AVAILABLE IN THE MARKETPLACE THAT THIS WAS ABSOLUTELY FUTILE. I'G SAY HE WORKED ON THIS SOMEWHERE BETWEEN TEN DAYS AND TGl0 iVfiENS AND CAME BACK TO ME. IT BECAME A FAIT ACCO}1P1I AFTER CANYON CAME BACK WITH A VERY S14A11 NUMBER. I'D SAY IT WAS 31, 32, I DON'T EVER REMEMBER IF THEY PDT IT IN WRITING. MAYBE THEY DID. BUT THERE WAS A HUGE CHASM BETWEEN THAT WE NEEDED TO TAKE OUT W%1L5 AND BETWEEN WHAT WAS AVAILABLE, SD HE STOPPED WORKING ON THIS VERY QUICKLY. SO IT'S VERY POSSIBLE BARCLAY'S, AFTER IT WAS REPORTED TO ME THAT SEAN WAS NO LONGER WOR%LNG ON THIS, iVAS ONE OF THE LAST DITCH EFFORTS BY Ot1E OF THE PARTNERS TO SEE IF WE COULD GET NEW CAPITAL TO TAKE OUT WELLS. Q AND THE BARCLAY'S LOAN DIDN'T WORK OUT, EITHER? A SIM1IIIAR PR08LEM. IT WASN'T IT CIDE''T WORK OUT, THERE WAS MONEY THERE. THERE WAS SIGNIFICANT MONEY. BUT IT JUST COULD NEVER GET TO A POINT WHERE WE -- WHEN WE WENT IK'TO THE VINEYARDS DEAL WE THOUGHT IT WOULD BE WORTH $80 MILLION AND WE'D TAKE OUT THE CONBTROCTIOA LENDER WITH A $60 MILLION LOAN AND IT WAS GOING TO HE EASY, BUT THE MARKET CHANGED, CONDITIONS CHANGED AND WE PAGE 130 PAGE 132 1 WITH ANY OTHER PEOPLE TO ATTEMPT TO ARRANGE FOR 1 WERE HEARING PREVIOUS TO ENGAGING PARALLEL AND POST 2 FINANCING? 2 PARALLEL THAT 3U-, 32 MILLION IN NEW MONEY WAS THE ON1Y 09:45:13 3 A I RECALL THAT NAMBIZ KAMDAR HAD TOLD ME HE WAS 3 THING OUT THERE AND WE WERE FORCED EITHER TO HAVE THE 9 SPEAKING TO SOME LENDERS. I DON'T BELIEVE GILFENBAIN 4 LENDER GIVE US AN EXAh1INATiON OF OUR FINANCES AND COME S DIRECTLY WAS SPEAKING TO ANY LENDERS ALTHOUGH NIS FRIEIID 5 AFTER US FOR OUR GUARANTEES OR SIGN AN EXTENSION ON THE 6 IS MICHAEL NACKI4AN AND I THINK HACKMAN HAD BEEN SPEAKING 6 EXISTING LOAN, AND WE ALL DETERMINEG THE WOR1D WOULD 7 TO SOME LENDERS, I SPECIFICALLY REMEMBER BARCLAY'S. 7 LOOK BETTER IN THREE PEARS AND THE OCCUPANCY WOULD GO UP 09:95:13 8 Q WHEN DID MR. HACKMAN SPEAK WITH BARCLAY'S? 6 AND RENTS WOULD GO UP AND IT WAS THE WAY TO GO BECAUSE A 09:95:13 9 A IT WAS IN THIS TIME FRAME, EARLY/MID FALL. 9 DISCOUNTED PAYOFF CLEARLY WASN'T WORKING. 09:45:13 10 Q WAS THAT AFTER SEPTEMBER 20, 2007? 09:95:13 ID AND BE AWARE, WE HAD BEEN WORKING WITS THIS, 09:95:13 11 A COULD HAVE BEEN. 11 WITH WELLS REALLY FROM NOUEMBER, 2009. THEY SAID HEY, 09:45:13 12 Q AND DD YOU REVIEW EXHIBIT 7 PRIOft TO SIGNING 12 GUYS, YOU'RE 10AN'S COMING DUE IN FEBRUARY 2010. WHAT 13 IT? 13 ARE YOU GOING TO DO? 09:45:13 14 A YES, 09:95:13 14 AND SO WE HAD WORKED WITH THEM FOR OVER A YEAR 09:45:13 15 Q IF YOU COULD TURN TO THE FIRST PAGE OF EXHIBIT 15 AND PLAYED -- MADE OFFERS, TRIED TO GET NEW MONEY AND WE 16 1 THERE'S A PROVISION ON THE LEFT. IT SAYS 16 COULD NEVER GET THEM TO A PLACE, APID IT WAS ESSENTIALLY 09:95:13 17 °EXCLUSIVITY." 11 BECAUSE THE GUARANTORS WERE SOLVENT. WELLS FIGURED WE 09:95:13 18 DID YOU HAVE ANY UNDERSTANDING AS TO WHETHER 16 HAD AN ASSET BUT WE ALSO HAD GUARANTORS THAT HAD LOTS OF 19 YOU ENTERED INTO AN EXCLUSIVE RELATIONSHIP WITH 19 MONEY SO 'WHY GIVE UP, WHY DO A DISCOUNT➢ PAYOFF. IF 20 :4R. GALESANDRO'S FIRM? 20 THIS MAD BEEN A COUPLE OF GUYS WHO HAD NO ASSETS 'a'E 09:45:13 21 MR, BISNO: OBJECTION. THE DOCUMENT SPEAKS FOR 21 PROBABLY WOULD HAVE GOTTEN THERE BUT NEVER WORKED OUT. 22 ITSELF. THE DOCUMENT'S BETWEEN VINEYARG I6VEST14ENTS 22 SO NOVEMBER, 2009 TO PROBABLY CCTOBER, 2010 WE AGREED TO 23 AND, ALTHOUGH NOT SIGNED, I ASSUME, PARALLEL REAL ESTATE 23 PLAY BALL WITH THEM. 29 ADVISORS. 09:45:13 29 WHEN SEAN CAME AROUND IT WAS A LAST-DITCH 09:95:13 25 Q BY MR. RUBINER: YOU CAN ANSWER THE QUESTION. 25 EFFORT, YET ANOTHER PERSON TO TRY TO FIND MONEY. AFTER 130 132 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 34 PAGE 133 PAGE 135 1 A WEEK OR SO REALI2ED IT WASN'T GOING TO HAPPEN. WE 1 HAVE TO REVEAL ATTORNEY -CLIENT COMMUNICATION, OBJECTION 2 SIGNED AN LOI WITH WELLS AND WE WORKED ON THE EXTENSION 2 TO THE EXTENT YOU WOULD HAVE TO REVEAL SPOUSAL 3 LANGUAGE FOR THE LOAN FOR PROBABLY FIVE MONTHS, SIX 3 COMMUNICATION. 4 MONTHS UNTIL WE ACTUALLY SIGNED IT. 09:45:13 4 THE WITFIESS: I DO NOT. 09:45:13 5 Q DID ANYONE AT SINATRA COOK EVER TELL YOU THAT 09:45:13 5 Q BY MR. RUBINER: IN THE FALL -- SO IS IT 6 THEY WERE RELYING OH PARALLEL TO FIND A NEW LOAN FOR, TO 6 YOUR - I THINK YOU SAID THAT YOU BELIEVED 7 TAKE OUT THE WELLS FARGO LOAN? 7 MR. DALESANDRO ONLY WORKED ON OBTAINING A NEW LOAN FOR 09:45:13 B MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. HEARSAY, B SINATRA COOK FOR A FEW WEEKS IN SEPTEMBER OF 2010. 09:45:13 9 THE WITNESS: AS I TESTIFIED, SEAN WAS WAY DOWN THE 09:45:13 9 IS THAT RIGHT? 10 ROAD AFTER A YEAR OF TRYING TO FIND MONEY TO TAKE OUT 09:45:13 10 A I TESTIFIED ORE OR TWO, NOT A FEW. 11 WELLS. CERTAINLY MYSELF AND EAMDAR STARTED TO REALIZE 09:45:13 11 Q ONE OR TWO WEEKS, 12 THE EXTENSION WAS THE ONLY OPTION. GILFENBAIN, I THINK, 09:45:13 12 DID YOU CONTINUE TO DO WORK WITH 13 GOT TO THAT DECISION A LITTLE BIT LATER BUT ONCE WE 13 MR. DALESANDRO? 14 SIGNED AN AGREEMENT WITH WELLS THAT WAS THE ONLY COURSE 09:45:13 14 A I BELIEVE THE ROYAL CANYON WAS ONGOING UNTIL, 15 HE WOULD TALK ABOUT, FOCUS PURELY ON EXTENDING THAT LOAN 15 SAY, LATE OCTOBER/EARLY NOVEMBER WHERE WE WERE STILL 16 AND SEEING WHAT HAPPENS IN THREE YEARS. 16 TRYING TO CONVINCE THE SELLERS OF THE LAND TO STAY WITH 09:15:13 17 Q 41HEN YOU SAY 'HE,' YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT 17 ME BECAUSE I REFUSED TO AT THAT POINT HAVE MY DEPOSITS 18 MR. GILFENBAIN? 1B GO HARD AND AT THE SAME TIME WE WERE CONVINCING A 09:45:13 19 A YES. 19 CAMPAIGN OF, TRYING TO CONVINCE ROCKPOINT CAPITAL TO 09:45:13 20 Q MR. GILFENBAIN EVER TELL YOU HE WAS RELYING ON 20 HONOR A TERM SHEET THEY HAD MADE TO FINANCE THE PROJECT. 21 MR. DALESANDRO OR PARALLEL TO OBTAIN A NEW LOAN? 09:45:13 21 Q WHO FOUND ROCKPOINT CAPITAL? 09:45:13 22 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION, HEARSAY, 09:45:13 22 A TODD EBERSTEIN. 09:45:13 23 THE WITNESS: I DON'T RECALL THAT SPECIFICALLY. I 09:45:13 23 Q AND WHEN DID YOU WORK WITH MR. EBERSTEIN? 24 DO RECALL WAITING TO HEAR BACK FROM THE GUYS AT CANYON 09:45:13 24 A I'VE KNOWN TODD FOR SEVERAL YEARS. 25 WHICH PARALLEL HAD INTRODUCED TO THE DEAL AND I REMEMBER 09:45:13 25 Q WAS MR, EBERSTEIN WORKING ON OBTAINING 1331 1 135 PAGE 134 PAGE 136 1 GILFENBAIN ASKING ME A COUPLE TIMES DO WE HAVE A NUMBER, 1 FINANCING AT THE SAME TIME MR. DALESANDRO WAS? 2 DO WE HAVE A NUMBER, AND I REMEMBER HIM GIVING ME A 09:45:13 2 A I WOULDN'T SAY HE WAS WORKING ON OBTAINING 3 COUPLE SWEAR FIORDS WHEN I TOLD HIM IT WAS NOT A NUMBER 3 FINANCING. I WOULD SAY HE WAS FRIENDS WITH THE 4 THAT WAS GOING TO MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE AND GET US OUT OF 4 PRINCIPALS OF ROCKPOINT AND KNEW I WAS LOOKING TO 5 THIS PROBLEM WITH WELLS. 5 FINANCE A DEAL SO NE HAD SPOKEN TO THAT ONE AND ONLY 09:15:13 6 Q AND ULTIMATELY THE, THERE WAS A NEW LOAN WITH 6 COMPANY AND WAS ABLE TO CONVINCE THEM TO GO FORWARD WITH 7 WELLS; IS THAT RIGHT? 7 AN LOI. 09:45:13 B A I DON'T KNOW IF YOU CALL IT A NEW LOAN. IT WAS 09:45:13 8 THEY FOLLOWED UP WITH JV AGREEMENTS AND THERE 9 AN EXISTING LOAN. WE HAD TO PUT UP AT LEAST THREE 9 WAS A DISPUTE OVER WHO WAS OWED THE FEE. I BELIEVED IT 10 MORE -- $3 MILLION AS PART OF IT TO EXTEND THE LOAN, SO 10 DIDN'T MATTER TO ME. I WAS GOING TO HONOR THE PARALLEL 11 I WOULDN'T SAY IT WAS A NEW LOAN, IT WAS AN EXTENSION 11 FEE AGREEMENT AND I KEPT SEAN AWARE OF THAT. TODD WAS 12 OF A FOUR -YEAR -OLD LOAN WHICH REQUIRED US TO PUT UP 12 GOING TO NEED TO GET PAID BUT HE WAS CERTAINLY THE GO 13 SOMEWHERE BETWEEN 3- AND $5 MILLION. 13 BETWEEN BETWEEN 14E AND ROCKPOINT. HE WAS SPEAKING TO 09:15:13 14 Q WHEN YOU SAY 'US,' DID YOU PERSONALLY PUT UP 14 KYLE GARDNER, A GUY NAMED ARIV I THINK HIS NAME IS, 15 ANY OF THAT MONEY? 09:45:13 15 AND -- BUT IT DIDN'T MATTER, I HAD SIGNED AN AGREEMENT 09:45:13 16 A MO. AS I TESTIFIED BEFORE, IN EXCHANGE FOR 16 FOR THE ROCKPOINT WITH PARALLEL AND IT WAS 11 GILFENBAIN PUTTING UP THE MONEY HE SIGNED AN INDEMNITY 17 INCONSEQUENTIAL TO 14E AT THAT TIME THAT TODD HAD BROUGHT 18 AGREEMENT AGAINST ANY CLAIMS RELATED TO THE SINATRA 6 18 IT. I WAS STILL GOING TO -- IT WAS CONSEQUENTIAL TO NE 19 COOK PROJECT. 19 BUT I WAS STILL GOING TO PAY SEAN A FEE AND I TOLD HIM 09:45:13 20 Q HAVE YOU EVER MADE ANY CLAIMS ON THE INDEMNITY 20 THAT. 21 LANGUAGE? 09:45:13 21 Q DID ROC{POINT GO FORWARD WITH THE DEAL? 09:45:13 22 A NO. 09:45:13 22 A NO, 09:45:13 23 Q WAS, DO YOU KNOW IF A NEW DEED OF TRUST 41AS 09:45:13 23 Q DID ANYONE EVER TELL YOU WHY? 24 FILED ON THE WELLS LOAN? 09:45:13 24 A YES, 09:45:13 25 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT THAT YOU WILL 09:45:13 25 Q WHY WERE YOU TOLD THAT ROCKPOINT WOULDN'T GO 139 136'.. Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 35 PAGE 137 PAGE 139 1 FORWARD? 1 CAPITAL FOR FEAR THAT THESE DEALS CAN ALWAYS GO SIDEWAYS 09:45:13 2 A IT HAD TO DO WITH THE DISCRETIONARY NATURE OF 2 ONCE SOMEBODY TAKES A LOOK AT IT. 3 THE ENTITLEMENTS, THE PASSAGE WHILE UNDER CONTRACT OF A 09:45:13 3 Q AND 0-1 DO YOU KNOW THAT MR. DALESANDRO STOPPED 4 NEW ORDINANCE WITHIN THE CITY CALLED THE BASELINE 4 LOOKING FOR OTHER CAPITAL? 5 HILLSIDE ORDINANCE. THAT ORDINANCE IN A LOT OF WAYS 09:45:13 5 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. ASSUMES FACTS NOT IN 6 MAKES IT DIFFICULT TO EXPORT LARGE AMOUNTS OF DIRT FROM 6 EVIDENCE. 7 A -- FROM RIDGES. IT SEEKS TO KEEP THE LANDSCAPE THE 09:45:13 7 THE WITNESS: MY RECOLLECTION WAS HE WASN'T 8 SAME AS IT IS TODAY AND THEY DON'T WANT YOU TO TARE DOWN 8 REPORTING TO ME ANYTHING THAT WAS OCCURRING WITH ANOTHER 9 RIDGES, 9 ENTITY SO I CAME TO THE CONCLUSION BASED ON THAT LACK OF 09:41:13 10 THEY ALSO WANTED TO KEEP THE SIZE OF THE HOME 10 INFORMATION NOTHING WAS HAPPENING. 11 IN RELATION TO THE SIZE OF THE PARCEL DOWN TO A MINIMUM, 09:45:13 11 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID YOU EVER DISCUSS HAVING 12 COUPLED WITH THE FACT THAT THERE WAS EGRESS ISSUES ON 12 MR. DALESANDRO COME TO WORK FOR VINEYARDS? 13 THE SITE AND WHETHER OR NOT CERTAIN LOTS CONTAINED 09:45:13 13 A YES. 14 WITHIN THIS CONGLOMERATION OF LOTS ACTUALLY BAD A RIGHT 09:45:13 14 Q WHEN DID YOU HAVE THE FIRST DISCUSSION ABOUT 15 TO HAVE EGRESS AND, IN FACT, WERE LEGAL LOTS. 15 MR. DALESANDRO COMING TO WORK FOR VINEYARDS? 09:45:13 16 IT WAS A DIFFICULT ENTITLEMENT PLAY AND I THINK 09:45:13 16 A MY RECOLLECTION WAS EARLY DECEMBER, 2010 BUT I- I' ULTIMATELY THEY DECIDED IT JUST WAS 100 MUCH FOR THEM TO 17 WAS NEVER AS AN EMPLOYEE ON THE PAYROLL. IT WAS TO WORK 18 TAKE THE RISK. 18 IN THE CAPACITY AS AN INDEPENDENT CONSULTANT. 09:11:13 19 Q WEER DID THE NEW ORDINANCE COME UP? 09:45:13 19 Q WHERE WAS THE FIRST CONVERSATION YOU HAD WITH 09:15:13 20 A IT WAS SOMETIME IN THE FALL OF 2010. 2D MR. DA1ESANDRG IN DECEMBER OF 2010? 09:45:13 21 Q IS THAT AFTER YOU ENTERED INTO THE AGREEMENT 09:15:13 21 A I RECALL THERE'S A CAFE ON MELROSE AND HE HAD 22 'WITH PARALLEL? 22 COME TO ME AND SAID HE'S BROKE, HE CAN'T PAY HIS RENT 09:45:13 23 A YES. 23 AND AM I WILLING TO 00 SOMETHING TO HELP HIM. IT WAS 09:15:13 24 Q WERE YOU TOLD WHETHER ROCKPOINT HAD ANY OTHER 24 AFTER THE TIME THAT ROYAL CANYON WAS GONE. I HAD 25 ISSUES IN GOING FORWARD? 25 DECIDED NOT TO PURSUE IT. I CANCELLED THE CONTRACT, GUT '311 139 PAGE 138 PAGE 140 09:15:13 1 A I SIMPLY RECALL IT WAS ENTITLEMENT RISK. 1 MY DEPOSIT BACK, AND IT WOULD HAVE BEEN -- COULD HAVE 09:45:13 2 Q DID YOU BLAME M.R. DALESANDRO FOR NOT FINDING 2 BEEN VERY LATE NOVEMBER BUT IT NIGHT HAVE BEEN EARLY 3 ALTERNATE FINANCING? 3 DECEMBER, 2010. HE SAID HE WAS OUT OF OPTIONS, HE BAD 09:45:13 4 A AT THAT TIME I BELIEVE I TOLD HIM THAT IT WAS 1 4 NO MONEY AND WOULD I CONSIDER PUTTING UP SOME MONEY THAT 5 IRRESPONSIBLE OF HIM TO RELY ON THE FACT THAT SOMEBODY 5 HE WOULD THEN USE, HE WOULD REPAY. I THINK HE OFFERED 6 PRODUCED A TERM SHEET AND THAT HE SHOULD CONTINUE TO GO 6 ME A 50 PERCENT ON WHATEVER I GAVE HIM OF WHAT I PUT UP 7 OUT THERE AND FIND ALTERNATE SOURCES. 7 AND IT WOULD COME THROUGH EITHER A DEAL THAT HE WOULD D9:45:13 8 Q WHEN DID YOU HAVE THAT CONVERSATION? 8 FIND FINANCING FOR OR ANOTHER DEAL BE WAS WORKING ON. 09:45:13 9 A OCTOBER/NOVEMBER, 2010. 09:45:13 9 i WAS VERY RELUCTANT BUT I HAVE A TENDENCY TO 09:45:13 10 Q WHERE DID THE CONVERSATION TAKE PLACE? 10 DO THESE THINGS, MUCH TO THE CHAGRIN OF MY WIFE, WHERE I 09:45:13 11 A I THINK IT WAS JUST A TELEPHONE. 11 LOAN MONEY TO PEOPLE IN NEED AND SO I DID IT. 09:45:13 12 Q WHO WAS ON THE CALL? 09:45:13 12 Q SO Milt. DALESANDRO CAME TO YOU AND ASKED YOU FOR 09:45:13 13 A. MYSELF AND SEAN. 13 A LOAN? G9:45:13 14 Q HOW LONG DID THE CALL LAST? 09:45:13 14 A YES. 09:45:13 15 A I DON'T RECALL. 09:45:13 15 Q DID YOU DISCUSS -- DID YOU EVER SUGGEST TO 09:45:13 16 Q WHAT TOPICS WERE DISCUSSED ON THE CALL? 16 MR, DALESANDRO THAT HE WOULD BE THE CHIEF FINANCIAL 09:45:13 17 A AGAIN, YOUR QUESTIONING TENDS TO FOCUS ON ONE 17 OFFICER OF YOUR COMPANY? 18 SPECIFIC CALL, I THINK THERE WERE MORE THAN ONE CALL 09:45:13 18 A NOT IN THE SENSE THAT I OFFERED HIM THAT. 19 BUT IN GENERAL THE THEME WAS THAT JUST BECAUSE ROCKPOINT 09:45:13 19 Q DID YOU EVER CALL HIM THAT? 20 HAD MADE THIS OFFER THAT THERE WAS NO GUARANTEES TREY 09:45:13 20 A NOT THAT I RECALL. 21_ WERE GOING TO CLOSE, AND I HAD WARNED HIM THAI YOU 09:45:13 21 Q DID YOU EVER REQUEST ANYBODY PREPARE BUSINESS 22 SHOULD BE OUT THERE LOOKING FOR ADDITIONAL CAPITAL, AND 22 CARDS IDENTIFYING HIM AS CHIEF FINANCIAL OFFICER OF 23 I CERTAINLY WAS WILLING AND ABLE TO PROVIDE THE 23 VINEYARDS? 24 INFORMATION FOR A GROUP TO UNDERWRITE THE DEAL AND I WAS 09:45:13 24 A I DON'T KNOW IF THAT CAME UP BECAUSE 1 25 CERTAINLY WILLING TO ENGAGE IN DISCUSSIONS WITH NEW 25 REQUESTED IT, MY WIFE DECIDED TO DO IT OR MY WIFE SPOKE 1381 140 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 - SHEET 1 2 4 5: 13 3 15 13 45:13 45:13 4 5: 13 :45:13 :15:13 5 6 i 8 9 10 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 36 PAGE 141 TO SEAN AND THEY DECIDED TO DO IT. CERTAINLY, MY WIFE PREPARED THOSE CARDS. Q DID YOU EVER TELL YOUR WIFE -- DID YOU EXPECT MR. -- DID YOU EVER TELL MR. DALESANDRO NOT TO SHOW THOSE CARDS TO ANYONE? A I DON'T RECALL THAT. Q DID YOU EVER REQUEST THAT MR. DALESANDRO RETURN THE CARDS TO YOU? A I DO RECALL AFTER I TERMINATED THE RELATIONSHIP THAT THERE WAS SOME DIRECTION THAT YOU'RE -- YOU HAVE NO AFFILIATION AND DON'T REPRESENT YOU HAVE ANY AFFILIATION WITH VINEYARD. Q WHY -- DID YOU EVER APPROVE OF THE PREPARATION OF BUSINESS CARDS? A NO. Q NOW, DOES YOUR WIFE EVER TELL YOU WHY SHE WOULD PREPARE BUSINESS CARDS FOR MR. DALESANDRO IDENTIFYT_NG HIM AS CHIEF FINANCIAL OFFICER -- MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. Q BY MR. RUBINER: -- WHEN SHE WAS THE CHIEF FINANCIAL OFFICER OF THE COMPANY? MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. L DO NOT BELIEVE THAT IT'S POSSIBLE TO ANSWER THE QUESTION AS PHRASED WITHOUT REPORTING OR WITHOUT YOUR TESTIMONY INCLUDING WHAT YOU HEARD FROM YOUR WIFE AND THEREFORE I WILL INSTRUCT YOU PAGE :13 1 2 13 3 45:13 45:13 45:13 45:13 4 5: 13 45:13 45:13 :15 13 4 5 6 7 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 143 Q YOU SAID YOU SPOKE WITH YOUR BROTHERS; IS THAT CORRECT? A THAT I SAID. Q OKAY. WHICH BROTHERS DID YOU SPEAK WITH? A JEREMY, CRAIG. Q WAS IT ONE CONVERSATION OR SEPARATE CONVERSATIONS? A I THINK THERE WERE A COUPLE. Q WERE BOTH JEREMY AND CRAIG PRESENT FOR BOTH CONVERSATIONS? A INDIVIDUALLY, SEPARATE. Q WHEN WAS YOUR FIRST CONVERSATION WITH JEREMY WHERE YOU DISCUSSED MR. DALESANDRO BEING CFD OF VINEYARDS? A I NEVER ➢ISCUSSED HE WAS CFO, HE WOULD ASK ME ABOUT A BUSINESS CARD. I DISCUSSED WITH HIM WHY THE BUSINESS CARD CAME ABOUT, Q WHEN DID YOU HAVE A CONVERSATION WITH MR. JEREMY OGULNICK ABOUT A BUSINESS CARD? A IT WOULD HAVE BEEN, I BELIEVE, JANUARY, 2010. EXCUSE ME. '11, Q WHERE DID THE CONVERSATION TAKE PLACE? A AT HIS HOME. Q WHO WAS PRESENT? PAGE 142 PAGE 144 - NOT TO ANSWER THE QUESTION AS PHRASED. 09:45:13 1 A MY WIFE RACHEL. 09:45:13 2 THE WITNESS: CAN YOU RESTATE THE QUESTION? 09:45:13 2 Q ANYONE ELSE? 09:15:13 3 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DID ANYONE EVER 09:45:13 3 A I DON'T THINK 30. 4 QUESTION -- STRIKE THAT. 09:45:13 4 Q WHERE AT YOUR HOME DID THE CONVERSATION TARE 09:15:13 5 WHEN YOU FOUND OUT THAT MR. DALESANDRO HAD 5 PLACE? 6 BUSINESS CARDS THAT SAID HE WAS CHIEF FINANCIAL OFFICER, 09:45:13 6 A I SAID, AT HIS HOME, 7 DID YOU TELL HIM NOT TO DISTRIBUTE THEM TO ANYONE? 09:45:13 7 Q WHERE AT HIS HOME DID THE CONVERSATION TAKE 09:45:13 8 A I DON'T RECALL. 8 PLACE? 09:45:13 9 Q DID YOU RECALL EVER TELLING ANYONE THAT 09:45:13 9 A LIVING RODM. 10 MR. DALESANDRO WAS NOT THE CHIEF FINANCIAL OFFICER OF 09:15:13 10 Q HOW LONG DID THE CONVERSATION LAST? 11 VINEYARDS? 09:45:13 11 A 30 MINUTES. 09:45:13 12 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT -- PARDON ME, 09:45:13 12 Q WBAT TOPICS WERE DISCUSSED? 13 NO. I WITHDRAW TEE OBJECTION. 09:45:13 13 A SEAN'S MISREPRESENTATIONS THAT HE COULD 09:15:13 14 THE WITNESS: YES, 14 ACTUALLY GET CAPITAL FOR A DEAL, ANY DEAL AND HOW I HAD 09:15:13 15 Q BY MR, RUBINER: WHO? 15 FELT IN A WAY BETRAYED THAT HE CAME ACROSS TO PIE IN SUCH 09:15:13 16 A MY ATTORNEYS, MY WIFE, MY FAMILY, FRIENDS. 16 A WAY THAT HE WAS A PRO, HE WOULD SUCCEED, AND THE 09:45:13 17 MR. BISNO: I SHOULD HAVE ASSERTED THE OBJECTION. 11 ACTUAL RESULTS WERE HORRIFIC FOR ME AND MY COMPANY. NOT 09:45:13 18 Q BY MR, RUBINER: WHO IN YOUR FAMILY DID YOU 1B ONLY HAD HE FAILED ON ROYAL CANYON, HE FAILED ON IRE 19 TELL THAT MR, DALESANDRO WAS NOT THE CHIEF FINANCIAL 19 DESERT. NOW I HAD LENT HIM $32,000 AND HE WAS FAILING. 20 OFFICER? 20 I HAD DISCUSSED THIS WITH MY BROTHER BECAUSE 09:15:13 21 A MY BROTHER -- BROTHERS AND 14Y WIFE. 21 HE'S AN EXECUTIVE WITH RICO AND HE'S, I THINK HE'S VP OF 09:45:13 22 Q WHEN DID YOU SPEAK WITH YOUR BROTHER ABOUT 22 SALES, AND I SAID WHAT CAN I GIVE THIS GUY TO MAKE HIM 23 MR. DALESANDRO BEING CHIEF FINANCIAL OFFICER OF 23 BETTER AT WHAT BE'S DOING, SOMETHING THAT SEAN AND I 24 VINEYARDS? 24 DISCUSSED AD NAUSEAM, AND HE SAID 'WELL, MAYBE IT'S THE 09:45:13 25 A IT'S NOT WHAT I SAID, 25 CAPACITY.' ,421 144 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. I August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 37 PAGE 145 PAGE 147 09:45:13 1 AND I SAID 'WHAT DO YOU MEAN?" 1 TO ARCHITECTS, I WAS ABOUT TO LOSE OUT ON AN OPPORTUNITY 09:45:13 2 HE SAID "HILL, MAYBE HE NEEDS TO PRESENT THAT 2 AND I WAS LOOKING FOR HELP TO MAKE THE GUY I HAD 3 HE HAS MORE INFORMATION ABOUT THE PRODUCT, THE C014PANY 3 ENTRUSTED WHO HAD MISREPRESENTED TO ME. 4 AND HE'S JUST COMING ACROSS AS A BROKER,' AND MY 09;45:13 4 I HAD NEVER IN 14Y LIFE GOTTEN SO MAD AT A 5 BROTHER HAD MET WITH HIM IH PASSING ONCE OR TWICE AND 5 PERSON TO THAT DAY. I STILL 3EMEMBER A COUPLE TIMES 6 SAID "I WOULDN'T BELIEVE THAT GUY SO HOW'S THE WORLD 6 WHEN MY WIFE SAID YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE A HEART ATTACK. 7 GOING TO BELIEVE THAT GUY'? 7 I JUST COULD NOT BELIEVE HE WAS GOING TO MAKE NO D9:45:13 8 AND SO RACHEL AND HIM DECIDED THAT MAYBE HE 8 TRACTION ON A DEAL THAT I WAS ACQUIRING AT THE RIGHT 9 NEEDED TO REFER TO HIMSELF AS A CFO, NOT SOMETHING I WAS 9 PRICE AND IT STARTED TO BECOME BAD FOR MY HEALTH TO HAVE 10 REALLY IN FAVOR OF BUT WE FIGURED PUT HIM ON A SHORT 10 ANY RELATIONSHIP WITH SEAN DALESANDRO. 11 WINDOW, SEE IF THAT MAKES A DIFFERENCE. 09:45:13 11 Q SO GOING BACK TO THE CONVERSATION IN YOUR 09:45:13 12 IT NEVER MADE A DIFFERENCE, HE CAME TO ME AND 12 BROTHER'S LIVING ROOM WHERE YOU DECIDED TO HAVE BUSINESS 13 SAID "I CAN'T GET THIS DEAL CAPITALIZED SO YOU CAN 13 CARDS PRINTED, YOU FELT THAT WHILE THE BUSINESS CARDS 14 DEVELOP AN $80 MILLION PROJECT. JUST I CAN'T DO IT. 14 WOULD SAY HE WAS CHIEF FINANCIAL OFFICER THAT, IN FACT, 15 THE ENTITLEMENT RISK IS SUCH I CAN'T DO IT," 15 WAS NOT GOING TO BE TRUE; IS THAT CORRECT? 09:45:13 16 Q SO YOU HAD A 30-MINUTE CONVERSATION IN 09:45:13 16 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. MISSTATES THIS WITNESS'S 17 JANUARY OF 2011 IN YOUR BROTHER JEREMY'S LIVING ROOM? 17 PRIOR TESTIMONY. OBJECTION, ASSUMES FACTS NOT IN D9:45:13 18 A CORRECT. 18 EVIDENCE, 09:45:13 19 Q NOW, YOU HAD ALREADY GIVEN MR. DALESANDRO 09:45:13 19 Q BY MR. RUBINER: YOU CAN ANSWER. 09:45:13 20 $32,000 AT THAT TIME? 09:45:13 20 A PLEASE RESTATE THE QUESTION. 09:45:13 21 A I DON'T KNOW IF IT WAS 32 AT THAT TIME, I 09:45:13 21 MR. RUBINER: CAN YOU REPEAT THE QUESTION, MADAM 22 DON'T KNOW THE TTME FRAME IN WHICH WE GAVE THE CHECKS 22 REPORTER. 23 BUT CHECKS WERE BEING CUT EVERY MONTH. I THINK IT WAS 09:45:13 23 (QUESTION READI . 24 8,000 A MONTH, AT THAT TIME IT MIGHT HAVE BEEN THREE 09:45:13 24 MR. BISNO: AND DO YOU HAVE MY OBJECTIONS IN MIND? 25 CHECKS. I DON'T KNOW. 09:45:13 25 THE WITNESS: PLEASE RESTATE THEM, BOB, 145 147 PAGE 146 PAGE 148 09:45:13 1 Q AND WHOSE IDEA WAS TT TO HAVE BUSINESS CARDS 09:45:13 1 MR. BISNO: MADAM COURT REPORTER, WOULD YOU BE KIND 2 CREATED THAT SAY CHIEF FINANCIAL OFFICER? 2 ENOUGH TO, WITH THE CONSENT OF COUNSEL, TO REREAD MY 09:45:13 3 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. ASKED AND ANSWERED. THIS 3 OBJECTIONS. 4 WITNESS HAS PREVIOUSLY TESTIFIED IT WAS AN IDEA BETWEEN 09:45:13 4 MR, RUBINER: YEAH, YOU CAN REREAD THE LONG 5 MR. DALESANDRO AND RACHEL OGULNICK. HE HAS BEEN CLEAR 5 SPEAKING OBJECTION THAT WAS MADE IN VIOLATION OF THE 6 ON THAT. 6 COURT RULES. 09:15:13 1 Q BY MR. RUBINER: WAS MR. DALESANDRO PRESENT IN 09:45:13 7 (RECORD READ). 8 YOUR BROTHER'S LIVING ROOM? 09:45:13 B MR. BISNO: THANK YOU. 09:45:13 9 A NO. 09:45:13 9 Q BY MR. RUBINER: YOU CAN ANSWER. 09:45:13 10 Q NOW, WHO RAISED THE IDEA OF BUSINESS CARDS 09:45:13 10 A AS I TESTIFIED BEFORE, THIS WAS NOT MY IDEA. 11 SAYING CFO IN YOUR BROTHER'S LIVING ROOM? 11 IT WAS SOMETHING JEREMY AND RACHEL CAME UP WITH. THE 09:45:13 12 A I DON'T RECALL. IDON'T ENOW WHICH ONE. 12 CARDS WERE PRODUCED WITHOUT MY KNOWLEDGE. I DON'T KNOW 09:115:13 13 Q AND WHAT DID YOU SAY WHEN SOMEONE SUGGESTED 13 IF SEAN PLAYED A ROLE IN THIS. I HAVE NOT SPOKEN TO MY 14 THAT BUSINESS CARDS THAT IDENTIFY MR. DALESANDRO AS CFO 14 WIFE ABOUT IT. 15 BE PRESENTED? 09:45:13 15 AGAIN, I SORT OF LET IT GO THINKING, WELL, I'M 09:45:13 16 A I WAS DESPERATE. MONEY EITHER HAD GONE HARD, 16 IN A DESPERATE SPOT, I'M ABOUT TO LOSE MY ASS. IF HE 17 ABOUT TO GO HARD, AND I WAS STUCK WITH THIS GUY AND I 17 CAN HAVE SOME TO01 THAT MAKES HIM BETTER AT WHAT HE WAS 18 WAS WILLING TO TRY ANYTHING TO MAKE HIM FIND CAPITAL SO, 18 TRYING TO DO FOR 60 DAYS AND FAILED MISERABLY AT, I'LL 19 A, I DIDN'T LOSE MY DEPOSIT AND, B, AFTER I MET BOB 19 LET IT GO. IT WAS AGAINST MY BETTER JUDGMENT BECAUSE 20 BISNO I STARTED TO REALIZE THAT IT WASN'T A RISKY 20 NOTHING COULD HAVE BEEN FURTHER FROM T3E TRUTH, MY WIFE 21 ENTITLEMENT PLAY BECAUSE BOB HAD SUFFICIENT CAPITAL 21 WAS THE CFO, DID EVERY, IN EVERY CAPACITY, TO THIS DAY 22 WITHIN THE SANTA ANA COMMUNITY THAT WE WERE GOING TO 22 STILL DOES ALL THOSE ROLES AS THE CFO AND MR, DALESANDRO 23 HAVE A FAIRLY EASY TIME GETTING THIS ENTITLED. 23 NEVER COULD OR WOULD HAVE A CHECKBOOK, FOR NSTANCE, OR 09:45:13 24 SO NOT ONLY WAS I ON THE PRECIPICE OF LOSING 24 ANY OF THOSE OTHER CAPACITIES. IT WAS SIMPLY A TOOL 25 DEPOSIT, FUNDS TO ATTORNEYS, FUNDS TO CONSULTANTS, FUNDS 25 GIVEN TO THE MAN IN LIGHT OF HIM FAILING FOR SO LONG NOW 1461 148 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 SHEET 1 3 :45:13 :45:13 :15:13 :45:13 45:13 4 S 6 i H 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 38 PAGE 149 PAGE 151 ON THE THIRD PROJECT AND I, FRANKLY, STARTED TO HATE 1 HURT TO JUST TAKE A RUN AT IT?" I HAD HEARD ROMBLINGS MYSELF FOR HAVING ALLOWED THIS RELATIONSHIP TO CONTINUE 2 THAT THERE WERE ISSUES GETTING IT ENTITLED FOR WOOD AND RELY ON HIS MISREPRESENTATIONS FOR A THIRD PROJECT. 3 FRAME BUT I AGREED TO MOVE FORWARD DESPITE KNOWING THAT Q SO YOU UNDERSTOOD -- DID YOU UNDERSTAND THAT 4 THERE WERE HURDLES HERE. MR. DALESANDRO MAY HAND THOSE CARDS TO THIRD PARTIES? 09:45:13 5 Q WHEN WAS THE DISCUSSION YOU HAD WITH A I DIDN'T KNOW WHAT HE DID WITH HIS TIME. 6 MR, DALESANDRD WHERE HE SAID "LET'S TARE A RUN AT IT"? Q WELL -- 09:45:13 7 A IT WOULD HAVE BEEN EARLY DECEMBER, 2010. A I SPOKE TO HIM ONCE OR TWICE A DAY FOR FIVE, TEN MINUTES AT A TIME AND HE'D GIVE ME SOME CROCK OF SKIT AND I STARTED TO NOT KNOW -- I HAD NO BELIEF IN HIM ANYMORE. I MEAN, YOU ASK THE MAN. NOBODY HAS RIPPED INTO SOMEBODY THE WAY I RIPPED INTO HIM BECAUSE I FELT HE DECEIVED ME. HE MISREPRESENTED HIS ABILITY TO GET THIS DONE PON TWO MONTHS. MY ASS WAS ON THE LINE. I RELEASED, I DON'T KNOW IF IT WAS 200- OR $300,000 DEPOSIT BASED ON HIS REPRESENTATIONS AND I WAS REALLY DESPERATE. Q WHEN DID YOU RELEASE THE DEPOSIT? A I CAN'T REMEMBER. I THOUGHT IT WAS MAYBE IN EARLY JANUARY, IT'S POSSIBLE, MID JANUARY. Q AND WHAT PROPERTY ARE WE TALKING ABOUT THAT THIS DEPOSIT IS IN? A THE MET, VIE AT THE MET PROPERTY. Q AND HOW DID YOU FIND -- STRIKE THAT. DID YOU FIND VDC AT THE MET? PAGE 150 :45:13 1 A RACHEL'S PARENTS LIVE ABOUT A MILE FROM THERE. I HAD SEEN THE SIGN ON THE PROPERTY FOR AT LEAST A YEAR AND A HALF. I THOUGHT IT WAS UNDER CONTRACT WITH TRAVEL PRO. SEAN CALLS ME ONE DAY AND TELLS ME THERE'S A PROPERTY OVER THERE. I SAY "WELL, WHAT'S WRONG WITH IT?" T HAD HEARD THERE WERE SOME ENTITLEMENT ISSUES AND I DON'T EXACTLY REMEMBER WHY OR HOW I CAME TO THE CONCLUSION I'LL TAKE A RUN AT IT BUT IN TERNS OF WHAT YOU COULD ACQUIRE THE SITE FOR I MADE A DETERMINATION THAT IT WAS WORTH All ATTEMPT UNDER THE UMBRELLA OF DUE DILIGENCE TO TAKE A LOOK AT THE DEAL. Q ALL RIGHT. SO YOU SAID MR. DALESANDRO CONTACTED YOU AND :45:13 :45:13 :13 45:13 TOLD YOU THAT, ABOUT THE SITE; IS THAT RIGHT? MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. THAT'S NOT WHAT THIS WITNESS TESTIFIED. Q BY MR. RUBINER: YOU CAN ANSWER THE QUESTION. A WHEN YOU SAY TELL ME ABOUT THE SITE, I TESTIFIED I HAD KNEW ABOUT THIS. THIS DEAL HAD BEEN TAKEN BACK BY THE BANK IN 2008 OR '9. IT WAS UNDER CONTRACT. THE SIGN WAS ALWAYS ON THE PROPERTY. I HAD SEEN THE SIGN MANY TIMES. I WAS TOLD BY SEAN "WELL, JUST WHAT WOULD IT 09:45:13 8 Q WHERE DID THE CONVERSATION TAKE PLACE? 00:45:13 9 A THERE WAS A TIME PERIOD WHEN ROYAL CANYON FELL 10 OUT, SEAN WAS CALLING, I MET HIM ON THIS -- AT THIS CAFE 11 ON MELROSE WHERE HE KEPT TELLING ME HE'S GOING TO 12 FINANCE DEALS, MAYBE HE'LL FIND DEALS AND HE SENT ME A 13 TON OF DEALS. THIS WAS ONE AMONG MANY THAT HE HAD SENT 14 TO ME AND I HAD PASSED OFF ALL OF THEM BUT THIS ONE 15 STRUCK AN INTEREST IN ME BECAUSE THIS HAD BEEN THE FOCUS 16 OF WHERE I WAS TAKING MY BUSINESS. 09:45:13 17 Q DID YOU EVER HAVE ANY MEETINGS WITH 18 MR. DALESANDRO AT YOUR GOLF CLUB? 09:45:13 19 A I THINK HE CAME TO THE GOLF CLUB ONCE. 09:45:13 20 Q WHEN WAS THAT? 09:45:0 21 A I DON'T RECALL. 09:45:13 22 Q WAS IT BEFORE OR AFTER THE CONVERSATION YOU HAD 23 WHERE YOU SAID LET'S TAKE A RUN AT THE VDC AT THE MET 24 PROJECT? 09:45:13 25 A I DON'T KNOW, 151 PAGE 152 :45:13 :45:13 :45:13 :45:13 :45:13 :45:13 :45:13 :45:13 :45:13 45:13 15:13 15:13 :45:13 :45:13 8 9 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Q WHERE ON THE GOLF COURSE DID THE CONVERSATION TAKE PLACE? A IT WAS ON THE BALCONY ADJACENT TO THE BAR. Q WAS ANYONE ELSE PRESENT? A T THINK MY BROTHER WAS THERE. I'M NOT ENTIRELY SURE BUT I THINK ED. Q WHICH BROTHER? A JEREMY. Q HO'W LONG DID THE MEETING LAST? A I DON'T RECALL. Q MORE THAN AN HOUR? A I DON'T RECALL. D MORE THAN SIX HOURS? A I WOULD SAY IT WAS LESS THAN SIX HOURS. Q MORE THAN THREE HOURS? A I WOULD SAY IT'S LESS THAN THREE HOURS. Q MORE THAN TWO HOURS? A YOU LIKE TO JUST ASK -- MR. STEED: COUNSEL -- THE WITNESS: GO AHEAD. MR. BIEND: -- I'M GOING TO OBJECT. THIS WITNESS HAS THREE TIMES, PERHAPS FOUR, TESTIFIED HE DOES NOT RECALL. Q BY MR. RUBINER: WAS IT MORE THAN TWO HOURS? A MY 3EST, VERY BEST GUESS IS IT WAS MORE THAN 15 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. I August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 39 PAGE 153 PAGE 155 1 AND LESS THAN AN HOUR. 09:45:13 1 A TEN MONTHS AGO. 09:45:13 2 Q WHAT WAS DISCUSSED? 09:45:13 2 Q WHERE DID THE CONVERSATION TAEE PLACE? 09:45:13 3 A I DON'T RECALL. 09:45:13 3 A AT HIS HOUSE. 09:45:13 4 Q DID YOU MAKE ANY NOTES OF THE CONVERSATION? 09:45:13 4 Q WHO WAS PRESENT? 09:45:13 5 A I DID NOT, 09:45:13 5 A MY BROTHER CRAIG AND MY WIFE RACHEL, 09:45:13 6 Q DO YOU EVER MAKE ANY NOTES OF ANY OF YOUR 09:45:13 6 Q ANYONE ELSE? 1 CONVERSATIONS WITH MR. DALESANDRO? 09:45:13 7 A NO. 09:15:13 B A IT'S NOT A HABIT OF MINE, NO. 09:45:13 8 Q HOW LONG DID THE CONVERSATION LAST? 09:45:13 9 Q WHETHER IT'S A HABIT OR NOT, DO YOU RECALL EVER 09:45:13 9 A 30 MINUTES. 10 TAKING ANY NOTES OF ANY OF YOUR CONVERSATIONS WITH 09:45:13 10 Q WHAT WAS DISCUSSED? 11 MR. DALESANDRO? 09:45:13 11 A THAT THERE WAS A LAWSUIT FILED, D9:45:13 12 - MR, BISNO: VAGUE AS -- OBJECTION, VAGUE AS TD 09:45:13 12 Q ANYTHING ELSE? 13 TIME. 09:45:13 13 A JEREMY'S PERCEPTION AND RACHEL'S PERCEPTION OF D9:45:13 14 THE WITNESS: I DDN'T REMEMBER SPECIFICALLY TAKING 14 SEAN, 15 A PEN TO PAPER AND WRITING NOTES, NO, I DON'T. 09:45:13 15 Q ANY OTHER TOPICS DISCUSSED? 09:45:13 16 Q BY MR. RUBINER: AND YOU HAVE NO RECALL OF WHAT 09:45:13 16 A THE LIKELIHOOD OF DALESANDRO EXTRACTING MONEY 17 WAS DISCUSSED DURING THE CONVERSATION; 15 THAT RIGHT? 17 IN THE CASE. 09:45:13 18 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. ASKED AND ANSWERED. 09:45:13 18 Q ANYTHING ELSE DISCUSSED? 09:45:13 19 THE WITNESS: I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHAT CONVERSATION 09:45:13 19 A NOT THAT I RECALL. 20 YOU'RE TALKING ABOHT ANYMORE. 09:45:13 20 Q WHAT DID YOUR BROTHER JEREMY SAY ABOUT HIS 09:45:13 21 Q BY MR. RUBINER: AT THE GOLF COURSE, 21 PERCEPTION OF MR. DALESANDRO? 09:45:13 22 A I'VE ALREADY TESTIFIED THAT I DON'T REMEMBER 09:45:13 22 A HE'S THE TYPE OF SALESMAN THAT HE AVOIDS 23 THAT CONVERSATION. 23 HIRING. HE HAS UNDER HIS GANGS TYPICALLY 100 TO 200 09:45:13 24 Q ALL YOU RECALL IS THAT YOU HAD A MEETING THAT 24 SALESMEN AND HE SAYS THIS TYPE OF GUY COMES ACROSS AS A 25 WAS MORE THAN 15 MINUTES AND LESS THAN AN HOUR WITH 25 SLICK WILLY, OVERCONFIDENT, WEARS DESIGNER SUITS, IN HIS 1S3 155 - PAGE 154 PAGE 156 1 MR, DALESANDRO ON THE BALCONY ADJACENT TO THE BAR AT 1 OPINION DOES NOT BODE WELL FOR INGRATIATING THE CLIENT, 2 YOUR GOLF CLUB; IS THAT RIGHT? 2 ALIGNING THE CLIENT WITH THE SALESMAN AND IT'S NEVER 09:45:13 3 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. COUNSEL, YOU'RE BADGERING 3 WORKED OUT WELL WITH HIM, AND HIS PERCEPTION WAS THAT 4 THIS WITNESS. HE'S TESTIFIED WHAT HE RECALLS. HE'S 4 SEAN IS THAT TYPE OF SALESMAN THAT WAS OVERSELLING. 5 TESTIFIED WHAT HE DOESN'T RECALL. 09:45:13 5 Q DID HE SAY ANYTHING ELSE? 01:45:13 6 MR. RUBINER: ARE YOU FINISHED? 09:45:13 6 A HE ASKED ME HOW THE SYSTEM COULD WORK THIS WAY D9:45:13 7 MR. BISNO: YES. 7 AND HOW SOMEBODY COULD MAKE A CLAIM AGAINST A PROJECT I' 09:45:13 8 Q BY MR. RUBINER: YOU CAN ANSWER THE QUESTION, 8 WAS DOING. 09:45:13 9 A I DO RECALL HIM AT THE CLUB ON THE PATIO. I 09:45:13 9 Q DID HE SAY ANYTHING ELSE? 10 DON'T REMEMBER THE DATE. I DON'T REMEMBER WHAT FLAS 09:45:13 10 A THERE WAS DISCOURSE BETWEEN HIM AND RACHEL. 11 DISCUSSED. 09:45:13 11 Q WHAT DID HE AND RACHEL HAVE DISCOURSE ABOUT? 09:45:13 12 Q HAVE YOU EVER HAD ANY DISCUSSIONS WITH YOUR 09:45:13 12 A RACHEL SAID THAI SHE HAD NEVER SEEN ME GET SO 13 BROTHER JEREMY ABOUT ANY MEETINGS THAT YOU BAD WITH 13 UPSET WITH SOMEBODY IN THE YEARS SHE HAD BEEN AROUND ME 14 MR. DALESANDRO? 14 AND SAID THAT I BAD FELT BETRAYED, I HAD RELIED ON HIS 09:45:13 15 A YES. 15 MISREPRESENTATIONS, HIS ABILITY TO GET IBIS DONE, AND 09:45:13 16 Q DOW MANY DISCUSSIONS HAVE YOU HAD WITH YOUR 16 RACHEL WAS VERY UPSET THAT I WAS UPSET, AND JEREMY SAID 11 BROTHER JEREMY ABOUT MEETINGS YOU'VE HAD WITH 17 "NEXT TIME YOU'RE DOING BUSINESS WITH A BROEER LET ME 18 MR. DALESANDRO? 18 INTERVIEW HIM AND I'LL MAKE SURE I THINK HE HAS AT LEAS- 09:45:13 19 A MORE THAN FIVE AND LESS THAN 20. 19 THE SKILLS TO BE SUCCESSFUL." 09:45:13 20 Q HAVE YOU EVER DISCUSSED WITH YOUR BROTHER 09:45:13 20 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: WE HAVE ABOUT FOUR MINUTES. 21 JEREMY WHETHER YOU HAD ANY DISCUSSIONS WITH 09:45:13 21 MR. RUBINER: RIGHT. 22 MR. DALESANDRO AT YOUR GOLF CLUB? 09:45:13 22 WE NEED TO TAKE A BREAK WHILE SHE CHANGES 39:45:13 23 A I DON'T RECALL THAT. 23 TAPES. 39:45:13 24 Q WHEN WAS THE LAST CONVERSATION YOU HAD WITH 09:45:13 24 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: WE'RE OFF THE RECORD 2:29 P.M. 25 YOUR BROTHER JEREMY ABOUT MR. DALESANDRO? 09:45:13 25 (RECESS HELD). 159 156 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995,2449 SHEET 40 PAGE 157 PAGE 159 09:45:13 1 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: WE'RE ON THE RECORD 3A0 P.M. 1 HAD STARTED ASKING ME FOR MONEY, HE HAD ASKED ME FOR 09:45:13 2 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DURING THE MEETING IN YOUR 2 MONEY ON SEVERAL OCCASIONS BUT I FINALLY AGREED TO IT AT 3 BROTHER'S, TEN MONTHS AGO AT YOUR BROTHER'S HOUSE, WHAT 3 THAT MEETING ON MELROSE THAT HE SAID THAT I WOULD 4 DO YOU RECALL RACHEL SAYING ABOUT HER PERCEPTIONS OF 4 BENEFIT FROM IT BECAUSE FOR THE FIRST TIME BE WAS NOW 5 SEAN? 5 TALKING ABOUT FINDING DEALS, NOT FTNANCING DEALS AND 09:15:13 6 A I HAD BEEN FOOLED INTO THE BELIEF THAT HE WOULD 6 AGAIN, THE, I REJECTED ALL THE DEALS. 7 BE SUCCESSFUL AND IT WAS A SHAME THAT I HADN'T LEARNED 09:45:13 7 Q YOU REJECTED ALL OF THE DEALS MR. DALESANDRO B MY LESSONS IN THE PARTLY FALL, IT WAS A SHAME THAT I HAD 8 BROUGHT TO YOU? 9 A BIG HEART AND WANTED TO HELP THE GUY OUT WHEN HE 09:45:13 9 A N0, I SAID DURING THAT TLME FRAME. 10 NEEDED MONEY AND IF I CONTINUED TO DO BUSINESS IN "HAT 09:45:13 10 Q AND WHAT'S THE TIME FRAME THAT YOU'RE TALKING 11 FASHION WE'RE GOING TO GO BROKE VERY QUICKLY. 11 ABOUT? 09:45:13 12 Q DID SHE SAY ANYTHING ELSE? 09:45:13 12 A THERE WAS A TIME FRAME BETWEEN WHEN THE ROYAL 09:45:13 13 A SHE SAID NUMEROUS THINGS ABOUT SEAN THAT SHE 13 CANYON FELL OUT, WHERE I CANCELLED IT, AND I THINK THAT 14 FELT ABOUT HIM AT THE TIME. 11 WOULD HAVE BEEN THE END OF OCTOBER, WE HAD MADE AN OFFER 09:45:13 15 Q WHAT DID SHE SAY? 15 THROUGH HIM ON A DEAL I HAD NEVER HEARD OF IN TEXAS, I 09:45:13 16 A SHE SAID THAT HE CAME ACROSS AS A GUY WHO WAS 16 BELIEVE, TO ACQUIRE A SITE THAT WAS AN OLD WAREHOUSE, 17 SELLING SOMETHING, NOT PROVIDING A BENEFIT, NOT LAYING 17 THAT DEAL SEAN HAD BROUGHT TO ME, I NEVER HAD BEARD OF 18 OUT A FRAMEWORK TO A POTENTIAL INVESTOR WHY THEY SHOULD 18 AND WE TAKE A LOOK AT IT AND SEEMED TO MAKE SENSE BUT IT 19 DO IT. SHE THOUGHT HE OVERSOLD. SHE THOUGHT THAT IT 19 WAS ONE OF THOSE DEALS THAT I DON'T KNOW THE TEXAS 20 WAS RIDICULOUS THAT I DIDN'T SEE THROUGH HIS POLISHED 20 MARKET. AND THEN I THINK THERE WAS ANOTHER DEAL THAI 21 NATURE, THAT PEOPLE WOULDN'T TAKE, TAKE TO HIS 21 WAS BANK OWNED THAT LOOKED KIND OF INTERESTING. 22 TECHNIQUES AND SHE WAS KIND OF AN I TOLD YOU SO MEETING 09:45:13 22 THESE WERE ALL KIND OF JUST THROW IT AGAINST 23 BECAUSE SHE HAD WARNED 14E ABOUT THIS FOR SOME TIME, WAS 23 THE WALL, SEE IF IT STICKS KIND OF THINGS, AND THIS TIME 24 VERY MUCH AGAINST ME GIVING HIM MONEY FROM THE INCEPTION 24 VARIED BETWEEN OCTOBER AND DECEMBER. 25 AND FELT I DIDN'T NEED, I DIDN'T NEED TO GIVE THIS KID A 09:15:13 25 Q WHAT ➢O YOU MEAN IT WAS "THROW IT AGAINST THE 157 159 PAGE 158 PAGE 160 1 CHANCE TO SUCCEED. 1 WALL, SEE IF IT STICKS KIND OF THING"? 09:45:13 2 Q DID SHE SAY ANYTHING ELSE? 09:45:13 2 A YOU DON'T SPEND TIRE OR MONEY REALLY DOING 09:45:13 3 A NOT THAT I RECALL, 3 SERIOUS DUE DILIGENCE. YOU JUST TAKE A CURSORY LOOK AT 09:45:13 4 Q OTHER THAN WHAT YOU'VE TESTIFIED ABOUT, DO YOU 4 THESE THINGS AND THEN IF YOU START TO GET AN INTEREST IN 5 RECALL EITHER YOUR BROTHER OR RACHEL HAVING SAID 5 THE SELLER THEN YOU START TO TAKE THESE THINGS MORE 6 ANYTHING ELSE ABOUT MR. DALESANDRO DURING THE MEETING AT 6 SERIOUSLY. 7 YOUR BROTHER'S HOUSE TEN MONTHS AGO? 09:45:13 7 I HAVE BROKERS WHO WILL MAKE OFFERS ON MY 09:45:13 8 A IT WAS DISCUSSED THAT THE AUDACITY SOMEBODY 8 BEHALF ALL THE TIME, DONE IT FOR YEARS. THEY'LL CALL 9 WOULD HAVE TO FILE A SUIT WHEN THEY FAILED SO MISERABLY, 9 ME. MAYBE I'M OUT OF THE CITY, MAYBE I'M SOMEWHERE 10 MADE MISREPRESENTATIONS, AND MY BROTHER WORKS DOWN AT 10 ELSE, THEY'Ll SAY "YOU'VE GOT TO DO THIS RIGHT AWAY." 11 THE COURT, THE CENTRAL COURT AND HE SAID IT'S JUST PART 11 I'LL SAY "GO AHEAD, MAKE AN OFFER ON MY 12 OF THE SYSTEM, IT'S THE WAY IT WORKS. YOU GOT A YOUNG 12 BEHALF." 13 ATTORNEY AND YOU GOT, YOU HAVE $300 YOU CAN FILE A 09:45:13 13 IT'S NOT A BINDING OFFER, Y09 DON'T REALLY 14 LAWSUIT. 14 UNDERSTAND THE MECHANICS OF THE DEAL, THE MATRIX OF THE 09:45:13 15 Q DID YOU DISCUSS ANYTHING ELSE? 15 DEAL, BUT YOU FIGURE EVERY ONCE IN A WHILE BY BEING 09:45:13 16 A NOT THAT I RECALL. 16 PROACTIVE YOU'LL GET SOMETHING GOOD AND SO YOU SEND 09:45:13 17 Q DID YOU TAKE ANY NOTES DURING THE MEETING? 17 THOSE THINGS OUT SOMETIMES. 09:45:13 18 A NOT THAT I RECALL, 09:45:13 18 Q SO DID YOU AUTHORIZE MR. DALESANDRO TO MAKE 09:45:13 19 Q DID YOU OBSERVE ANYONE ELSE TAKE NOTES DURING 19 OFFERS ON YOUR BEHALF? 20 THE MEETING? 09:45:13 20 A ON A FEW DEALS, YES. 09:45:13 21 A NO. 09:45:13 21 Q H04 MANY? 09:45:13 22 Q I BELIEVE EARLIER YOU TESTIFIED THAI 09:45:13 22 A A FEW IS TWO, AS MANY AS FOUR OR FIVE. 23 MR. DALESANDRO DURING 2010 WAS BRINGING A VARIETY OF 09:45:13 23 Q SO ON TWO TO FIVE DEALS YOU AUTHORIZED, DURING 24 DEALS TO YOU; IS THAT RIGHT? 24 THE OCTOBER THROUGH DECEMBER, 2010 TIMEFRAME, YOU 09:45:13 25 A IT WAS THE VERY END OF 2010 AROUND THE TIME HE 25 AUTHORIZED MR. DALESANDRO TO MAKE OFFERS ON YOUR BEHALF; 1581 160 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 SHEET 41 PAGE 161 _ 1 IS THAT RIGHT? R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 PAGE :45:13 2 A I -- YES. AND T THINK THERE WAS ALSO ONE 3 ABANDONED SKI LODGE UP IN TAHOE THAT EITHER HIM OR 4 CARLOS, MAYBE THEY WERE WORKING TOGETHER, I DON'T 5 RECALL, WHERE THEY WERE TRYING TO GET ME THE PROSPECTUS 6 AND THEY HAD MADE SOME SORT OF OFFER TOWARDS IT. I i THINK IT, IT'S ONE OF THE HIGH -END RESORTS, I CAN'T 8 RECALL. :15:13 9 Q AND THEN WHEN DID MR, DALESANDRO CONTACT YOU 10 ABOUT THE VDC AT THE MET? :45:13 11 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. MISSTATES THIS WITNESS'S 12 TESTIMONY. :45:13 13 THE WITNESS: I THINK MY ATTORNEY IS ACCURATE. I 14 HAD KNOWN ABOUT THE DEAL. I THINK EVERYBODY KNEW ABOUT 15 THE DEAL. THERE ARE EIGHT -BY -EIGHT BILLBOARDS ON THREE 16 SIDES OF THE PROPERTY. BUT WHEN DID HE BRING IT TO MY 17 ATTENTION THAT IT HAD -- WAS AVAILABLE? IT WAS, I 18 BELIEVE, THE BEGINNING OF DECEMBER, 2010. :45:13 19 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DURING THE TIMES THAT YOU 20 AUTHDRIZED MR, DALESANDRO TO MAKE OFFERS ON YOUR BEHALF 21 BETWEEN OCTOBER AND DECEMBER OF 2010, HAD YOU EVER 22 DISCUSSED WITH MR. DALESANDRO HOW HE WOULD BE 23 COMPENSATED? 15:13 24 A THERE WERE A VARIETY OF CONVERSATIONS, YES. 45:13 25 Q WHEN WAS THE FIRST CONVERSATION YOU HAD WITH :13 45:13 :45:13 :45:13 5 6 7 1D 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 16 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 163 WERE SOME BANE -OWNED DEALS. I THINK THEY WERE ALL BANK - OWNED DEALS. AND I SAID "I'M INTERESTED. GO MAKE AN OFFER ON MY BEHALF ON THESE DEALS." I DON'T KNOW WHEN HE MADE THE OFFER, DID AN AGREEMENT LIKE THIS SHOW UP, DID IT COME BEFORE OR AFTER. IF YOU WANT TO ASK ME A SPECIFIC QUESTION I CAN SEE IF I CAN GIVE YOU A SPECIFIC AIRIER. Q DO YOU RECALL AT ANY TIME DISCUSSING THE COMPENSATION WITH MR. DALESANDRO? MR. EISNO: OBJECTION. VAGUE AS TO TDME. OBJECTION, VAGUE AS TO DEAL. THE WITNESS: I AGREE. IT'S TOO VAGUE. Q BY MB. RUBINER: WHEN YOU SAID TWO TO FIVE DEALS, WHAT DID YOU MEAN BY THE TERM "DEAL"? A THEY WERE PROJECTS, EITHER A VACANT LOT OR AN EXISTING ASSET. Q USING THAT AS THE, AS 'DEAL," DO YOU RECALL EVER DISCUSSING THE COMPENSATION THAT MR. DALESANDRO RECEIVED AS IT RELATES TO ANY OF THE TWO TO FIVE DEALS HE BROUGHT TO YOU? A YOU RION, YOU LOOK AT SO MANY DEALS, YOU HAVE SO MANY BROKERS AROUND YOU. I THINK THERE MIGHT HAVE BEEN A DEAL IN GLENDALE BUT I'M NOT ENTIRELY SURE THAT WAS THROUGH HIM. I MIGHT HAVE SIGNED A FEE AGREEMENT, A POINT OR TWO, BUT I DON'T EVEN KNOW IF THAT WAS HIS PAGE 162 PAGE 164 1 MR. DALESANDRO DISCUSSING HOW HE WOULD BE COMPENSATED? 1 DEAL. I REMEMBER THERE WAS A DEAL IN TEXAS, I THINK IT 09:45:13 2 A WHEN? WHICH DEAL? 2 WAS AN OLD WALMART OR WOOLWORTH. IT WAS A WAREHOUSE AHD 09:45:13 3 Q SO DID YOU, EACH ONE OF THESE TWO TO FIVE 3 THERE WAS A POTENTIAL OF CONVERTING IT TO MULTI-FAM'.LLY. 4 DEALS, DID YOU HAVE A SEPARATE DISCUSSION ABOUT HOW HE 4 AND THAT DEAL WAS DEFINITELY THROUGH HIM. .AND I DON'T 5 WOULD BE COMPENSATED? 5 REMEMBER IF I SIGNED AN AGREEMENT FOR THAT DEAL OR NOT. 09:15:13 6 A SEAN AND I HAD MOVED FORWARD ON TWO 6 I DON'T KNDW, 7 UNSUCCESSFUL VENTURES, ONE WAS, LIKE I SAID, A WEEK OR 09:45:13 7 Q WELL, DO YOU RECALL EVER DISCUSSING HOW 8 TWO WITH AN AGREEMENT. I ASSUMED AS HIS PROPENSITY OF 8 MR. DALESANDRO WOULD BE COMPENSATED BETWEEN OCTOBER AND 9 DOING -- I MEAN, HE WOULD THROW THESE AGREEMENTS AROUND 9 DECEMBER OF 2010? 10 ALMOST INSTANTLY SEEMING TO PROTECT HIS INTEREST, HIS 09:45:13 10 A IT WAS CLEAR TO ME THAT WE WERE GOING TO PAPER 11 RIGHTS. 50 I KNEW ON ANY DEAL I WAS GOING TO SEE A 11 THE AGREEMENT AS WE HAD ON THE TWO DEALS AND SO, YES, HE 12 DOCUMENT THAT LOOKS VERY MUCH LIKE EXHIBIT 7 FROM HIS 12 WOULD SEND OFFERS FOR COMPENSATION AND THEN WE WOULD 13 COMPANY ASKING ME TO EXECUTE IT AND I DO RECALL THAT 13 DISCUSS 'WHERE WE WERE GOING TO TAKE THIS. 14 COMING THROUGH ON A COUPLE OF THESE SUBSEQUENT DEALS 09:45:13 14 Q WHEN MR, DALESANDRO RAISED THE VDC AT THE MET 15 YOU'RE REFERRING TO. 15 WITH YOU IN DECEMBER OF 2010, DID YOU DISCUSS HOW 09:45:13 16 Q DO YOU RECALL ANY DISCUSSIUNS ABOUT IT? 16 MR. DALESANDRO WOULD BE COMPENSATED? 09:15:13 11 A YES. 09:45:13 17 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. THAT'S NOT THE TESTIMONY 09:45:13 18 Q WHEN IS THE FIRST DISCUSSION THAT YOU RECALL? 18 THAT -- THAT PREMISE IS INCONSISTENT WITH THIS WITNESS'S 09:45:13 19 A AGAIN, WHICH DEAL? 19 PRIOR TESTIMONY. 09:45:13 20 Q THE FIRST DEAL. 09:45:13 20 Q BY MR. RUBINER: YOU CAN ANSWER THE QUESTION. 09:45:13 2I A WHICH IS THE FIRST DEAL? 09:45:13 21 A I THINK IT'S INACCURATE TO SAY VDC AT THE MET 09:15:13 22 Q BETWEEN OCTOBER AND DECEMBER OF 1010. YOU SAID 22 BECAUSE IT'S A NAME MY WIFE CALLED THE PROJECT TO FILE 23 THERE WERE TWO TO FIVE DEALS. THE FIRST DEAL? 23 THE SPE FOR AND THAT CANE WAY AFTER THIS TIME PERIOD 09:15:13 24 A AGAIN, I HAVE NO RECOLLECTION OF THE ORDER OR 24 WE'RE REFERRING 10. 25 SEQUENCE OF WHEN THESE THINGS HAPPENED. AGAIN, THERE 09:45:13 25 BUT IF YOU'RE REFERRING TO THE MET PROJECT, 1621 1 169 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 42 PAGE 165 PAGE 167 1 INITIALLY SEAN HAD SENT TO 14E AN AGREEMENT MUCH LIKE 09:45:13 1 HAD MADE A HUGE MISTAKE IN TRUSTING THIS M.4N TO GET IT 2 THIS WHERE HE WOULD GET A POINT OR TWO FOR RAISING 2 DONE BECAUSE HE HAD MAIZE SO 14ANY REPRESENTATIONS THAT 3 CAPITAL, WHETHER IT WAS DEBT OR EQUITY, AND I DISCDSSED 3 HAD COME OUT NOT TO BE TRUE AT THAT POINT IN TIME THAT 4 WITH HIM THAT IT HADN'T WORKED BEFORE AND MAYBE IT 4 HE COULD GET IT DONE. 5 DIDN'T WORK BECAUSE YOU EITHER WEREN'T COMMITTED, WERE 09:45:13 5 AND I THEN SPOKE TO MR. HISNO, BOB SAID TO ME 6 DOING OTHER THINGS AND THAT IF YOU HAD A MORE ACTIVE 6 "WELL, LET'S PUT OUR BEADS DOWN, LET'S GO LOOK FOR SOME 7 ROLE THEN PERHAPS THIS COULD GET DONE. AND SO I SAID TO 7 FUNDS, A SLUG OF DEBT AND 'MAYBE WE HAVE SOME INDIVIDUALS 8 HIM PROPOSE A DEAL. 8 WHO ARE WILLING TO TAKE IT DOWN.' 09:45:13 9 Q DID HE EVER PROPOSE A DEAL? 09:45:13 9 AND SO 1 DID THE SAME THING. AND I PUT MY HEAD 09:45:13 10 A HE DID. 1D DOWN AND I FOUND THE FIRST LENDER AND I FOUND AT THE 09:45:13 11 Q WHAT WAS THE DEAL HE PROPOSED? 11 TIME, I CALL HIM A MEZZ LENDER, AND I PUT UP SUBSTANTIAL D9:45:13 12 A HE CAME WITH A DEAL IF HE RAISED ALL THE 12 MONEY OF MY OWN TO GET IT DONE AND THAT'S WHERE WE WENT 13 CAPITAL AND WE WERE TO TAKE THIS DEAL FROM ACQUISITION 13 AND, HONESTLY, I DON'T REMEMBER THE QUESTION ANYMORE. 14 THROUGH RAISING THE CAPITAL, WHICH WAS HIS CHIEF ROLE IN 09:45:13 14 Q LET ME GO BACK, 15 THIS, HIRING OF THE CONSULTANTS -- LET ME REGRESS. 09:45:13 15 YOU SAID THAT MR. DALESANDRO MADE SO MANY 09:15:13 16 WHEN I SAY RAISING CAPITAL, VINEYARDS 16 MISREPRESENTATIONS THAT TURNED OUT NOT TO BE TRUE, 17 DEVELOPMENT, RYAN OGULNICK WAS GOING TO PUT ZERO INTO 09:45:13 17 IS THAT, AM I CORRECTLY READING WHAT YOU SAID? IS THIS DEAL, - 09:45:13 18 A YES. 09:45:13 19 THAT HE WOULD RAISE THE DEBT, HE WOULD RAISE A 09:45:11 19 Q HOW MANY MISREPRESENTATIONS DID HE MAKE THAT 20 'MEZZ SLUG, HE WOULD RAISE AN EQUITY SLUG AND IF HE WERE 20 WERE NOT TRUE? 21 SUCCESSFUL HE HAD IDEAS OF WHAT HE WOULD GET. 09:45:13 21 A HUNDREDS. 09:45:13 22 HIS IDEA OF THIS DEAL WAS IT WAS AN 09:45:13 22 Q HUNDREDS. 23 INSTITUTIONAL CAPITAL PLAY FROM THE BIG FUNDS WHO WRITE 09:45:13 23 WHAT WAS THE FIRST MISREPRESENTATION HE MADE 24 BIG CHECKS AND THAT THEY WOULD PUT UP THE MONEY AND WE 24 THAT WAS NOT TRUE? 25 WOULD GO FORWARD WITH A STRUCTURE TO FULLY ENTITLE, 09:45:13 25 MR. BISNO: VAGUE AS TO TIME. 165 167 PAGE 166 PAGE 168 1 FULLY DEVELOP THE PROJECT, A 48- TO 60-MONTH PROCESS, 09:45:13 1 THE WITNESS: FROM THE BEGINNING OF THE 2 AND IF HE WERE SUCCESSFUL HE PROPOSED THAT HE WOULD GET 2 RELATIONSHIP HE WOULD MAKE ME FEEL THAZ HE HAD THE 3 25 PERCENT OF THE DEAL. 3 KNOWLEDGE, THE EXPERTISE, THE RELATIONSHIPS TO FINANCE D9:45:13 4 Q WHEN DID YOU HAVE THIS CONVERSATION WITH 4 MY DEALS AND I KEPT BELIEVING HIM. SO G1HEN I SAY 5 MR. DALESANDRO? 5 HUNDREDS, IT WAS ALL -- IT WAS ALL AROUND THE SAME 09:15:13 6 A I THINK IN THE BEGINNING OF THE MONTH HE WAS ON 6 THEME. THE THEME WAS I HAVE A DEAL, I NEED MONEY, YES, 7 A FEE AGREEMENT. THEN HE STARTED TO GET ENERGIZED, 7 I CAN GET IT, YES, I'M TALKING TO THIS PERSON, AND SO 8 THINKING HE WOULD HAVE SUCCESS, PROPOSED WHERE HE WOULD B THERE WERE A P.UNDRED SEPARATE ONES AND THEY WERE, 9 BECOME PART OF THE TV ENTITY, AND SO I THINK TOWARDS THE 9 WHETHER IT WAS COLONY CAPITAL OR ARIA OR ROCKPOINT OR 10 END OF DECEMBER HE WAS COMING AT ME AND I THINK I 10 WHAT HAVE YOU. II WAS JUST HE KEPT GETTING MY HOPES UP, 11 REJECTED IT FOR A NUMBER OF REASONS, AND THEN HE WENT 11 HE KEPT GIVING ME INFORMATION AND HE KEPT COMING BACK 12 BACK IN JANUARY TO A FEE AGREEMENT AND THEN BY EARLY/MID 12 WITH NOTHING. AND SO I BELIEVE HE CREATED A SITUATION 13 FEBROARY I REALIZED HE WAS NOT GOING -0 SUCCEED AND HE 13 WHICH WAS A MISREPRESENTATION OF WHAT WAS BEING SAID OUT 14 ANNOUNCED TO 14E IT'S NOT POSSIBLE TO GET THIS KIND OF 14 IN THE MARKETPLACE. I HAD NO DIRECT CONTACT WITH THESE 15 MONEY. INSTITUTIONAL MONEY COMING OFF THE RECESSION, 15 PEOPLE. I WAS RELYING ON HIS REPRESENTATIONS. AND SO 16 ACCORDING TO HIM, WAS NOT GOING TO INVEST IN THIS 16 TF SEAN WAS GOING TO BE SUCCESSFUL OR NOT, I HAD NO WAY 17 PROJECT WITH MY COMPANY AND HE SAID 'I CAN'T GET THIS 17 OF KNOWING. AND SO EVERY STEP OF THE WAY THERE WAS A 18 DONE." 18 DISAPPOINTMENT. 09:45:13 19 HE THEM REPORTS TO ME "YOU GOT TO TAKE IT DOWN 09:45:13 19 Q ➢ID MR. -- YOU REFERENCED ARIA. WHAT IS ARIA? 20 ON YOUR BALANCE SHEET.' 09:45:13 20 A ARIA IS A FUND. 09:45:13 21 I SAY 'WHAT THE BECK DOES THAI MEAN?" 09:45:13 21 Q WHAT DID MR. DALESANDRO TELL YOU ABOUT ARIA? 09:45:13 22 HE SAYS "YOU GOT TO BUY IT. YOU'VE GOT TO GO 09:15:13 22 A AGAIN, TT WAS THE SAME WITH EVERYBODY, ARIA IS 23 GET A LOAN AND YOU'VE GOT TO BUY IT.' 23 ONE OF DOZENS OF NAMES HE WOULD GIVE ME THAT ARE LOOKING 09:15:13 24 AND I GO "WELL, THAT'S BAD NEWS." 24 AT THE DEAL, HAVE AN INTEREST IN THE DEAL, AND IT WAS 09:15:13 25 AND AT THAT MOMENT IN TIME I REALIZED THAT T 25 ALWAYS THE SAME STORY. SOMETIMES HE BLAMED ME, Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 43 PAGE 169 PAGE 171 1 SOMETIMES HE'D BLAME THE DEAL, SOMETIMES HE WOULD 09:45:13 1 A THAT AGAIN, THAT ONE I'M NOT SURE ABOUT, 2 BLAME - HE'D BLAME EVERYTHING BUT HIPISELF UNTIL 2 YOU'RE ASKING ABOUT A GROUP WHERE THERE WAS SOMEBODY 3 SOMETIME IN MID JANUARY HE STARTED TO BLAME HIMSELF AND 3 ELSE CLAIMING TO HAVE A RELATIONSHIP THERE. 4 I ACTUALLY KEPT HIM IN THE DEAL LOOKING FOR FINANCING 09:45:13 4 Q DID MR. DALESANDRO ATTEND A 14EETIIIG WITH YOU 5 MUCH LONGER BECAUSE I HAD HAD IT WITH HIM, I WAS 5 AND ROCKWOOD? 6 INCENSED, I KNEW I HAD TO GO SAVE MY INVESTMENT AND I 09:45:13 6 A I HONESTLY CAN'T RECALL IF HE WAS THERE OR NOT. 7 WAS MOVING TO DO ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING TO SAVE THE 7 I REMEMBER MEETING WITH HIM BUT I DON'T KNOW IF HE WAS 8 DEAL. 8 THERE, 09:15:13 9 BUT HE CAME CLEAN TO ME AND SAID 'YOU KNOW, I 09:45:13 9 Q DID ANYONE FROM ROCKWDOD TELL YOU ANYTHING 10 USED TO WORK AT A BANK, I USED TO GET A CHECK. I WENT 10 MR. DALEBANDRO DID WAS NOT TRUTHFUL? 1' OUT ON MY OWN. I HAVEN'T DONE AS WELL AS I THOUGHT. 09:45:13 11 A DID YOU ASK ME IF ROCKWOOD SAID TEAT? 12 MAYBE YOU COULD GIVE ME SOME ADVICE. MAYBE WE COULD 09:45:13 12 Q CORRECT. DID ANYONE FROM ROCKWELL -- ROCKWOOD 13 WORK THROUGH IT." 13 TELL YOU THAT MR. DALESANDRO SAID SOMETHING THAT WAS NOT 09:15:13 14 AND I GUESS WITHOUT KNOWING IT I WAS LOOKING 14 TRUTHFUL? 15 FOR SOME HUMILITY AND HE WAS A GUY THAT WOULD -- JUST 09:45:13 15 A I DON'T RECALL IF IT WAS ROCKWOOD OR OTHER 16 LACKED HUMILITY. WHEN HE FINALLY CAPE WITH SOME 16 COMPANIES. 17 HUMILITY SOMETIME MID TO LATE JANUARY, I KIND OF RR -SET 09:45:13 11 Q WELL, YOU IDENTIFIED ROCKWOOD AS A COMPANY THAT 18 WITH HIM A LITTLE BIT AND HUNG IN THERE ANOTHER MONTH 1S MR. DALESANDRO HAD MADE ONE OF HIS HUNDREDS OF LIES TO 19 WITH HIM TO SEE WHERE HE COULD TAKE IT AND IT STILL 19 YOU ABOUT; IS THAT RIGHT? 20 DIDN'T WORK. 09:45:13 20 A I SAID MISREPRESENTATIONS. 09:45:13 21 Q WHAT WAS THE FALSE REPRESENTATION 09:45:13 21 Q WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A LIE AND A 22 MR. DALESANDRO MADE ABOUT THE ARIA FUND? 22 MISREPRESENTATION? 09:45:13 23 A IT WAS JUST A NAME HE HAD MENTIONED TO ME THAT 09:45:13 23 A I DON'T KNOW, 24 WAS LOOKING AT THE DEAL AND THEY LIKED THE DEAL, 09:45:13 24 Q DO YOU HAVE A DIFFERENCE IN YOUR OWN MIND 09:45:13 25 I'M NOT TELLING YOU DEFINITIVELY ARIA. I COULD 25 BETWEEN LIE AND MISREPRESENTATION? 169 171 PAGE 170 PAGE 172 _ TELL YOU DEFINITIVELY THAT HE TOLD ME ROCKWOOD WAS GOING 09:45:13 1 A I THINK LIE IS A COMMENT THAT YOU KNOW 2 TO DO THE DEAL, HE TOLD ME USAA WAS GOING TO DO THE 2 DEFINITIVELY AT THE 71E IS INACCURATE. A 3 DEAL. HE JUST KEPT COMING WITH THESE NAME AFTER NAME 3 MISREPRESENTATION IS SORT OF SKEWING THE TRUTH. 4 SAYING THEY'RE UNDERWRITING, THEY LIKE IT, WE'RE GOING 00:45:13 4 Q HOW DID MR. DALESANDRO MISREPRESENT ROCKWOOD TO 5 TO GET THERE. 5 YOU? D9:45:13 6 AND I WOULD SAY FROM LATE DECEMBER THROUGH LATE 09:45:13 6 A IN GENERAL -- AND AGAIN, I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT 7 JANUARY IT WAS THE SAME SONG AND DANCE UNTIL HE CAi4E 7 ONE GROUP - IT WAS THE SAME STORY EVERY TIME. THIS 8 CLEAN WITH ME IN LATE JANUARY AND SAID "I CAN'T GET THIS 8 GROUP LIEES THE NUMBERS, IT WORKS FOR THEM, THEY'RE 9 DONE. I'M NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO FIND FINANCING. 9 COMING IN, WE'RE GOING TO GET IT DONE, AND HE KNEW I WAS 10 YOU'VE GOT TO TAKE IT DOWN ON YOUR OWN BALANCE SHEET, 10 BELIEVING IN HIS REPRESENTATIONS, HE KNEW I WAS RELYING 11 WE'RE NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO FIND YOU A PARTNER TO 11 ON HIS REPRESENTATIONS, AND BASED ON THAT I MOVED, D9:45:13 12 DEVELOP THIS SITE," 12 CONTINUED TO HAVE A RELATIONSHIP WITH THE MAN IN ORDER 09:45:13 13 Q AND YOU SAID THAT HE SAID SOMETHING ABOUT 13 TO ALLOW HIM THE ROOM TO BE SUCCESSFUL AND RAISE THE 14 ROCKWOOD. WHAT'S ROCKWOOD? 14 CAPITAL, 09:45:13 15 A INSTITUTIONAL CAPITAL PARTNER THAT INVESTS IN 09:45:13 15 Q DID YOU EVER DETERMINE THAT ANYTHING HE TOLD 16 REAL ESTATE. 16 YOU ABOUT ROCKWOOD WAS NOT TRUE? 09:45:13 17 Q WHAT DID MR. DALESANDRO TELL YOU ABOUT 09:45:13 17 A I DON'T REMEMBER SPECIFICALLY ROCKWOOD. I 18 ROCKWOOD? IS COULD TELL YOU -- 09:45:13 19 A HE SAID THEY HAD AN INTEREST. 09:45:13 19 Q SO SITTING HERE NOW, YOU HAVE NO KNOWLEDGE, YOU 09:15:13 20 Q DID SOMEONE FROM ROCKWELL (SIC.) TELL YOU THAT, 20 CAN'T THINK OF ANYTHING MR, DALESANDRO TOLD YOU ABOUT 21 IN PACT, THEY NEVER HAD AN INTEREST? 21 ROCKWOOD THAT WAS NOT TRUE; IS THAI RIGHT? 09:45:13 22 A I WOULDN'T SAY THAT, 09:45:13 22 A NO, THAT'S NOT RIGHT. 01:45:13 23 Q DID YOU EVER MEET WITH ANYONE FROM ROCKWOOD? 09:45:13 23 Q SO WHAT DID MR. DALESANDRO TELL YOU ABOUT 09:45:13 24 A YES, 24 ROCKWOOD THAT TURNED OUT NOT TO BE TRUE? 09:49:13 25 Q DID MR. DALESANDRO ARRANGE THE MEETING? 09:15:13 25 A THEY'RE GOING TO FINANCE THE DEAL, 1701 172 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 SHEET 44 PAGE 173 PAGE 175 09:45:13 1 Q WHEN DID MR. DALESANDRO TELL YOU THAT ROCKWOOD 1 DEAL CAN GO BAD EVEN AFTER A LENDER SAYS THEY WANT TO DO 2 WAS GOING TO FFINANCE THE DEAL? 2 THE DEAL; ISN'T THAT RIGHT? 09:45:13 3 A SOMETIME IN MID JANUARY. 09:45:11 3 A THERE'S A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN WHAT I WAS 09:45:13 4 Q WHERE DID THAT CONVERSATION TAKE PLACE? 09:45:13 4 REFERRING TO AND WHAT SEAN REFERRED TO. 09:45:13 5 A I BELIEVE IT WAS ON THE TELEPHONE. 09:45:13 5 MR. BISNO: T'M GOING TO INTERPOSE AN OBJECTION 09:45:13 6 Q WHO WAS ON THE CALL? 6 HERE AS TO MY CLIENT'S PHYSICAL CONDITIDN. IT IS 09:45:13 1 A JUST HIM AND 1. 7 APPARENT TO ME THAT MY CLIENT IB FADING. IT IS APPARENT 09:45:13 8 Q WHAT WERE THE SUBJECTS DISCUSSED DORING THAT B TO ME THAT HE IS NOT AS SHARP AS HE WAS THIS MORNING AND 9 PHONE CALL? 9 T AM GOING TO REQUEST WE ADJOURN THIS DEPOSITION BECAUSE 09:45:13 10 A THE -- HE WAS RETELLING 14E A CONVERSATION HE 10 WE KNOW IT'S NOT GOING TO END NOW. WE KNOW YOU'RE GOING 11 HAD WITH SOMEBODY AT ROCKWOOD. 11 TO GET ANOTHER SHOP. 09:45:13 12 Q DID YOU EVER DETERMINE THAT HE DIDN'T HAVE THAT 09:45:13 12 Q BY MR. RUBINER: LET ME ASK A FEW MORE 13 CONVERSATION WITH THE PERSON AT ROCKWOOD? 13 QUESTIONS. 09:45:13 14 A NO. 09:45:13 14 HAVE Y09 TAKEN ANY MEDICATIONS TODAY, 09:45:13 15 Q DID YOU EVER LEARN THAT ANYTHING HE TOLD YOU 15 MR, OGULNICE? 16 ABOUT THAT CONVERSATION WAS UNTRUE? 09:45:13 16 A N0. 09:15:13 17 MR, DISKO: OBJECTION. MY CLIENT TESTIFIED AS TO 09:45:13 17 Q HAVE YOU HAD ANY ALCOHOLIC BEVERAGES IN THE 18 WHAT MR. DALESANDRO TOLD HIM AND -- 18 LAST 24 HOURS? 09:45:13 19 MR. RUBINER: THAT WASN'T MY QUESTION, COUNSEL, 09:45:13 19 A NO. 20 BUT -- 09:45:13 20 Q ARE YOU CURRENTLY SUFFERING ANY MEDICAL 00:45:13 21 MR. BISNO: MY CLIENT TESTIFIED AND IT DIDN'T 21 DISABILITIES OF ANY RIND? 09:45:13 22 HAPPEN. 09:45:13 22 A YES. 09:15:13 23 MR. RUBINER: COUNSEL, RATHER THAN TESTIFYING, IF 09:45:13 23 Q WHAT MEDICAL DISABILITIES DO YOB HAVE? 24 YOU HAVE AN OBJECTION MAKE IT. IF NOT, LET THE WITNESS 09:45:13 24 A NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. 25 ANSWER THE QUESTIONS. 09:45:13 25 Q ACTUALLY, IT IS MY BUSINESS AND -- 173 5 PAGE 174 PAGE 176 09:45:13 1 Q CAN YOU ANSWER THE QUESTION, SIR? 09:45:13 1 A THAT'S PRIVATE. 09:45:13 2 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. ASKED LID ANSWERED. 09:45:13 2 Q YOUR COUNSEL DIDN'T OBJECT AND IT'S RELEVANT -- 09:45:13 3 Q BY MR. RUBINER: YOU CAN STILL ANSWER. 09:45:13 3 MR. BI SNO: I WILL -- 0:15:13 4 A SEAN REPORTED TO ME THAT THESE GUYS WERE GOING 09:45:13 4 MR. RUBINER: -- ESPECIALLY IN LIGHT OF THE FACT 5 TO DO THE DEAL. ROCKWOOD REPORTED TO ME THAT THERE WAS 5 THAT COUNSEL IS NOT CLAIMING THAT YOUR PHYSICAL 6 A LONG ROAD AHEAD AND SUBSEQUENT TO THAT THERE WAS 6 DISABILITY IS SUCH THAT YOU CAN'T PROVIDE ANY MORE 7 ANOTHER CONVERSATION WHERE THEY SAID WE'RE NOT DOING 7 TESTIMONY TODAY. I'M ENTITLED TO KNOW WHAT YOUR 8 THIS DEAL. 8 DISABILITIES ARE. D9:45:13 9 Q AND WAS IT YOUR UNDERSTANDING THAT ANY LENDER 09:45:13 9 MR. BIPED: THAT'S NOT CORRECT. NUMBER ONE, I'LL 10 THAT MR. DALESANDRO WOULD BRING TO YOUR ATTENTION WOULD 10 OBJECT ON PRIVACY AND, NUMBER TWO, I'M OBJECTING TO THE 11 WANT PO DO DUE DILIGENCE? 11 DEPOSITION CONTINUING BECAUSE I AM WITNESSING MY 09:45:13 12 A YES. 12 CLIENT'S INABILITY TO FULLY COMPREHEND YOUR QUESTIONS 09:15:13 13 Q AND THAT, I BELIEVE EARLIER YOU TESTIFIED AS IT 13 AND I AM WITNESSING MY CLIENT'S INABILITY TO ARTICULATE 14 RELATES TO THE ROYAL CANYON THAT AS FAR AS, IN YOUR 14 AN ANSWER AS WELL AS HE DID EARLIER. 15 EXPERIENCE, THERE'S A MULTITUDE OF WAYS THAT DEALS CAN 09:45:13 15 Q BY MR. RUBINER: ARE YOU ABLE TO COMPREHEND THE 16 END UP NOT GETTING DONE; ISN'T THAT RIGHT? 16 QUESTIONS I'VE BEEN ASKING YOU, MR. OGULNICK? )9:45:13 17 A PLEASE ASK ANOTHER QUESTION. I DON'T KNOW HOW 09:45:13 17 A YES. 18 TO ANSWER THAT. 09:45:13 18 Q ARE YOU ABLE TO PROVIDE ACCURATE ANSWERS? )9:45:13 19 Q WELL, WHEN YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT ROYAL CANYON 09:45:13 19 A YES. 20 YOU SAID YOU WERE UPSET THAT MR. DALESANDRO STOPPED 09:45:13 20 Q HAS ANY OF THE ANSWERS THAT YOU'VE GIVEN IN THE 21 LOOKING FOR ANOTHER DEAL WHEN YOU THOUGHT YOU HAD 21 LAST 15 MINUTES OR SO BEEN INACCURATE? 22 ROCKPOINT READY TO GO; ISN'T THAT RIGHT? 09:45:13 22 A NO. )9:45:13 23 A CORRECT. 09:45:13 23 Q DO YOU FEEL THAT YOU CAN CONTINUE ANSWERING 19:45:13 24 Q AND THAT YOU WERE UPSET BECAUSE YOU HAD TOLD 24 QUESTIONS THIS AFTERNOON? 25 MR. DALESANDRO THAT THERE'S A MULTITUDE OF WAYS THAT A 09:45:13 25 A LISTEN, I THINK MR. 31SNO HAS TO LEAVE IN TEN 1741 176 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 - SHEET 45 PAGE 177 PAGE 179 1 MINUTES. 09:45:13 1 A OKAY. 09:45:13 2 SO BOB, I'M FINE WITH TEN MORE MINUTES. 09:45:13 2 Q DO YOU HAVE THAT PAGE IN FRONT OF YOU? 09:45:13 3 I DO AGREE WITH BOB THAT I WAS SHARPER AN HOUR 09:45:13 3 A I DO. 4 AGO BUT THERE'S NOTHING I'VE SAID ON THIS RECORD THAT IS 09:45:13 4 Q CAN YOU READ THAT PAGE TO YOURSELF AND LET ME 5 INACCURATE, SO WHY DON'T WE -- 5 KNOW WHEN YOU'VE FINISHED, 09:45:13 6 Q DO YOU HAVE ANY PHYSICAL LIMITATIONS THAT WOULD 09:45:13 6 A OKAY. I'M DONE, 7 PREVENT YOU FROM CONTINUING TO PROVIDE TESTIMONY THIS 09:45:13 7 Q IS THAT YOUR SIGNATURE AT THE BOTTOM OF THE 8 AFTERNOON? B PAGE? 09:45:13 9 A NO. 09:45:13 9 A I THINK THAT'S AN ELECTRONIC SIGNATURE BUT IT'S 09:45:13 10 MR. RUBINER: COUNSEL, DESPITE YOUR MEDICAL OPINION 10 THE ELECTRONIC SIGNATURE OF MINE. 11 THAT HE'S UNABLE TO PROVIDE TESTIMONY, THE WITNESS, WHO 09:45:13 11 Q DID YOU AUTHORIZE MR. FOX TO PRODUCE THIS 12 IS AS ABLE TO SPEAK ABOUT HIS MEDICAL CONDITION AS YOU 12 DOCUMENT WITH YOUR ELECTRONIC SIGNATURE ON IT? 13 ARE OR PERHAPS BETTER SINCE IT'S HIM, SEEMS TO FEEL FINE 09:45:13 13 MR. BISNO: OBJECTION. THE TORN OF THE QUESTION IS 14 GOING FORWARD AND I'LL TAKE THE RISK THAT A COURT WILL 14 SUCH THAT MR. OGULNICK COULD NOT ANSWER IT WITHOUT 15 SAY THAT HE WAS T00 EXHAUSTED AND 100 UNABLE TO GO 15 REVEALING ATTORNEY -CLIENT COMMUNICATION. 16 FORWARD BECAUSE OF SOME PHYSICAL CONDITION THAT NOBODY 09:45:13 16 MR, RUBINER: IT'S ACTUALLY NOT PRIVILEGED. 17 IS WILLING TO TELL ME THAT HE HAS, SO -- AND YOU CAN 09:45:13 17 Q BUT DID YOU REVIEW THIS ON OR ABOUT MAY 14TH, 1B WALK OUT. I CAN'T STOP YOU, BUT I DON'T SEE A REASON 16 2012? 19 TO STOP RIGHT NOW. IF YOU WANT TO WALK OUT THAT'S 09:45:13 19 A I DON'T -- LISTEN, I'M NOT AN ATTORNEY. I 2D BETWEEN YOU AND THE WITNESS AND THE COURT. 20 DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE ASKING ME 'THIS," WHAT IS 09:45:13 21 MR. SIGNS: COUNSEL, I HAVE MADE MY RECORD, IF YOU 21 'THIS"? 22 WANT ANOTHER -- IT'S 4:09 NOW ACCORDING TO MY CLOCK, IF 09:45:13 22 Q EXHIBIT S. 23 YOU WANT TO CONTINUE TO 4:15 WHICH WAS OUR EARLIER 09:45:13 23 DID YOU REVIEW EXHIBIT B PRIOR TO SIGNING IT 24 AGREEMENT -- 24 ON, OR HAVING AN ELECTRONIC SIGNATURE PLACED ON IT, ON 09:45:13 25 MR. RUBINER: IT'S ACTUALLY 4:07 BUT THAT'S NEITHER 25 OR ABOUT MAY 14TH, 2012? 179 PAGE 178 PAGE 180 1 HERE NOR THERE. 09:15:13 1 A NO, I DIDN'T REVIEW IT BEFORE I SIGNED. I'VE 09:45:13 2 Q MR. OGULNICK, EARLIER TODAY YOU 2 NEVER SEEN THIS DOCUMENT BEFORE. 3 TESTIFIED -- STRIKE THAT. 09:45:13 3 Q YOU'VE NEVER SEEN EXHIBIT B BEFORE? 09:45:13 4 I'M GOING TO ASK THE COURT REPORTER TO MARK AS 09:15:13 4 MR. BI910: OBJECTION. ASKED AND ANSWERED. 5 EXHIBIT B A MULTI -PAGE DOCUMENT ENTITLED DEFENDANT'S 09:45:13 5 MR. RUBINER: THAT'S FINE. OKAY. THAT'S FINE. IT 6 SUPPLEMENTAL RESPONSES TO DOCUMENT REQUESTS -- 6 WILL BE SUBJECT TO A MEET AND CONFER SUBSEQUENT. D9:45:13 7 MR. BISNO: THANKS. 09:45:13 7 ACTUALLY, WHY DON'T WE FINISH NOW. I'D LIKE TO D9:45:13 8 MR. RUBINER: -- SET NO. ONE. 8 DO A MEET AND CONFER ON THE RECORD, COUNSEL. 09:45:13 9 (WHEREUPON, THE ABOVE -MENTIONED DOCUMENT WAS 09:45:13 9 AS YOUR CLIENT RESPONDED TO THESE REQUESTS, HE 10 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION BY THE SHORTHAND REPORTER AND 10 FILED A DOCUMENT, YOU OR YOUR ASSOCIATE, MR. FOX, GAVE, 11 ATTACHED HERETO. 11 PRODUCED TO US A DOCUMENT HAVING A VERIFICATION ON IT 09:45:13 12 Q BY MR. RUBINER: DO YOU HAVE EXHIBIT N0. 8 IN 12 THAT YOUR CLIENT CLAIMS NEVER TO HAVE SEEN. WHETHER 13 FRONT OF YOU, SIR? 13 MR. FOX WRONGFULLY DID THAT, I'D LIKE YOU TO FIND OUT 09:45:13 14 A I DO. 14 AND REPORT BACK TO ME AS TO WHY THE WITNESS HAS NEVER 09:15:13 15 Q WOULD YOU TAKE A MOMENT TO REVIEW EXHIBIT B AND 15 SEEN EXHIBIT B YET IS SOMETHING THAT PURPORTS TO HAVE 16 LET ME KNOW WHEN YOU'VE FINISHED, 16 HIS SIGNATURE ON IT THAT MR. FOX SUBMITTED AS AN OFFICER 09:45:13 17 A COUNSEL, THIS IS A LONG DOCUMENT SO WHAT KIND 17 OF THE COURT APPEARS TO HAVE BEEN PRODUCED IN THIS 18 OF REVIEW ARE YOU ASKING ME TO DO? 18 ACTION AND IMMEDIATELY PRODUCE A NEW RESPONSE THAT YOUR 09:15:13 19 Q LET ME -- I'LL REPRESENT TO YOU THAT THESE ARE 19 CLIENT WILL HAVE ACTUALLY SEEN. 20 SUPPLEMENTAL -- THAT THESE DOCUMENTS WERE SERVED -- THIS 09:45:13 20 I THINK IT'S POTENTIALLY A -- I DON'T KNOW. 21 DOCUMENT WAS SERVED TO ME BY YOUR ATTORNEY, MR. FOX; 21 I'M NOT GOING TO CHARACTERIZE WHAT IT IS, THE FACT THAT 22 THAT IT PURPORTS TO BE SUPPLEMENTAL RESPONSES TO A 22 THERE'S A DOCUMENT THAT PURPORTS TO HAVE YOUR CLIENT'S 23 VARIETY OF DOCUMENT REQUESTS WITH SOME ATTACHMENTS. I 23 SIGNATURE THAT WAS SUBMITTED AS A COURT DOCUMENT THAT HE 24 ACTUALLY WANT TO FOCUS ON THE THIRD FROM LAST PAGE 24 NEVER SAW. AND I'D LIKE YOU TO LOOK INTO THAT PRIOR TO 25 ENTITLED "VERIFICATION." 25 THE NEXT SESSION OF HIS DEPOSITION AND REPORT BACK TO ME 178 180 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818,995.2449 - SHEET 46 PAGE 181 PAGE 183 1 AS TO WHAT YOU'RE GOING TO DO ABOUT IT. 1 LATENESS OF THE HOUR, THAT WE WOULD CONTINUE THE :45:13 2 MR. DISNO: COUNSEL, I HAD EARLIER TESTIFIED -- 2 DEPOSITION AT A DATE TO BE AGREED UPON BETWEEN COUNSEL 3 PAR30N ME, I HAD EARLIER OBSERVED THAT MY CLIENT WAS, 3 AND ONE OF MR, OGULNICK'S COUNSEL, WHETHER IT'S 4 IN MY VIEW, LACKING THE ABILITY TO FULLY UNDERSTAND YOUR 4 MR. BISND OR MR. FOX; 5 QUESTIONS AND LACKING THE ABILITY TO COMPETENTLY RESPOND 09:45: 13 S THAT THE COURT REPORTER WOULD BE RELIEVED OF 6 AS HE DID AN HOUR, TWO OR THREE AGO ALLOWING FOR THE 6 HER STATUTORY RESPONSIBILITY TO MAINTAIN CUSTODY OF THE 7 LENGTH OF THIS DEPOSITION, AND AS COUNSEL IS AWARE, AS 7 ORIGINAL OF THE DEPOSITION TRANSCRIPT; THAT UPON ITS 8 OF JUNE 5TH, 2012, WHICH IS THE DATE OF MR, FOX'S 8 COMPLETION THE TRANSCRIPT WILL BE FORWARDED TO 9 SIGNATURE, I WAS NOT ASSOCIATED IN THE CASE. 9 MR. BISNO; THAT THE WITNESS WILL HAVE 30 DAYS FROM :45:13 10 MR. RUBINER: THAT'S WHY I ASKED YOU TO LOOK -- 10 MR. BISNO'S RECEIPT TO REVIEW THE TRANSCRIPT, P:AKE ANY 11 PLEASE CONTACT MR. FOX -- 11 CHANGES TO THE TRANSCRIPT AND SIGN IT UNDER PENALTY OF :45:13 12 MR. BISND: PLEASE ALLOW -- I THOUGHT OUR PROTOCOL 12 PERJURY; THAT THE WITNESS WILL THEN RETURN THE 13 WAS YOU GET TO FINISH, THEN I GET TO FINISH AND THEN YOU 13 TRANSCRIPT TO MR. BISND; MR. BISND WILL NOTIFY ME WITHIN 14 GET TO FINISH AND THEN I GET TO FINISH, 14 TEN BAYS IF THERE'S BEEN ANY CHANGES TO THE TRANSCRIPT :15:13 15 ALONG THAT LINE I WOULD BE HAPPY TO DO SO. 15 AND THAT HE HAS A COPY OF THE TRANSCRIPT; THAT MR. BISNO :45:13 16 MR. RUBINER: ESPECIALLY IN LIGHT OF, AS YOU'LL 16 WILL RETAIN OR MR. FOX WILL RETAIN CUSTODY OF THE 17 REVIEW THE TRANSCRIPT, HIS EARLIER TESTIMONY THAT HE 17 ORIGINAL OF THE DEPOSITION TRANSCRIPT, WILL MATE IT 18 NEVER LOOKED FOR DOCUMENTS DESPITE REPRESENTATIONS AND 18 AVAILABLE AT ANY HEARING OR AT TRIAL. 19 OTHER RESPONSES FROM YOUR CLIENT THAT HE DID DILIGENTLY 09:45:13 19 IF !OR SOME REASON THE ORIGINAL OF THE 20 SEARCH FOR AND INQUIRE ABOUT DOCUMENTS. HE MADE THOSE 20 DEPOSITION TRANSCRIPT IS LOST, MISPLACED OR OTHERWISE 21 REPRESENTATIONS THIS MORNING LONG BEFORE HE WAS TOO 21 UNAVAILABLE, A CERTIFIED COPY CAN BE USED FOR ALL 22 TIRED OR TOO OUT OF SORTS TO ANSWER, IN YOUR 22 PURPOSES INCLUDING AT TRIAL. 23 OBSERVATION. IT WAS EARLIER THIS MORNING WHEN YOU DID 09:45:13 23 MR. BISNO: SO STIPULATED. 24 NOT OBSERVE THAT MR. OGULNICK SEEMED UNABLE TO 09:45:13 24 MR. RUBINER: THANK YOU. 25 COM?REHEND QUESTIONS OR TOTALLY ANSWER IN A TRUTHFUL 09:45:13 25 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: WE'RE OFF RECORD 4:15 P.M. 181 183 PAGE 1 2 3 4 :45:13 :45:13 15:13 45:13 S fi 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 11 23 24 25 182 MANNER. AT LEAST IN MY RECOLLECTION YOU NEVER RAISED THAT ISSUE BEFORE LUNCH AND PRIOR TO LUNCH IS WHEN MR. OGULEICK TESTIFIED THAT HE NEVER LOOKED FOR DOCUMENTS, HE NEVER REQUESTED THAT ANYBODY LOOK FOR DOCUMENTS. I THINS IT'S -- AND I AM SAYING ON THE RECORD AND I WILL FOLLOW UP IN A LETTER TO MR, FOX AND YOU AS HIS NEW COUNSEL, THAT YOU GET TO THE BOTTOM OF WHY THIS WITNESS NEVER LOOKED FOR DOCUMENTS DESPITE PRESENTING SEVERAL DOCUMENTS TO THE COURT WITH HIS SIGNATURE THAT INDICATE THAT HE DILIGENTLY SEARCHED FOR AND MADE INQUIRY ABOUT DOCUMENTS WHICH HE CLEARLY TESTIFIED HE NEVER DID AND THAT DOCUMENTS HAVE BEEN PRODUCED THAT HE NEVER REVIEWED, AND I'D LIKE YOU TO REVIEW THAT AND GET BACK TO ME AS QUICKLY AS POSSIBLE BEFORE I HAVE TO BRING IT TO THE ATTENTION OF THE COURT. MR. BISND: COUNSEL, YOUR SUMMARY OF MY CLIENT'S TESTIMONY IS IN NO WAY EQUAL TO MY VIEW OF MY CLIENT'S TESTIMONY BUT FORTUNATELY WE HAVE A RECORD WHICH DOES A BETTER JOB THAN YOUR MEMORY OR MINE. MR, RUBINER: LET'S GO OFF THE RECORD A SECOND. THE VIDEDGEAPHER: WE'RE OFF RECORD 4:13 P.M. (RECESS HELD). THE VIDEOGRAPHER: WE'RE ON THE RECORD 4:14 P.M. MR, RUBINER: OFF THE RECORD WE AGREED, GIVEN THE - PAGE 45:13 1 45:13 2 45:13 3 :45:13 4 45:13 S 45:13 6 45:13 7 45:13 8 9 45:13 10 45:13 11 45:13 12 45:13 13 45:13 14 45:13 15 45:13 16 45:13 17 45:13 18 45:13 19 45:13 20 45:13 21 45:13 22 45:13 23 45;13 24 4 5: 13 25 184 THIS ENDS THE PROCEEDINGS FOR TODAY, AUGUST 13TH, 2012, -000- (WHEREUPON, THE DEPOSITION WAS ADJOURNED AT 1:15 P.M.) Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 -000- R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 _ SHEET 47 PAGE 185 :45:13 1 STATE OF CALIFORNIA ) 83. :45:13 2 COUNTY OF IAS ANGELES ) :45:13 3 :45:13 4 :45:13 5 I DO SOLL4ILY DECLAFE UNDER PENALTY OF PERJURY 6 TEAT THE FOREGOING I5 NY DEPOSITION ONORR OATH; THAT 7 THESE ARE THE QUESTIONS ASKED OF M AND NY ANSWERS 8 THERETO; THAT I RAVE READ SANE AND RAVE WADE THE 9 NECESSARY CORRECTIONS, AUDITIONS OR CNANGSS TO NY 10 ANSWERS THAT I DEEM NECESSARY. 45:13 11 EXECUTED AT :45:13 12 CALIPOPNIA, ON 20 :45:13 13 :45:13 14 45:13 15 :45:13 16 45:13 1/ 45:13 18 45:13 19 :45:13 20 :45:13 21 45:13 22 45:13 23 45:13 24 45:13 25 RYAN ANDREW CGUIMCK - PAGE 186 :45:13 1 STATE OF CALIFOMIA ) :45:13 2 COUNTY OY LOS ANGELES :45:13 3 :45:13 4 :45:13 5 I, ROBIN LEONABD, A CHRTIFIED SHORTHAND 6 REPORTER LICENSED BY THE STATE OF CALIFDRNIA, CERTIFY: 45:13 7 THAT THE FOREGOING DEPOSITION OF RYAN ANDREW S OGOLNICR WAS TAKEN SEMEN HE PURSUANT TO NOTICE AT THE 9 TIM AND PLACE THERRIN SET FORTS, AT WHICH TINE THE 10 WITNESS WAS PUT UNDER OATH BY NE; 45:13 11 THAT THE THSTRIDNY OF THE WITNESS AND ALL 12 OBJECTIONS WADE AT THE TIM OF THE F.YANINATION WERE 13 RRCORDED STBNOGRAPBICALLY BY NR ANO MAE TNERF.AFTER 14 TRANSCRIEED; 45:13 15 THAT THE FOREGOING IS A TRUE RECORD OF THE 16 TESTINONY AND OF ALL OBJECTIONS AT THE TIRE OF THE 17 EEANINAT.M. 45:13 18 IN WITNESS THEREOF, I HAVE SUBSCRIBED NY SAtffi 19 THIS 17TH DAY OF AUGUST, 2012. 45:13 29 45:13 21 45:13 22 45:13 23 LICENSE HOMER 3334 45:13 24 25 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 $12,000 [2168:13.14 $200,00011177:10 $3 111134:10 $300 111158:13 $300,000 (11149:15 $32,000 [21144:19145:20 $5 111134:13 $51 (11117:25 $51,350,000111129:18 $60 111131:24 $80 [21131:23145:14 /// 11174:25 0 0 111110:15 0811123:11 09 [2121:8 23:11 1 1:15 0178:17 1:231,178:21 10:42 1312:5 6:2,7 100 111155:23 104 1114:7 104/7 O15:10 106117 I115:11 11:52 I1159:7 11111 1115:12 12:02 11159:9 12:23 11174:17 12:241074:19 12:2911177:17 12:30 13178:13,15,19 12:31 11178:13 122 1114:9 125 1114:11 13TH 1216:11 184:2 141/16 1115:13 14TH 121179:17,25 150-DAY Ill 117:20 1-50 1111:21 15601,156:11 175/23 1115:14 178 1115:2 17TH Ill 186:20 18/1 [115:7 1875 1212:3,15 19.6 11182:9 1989 11133:17 1993 13135:11 40:2,3 1994 12140:12 41:8 1995 11140:3 1996 16140:12 41:8 42:14 43:3 55: 8 56:5 1998 16143:4 55:8 56:5,14,19 57: 23 Sheet 1 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 199914156:19 61:4 62:9 79:5 2 2:29 11I 156:24 2:32 111125:13 2:45I1] 125:15 20.4 11182:8 20/41115:8 200 121149:15 155:23 2000113157:13,21,25 59:11 61:4 62:9,17,18,25 63:6,16 64:13 65:8 2003 [4180:8,21 81:10,18 2005 120154:18 57:13,21 58:20 59: 11 62:18,25 63:6,16,21 64:13 65: 8,12 70:22,25 71:6,12 82:8 95:21 129:1 2006 15165:13,21 70:25 71:6,12 2007 [4120:13,15 54:18130:10 2008 14111:14,18 23:12150:22 2009 [14111:14 20:3,5,24 21:2,5, 20 22:8,12,20 23:7,12 132:11,22 2011 14125:3,12 94:22 145:17 2012 11011:26 2:5 6:1,11 25:8 179: 18, 25181:8 184:2 186:20 20TH 121127:1,5 23RD 1212:3,16 24TH 11121:8 260 I1182:9 27/71,15:9 271 11173:16 3 3:40 111157:1 30 h1103:15,19104:2132:2144: 11 155:9 183:9 30-MINUTE Ill 145:16 31 111131:9 32131131:9 132:2 145:21 33341311:31 2:6186:24 3600 12132:9,15 37174 1111:32 37600 Is] 23:20 30:4 32:15 4 4:07111177:25 4:09 (11177:22 4:13111182:22 4:14 [11182:24 4:15 (31177:23183:25 184:9 40 11194:3 40,000-SQUARE 11182:10 4142 Ill1:29 469871 1116:17 48 111166:1 5 50 [4153:21 83:25 117:4140:6 5TH I1] 181:8 6 60 111148:18 60-MONTH Ill166:1 7 751114:6 8 8,000 111145:24 80 11164:17 818 1111:31 9 9/20/10 [11126:17 917 [115:6 900671212:4117 900691113:6 91436 1111:30 9201,13:5 92551113:4 94 11140:4 96 15140:4 42:24 45:19 46:1,5 98 15142:24 45:19 46:1,6 95:16 99 [5156:18 57:24 58:11,12 61:6 995-2449 1111:31 A A. M 1412:5 6:2,7 59:7 ABANDONED M 161:3 ABILITY 141149:13 156:15181:4, 5 ABLE [81115:10 136:6 138:23 170 9,11 176:15,18177:12 ABOVE Ill 102:3 ABOVE -MENTIONED 15175:1 104:17 122:7 125:23 178:9 ABSOLUTELY Ill 131:6 ACCEPT 11195:2 ACCOMPLI Ill 131:8 ACCOMPLISH [11110:12 ACCOMPLISHED Ill 62:9 ACCORDING 121166:16177:22 ACCOUNT 13128:7,13,18 ACCOUNTING Ill46:10 ACCURATE 19114:21 43:6 45:15 50:9 75:17 87:6,8 161:13176:18 ACQUIRE [17141:1 43:14 45:3,9 55:7,19 60:4,19 64:1 77:8,14105: 5 112:9,16,17 150:11 159:16 ACQUIRED (9145:8 47:4 50:17 56:1,24 60:15 64:6 65:13 82:7 ACQUIRING Ill 147:8 ACQUISITION 12158:13 165:13 ACRES 12182:9,9 ACROSS 141144:15 145:4 155:24 157:16 ACTED Ill 90:11 ACTION Ill 180:18 ACTIVE 13146:23,24165:6 ACTIVITIES [1124d2 ACTUAL 13192:2123:15 144:17 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 ACTUALLY 121117:14,19 46:25 58:11 74:21 92:5 98:6 102:5 106: 5 122:13 126:23 133:4137:14 144:14169:4175:25177:25 178: 24179:16 180:7,19 AD Ill 144:24 ADDITION 13144:6 65:4 81:1 ADDITIONAL 12194:25 138:22 ADDITIONALLY [2113:12,24 ADDITIONS Ill 185:10 ADDRESS I10123:7,21 24:4 25:24 26:1,3,6,8 30:15 56:12 ADJACENT 121152:3154a ADJOURN I11175:9 ADJOURNED 111184:8 ADMISSIBLE 15112:5 22:15 34:4, 781:5 ADVERSITY Ill 95:15 ADVICE Ill 169:12 ADVISE 14110:21,22,24108:2 ADVISED 13163:19 68:19 125:9 ADVISORS 11511:5 4:7,9,11 7:18 15:7,13,16 104:14 111:23 112:2, 5 117:16 123:13 130:24 ADVISORY 1714:8,10,12104:15 122:4 123:11 125:21 AERIAL Ill 56:1 z AFFAIRS 11165:6 AFFILIATED Ill8:6 AFFILIATION [3142:12141:11,11 AFFIRMED I117:7 AFFLUENT [1187:16 AFTERNOON 121176:24177:8 AGENTS Ill 112:13 AGGRESSIVE 12146:24 68:13 AGO 0218:1,17,18,20 9:12 93:14 128:21 155:1 157:3 158:7177:4 181:6 AGREE 121163:12177:3 AGREED 17193:22117:13132:22 151:3 159:2 182:25183:2 AGREEMENTS 121136:8162:9 AHEAD 15166:1 88:7 152:20 160: 11 174:6 AIR Ill 10:23 AL I316:13,15,16 ALBANY 16134:22,23,25 35:22 36: 19 40:2 ALCOHOLIC Ill 175:17 ALERTED [11104:2 ALIGNING Ill 156:2 ALLAN 121116:12118:6 ALLOW [3149:21 172:13181:12 ALLOWED [4119:19 62:5 93:23 149:2 ALLOWING Ill181:6 ALLOWS 111120:9 ALMOST 12166:10162:10 ALREADY [a] 9:11 93:6 98:10,11 $12,000 - ALREADY 118:20 120:16 145:19 153:22 ALTERNATE 121138:3,7 ALTHOUGH 1617:1512:21 28:2 109:12 130:5,23 AMBIGUOUS I13128:9 30:23 48: 25 50:2 53:9,17,17,19 73:23 78:2 90:21 100:15102:20 AMONG 13186:16 117:13151:13 AMOUNT 111194:20 97:21,22 103: 1,2 115:7 120:19 122:20,22 128:2 131:1 AMOUNTS 111137:6 AMPERSAND 12157:17,18 ANA 13177:16 78:11 146:22 ANDREW 1631:252:1 4:3 7:6185: 19186:8 ANGELES 11711:2 2:4,8,17 3:6 6: 1,10,13 11:16 23:5 39:9 41:4 47: 22 58:6 80:17185:3 186:3 ANNOUNCED m 166:14 ANOTHER 117154:7 56:11 57:1,7 65:13 120:14 128:9 132:25 139:8 140:8 159:20 169:18 174:7.17,21 175:11 177:22 ANSWERED [21116:25 28:20 37: 9 51:20 72:12,20 83:13 85:18,19 86:1,6,11,20 92:23 95:25 103:18 127:15 146:3 153:18 174:2 180:4 ANSWERING 11019:18 18:17 29: 24 52:22 85:2100:20 107:13 117: 9125:9176:23 ANSWERS 15149:7176:18,20 185:8,11 ANYBODY 111110:24 13:3 17:5 19:16 106:23 111:2 114:15,18 122:19 140:21 182:4 ANYWAY 0188:4 APARTMENT 19141:2,3 58:5,14 59:16 65:14 73:16 87:19122:18 APARTMENTS 14161:12,15 62: 14 82:9 APC 1112:13 APOLOGIZE 12152:19100:2 APPARENT [21175:7,7 APPEARANCES 1312:10 3:1 6: 21 APPEARS 13175:16 105:19 180: 17 APPLICATION 12151:6 77:12 APPRECIATE (I193:9 APPROACHING 11164:16 APPROPRIATE 11161:20 APPROVE (1)141:13 APPROXIMATELY (4156:14,19 57:22,23 APRIL [1] 128:17 ARBITRATION 11112:19 ARCHITECT [2121:21 55:5 ARCHITECTS 111147:1 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters ARI Ill 3:8 AWARE 17117.18 29:11 30:13 ARIA 181168:9,19,19,20,21,22169: 3 132:10136:11 131:7 22,25 AWAY [4113:19 111:15 128:21 ARIV [11136:14 160:10 AROUND 111161:13,14 90:7108: 14 118:18 132:24156:13 158:25 162:9 163:22 168:5 ARRANGE 121130:1 170:25 ARTICULATE N 176:13 ASS [21148:16 149:14 ASSERTED Ill142:17 ASSET 141122:17 127:23 132:18 163:16 ASSETS 19132:20 ASSIGNED Ill 83:6 ASSISTED 11165:5 ASSOCIATE Ill Y Sod o ASSOCIATED Ill 181:9 ASSUME 14110:714:6113:9130: 23 ASSUMED m 162:8 ASSUMES 121139:5147:17 ATTACHED 16175:3 91:20 104:19 122:9 125:25 178:11 ATTACHMENTS Ill 178:23 ATTACK Ill 147:6 ATTEMPT [21130:1 150:12 ATTEMPTING Ill 10:4 ATTEND 19132:18,21 33:18,21 35: 20,22 36:1,3 171:4 ATTENDED m 36:18 ATTENDING 13135:21.25 36:2 ATTENTION [41101:9 161:17 174: 10 182:16 ATTORNEY [14] 27:11,17 31:5 55: 4 68:14,19 84:9 101:7,9 108:2 158:13161:13178:21 179:19 ATTORNEY -CLIENT 113116:13, 1717:9,11 27:12 100:24101:22 106:11 111:5 113:6117:10135:1 179:15 ATTORNEY'S Ill 50:9 ATTORNEYS 14116:14117:16 142:16 146:25 AUDACITY Ill 158:8 AUGUST 11011:26 2:5 6:1,11 102: 10 106:2,17117:19 184:2 186:20 AUGUST/SEPTEMBER [2)119: 22 120:25 AUTHORIZE 151106:23107:3,12 160:18 179:11 AUTHORIZED 161106:8,18 108: 15 160:23,25 161:20 AUTHORIZING 121107:17108:5 AVAILABLE 151117:2131:5,12 161:17 183:18 AVENUE 11158:7 AVOIDS Ill 155:22 AVON Ill 54:6 B BACK 121150A 54:18 66:11 68:14 70:15 78:22112:10 125:16131:2, 7,8 133:24140:1 147:11 150:22 166:12 167:14 168:11 180:14,25 182:15 BACKGROUND 15111:23 34:2,12 114:2,5 BAD [31147:9166:24175:1 BADGER 121103:25 104:4 BADGERING 17151:22,25 52:5 103:17104:3,11 154:3 BALANCE [21166:20170a0 BALCONY 121152:3154:1 BALL [11132:23 BANK 161120:20 129:8 150:22 159:21 163:1 169:10 BANK -OWNED Ill163:1 BANKS [11117:17 BAR 121152:3 154:1 BARCLAY'S 141130:7,8 131:14, 18 BARRY Ill3:9 BASED 11019:1918:17 78:14 81: 10 92:7 128:7 129:6 139:9 149:16 172:11 BASELINE 111137:4 BASIS 12153:15 104:10 BECAME 14121:1 22:8 55:20131: 8 BECOME 15118:25 19:8 20:1 147: 9 166:9 BEEKMAN 12137:24 38:6 BEGAN 15121:20 43:13 57:25 66: 13 118:11 BEGIN 12157:9 71:5 BEGINNING 16125:8 49:8 118:5 161:18 166:6 168:1 BEHALF [71108:6160:8,12,19,25 161:20 163:3 BELIEF [2] 149:10 157:6 BELIEVED Ila] 68:8 91:15 92:17 115:9 116:24 120:19 129:6,16 135:6136:9 BELIEVING 121168:4172:10 B-E-N-C-H-A-Y Ill58:18 BEN (3139:16 40:15 54:22 BENCHAY 9158A6,25,25 59:2 65:5,22 70:20 BENCHAY'S Ill66:4 BENEFIT (21157:17159:4 BEST (5145:21 65:3 84:8152:25, 25 BESTUNNED Ill m:11 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. I August 13, 2012 BETRAYED [21144:15 156:14 BETTER [11154:17,19120:7,8,14 132:7144:23 148:17,t 9177:13 182:20 BEVERAGES Ill 175:17 BEYOND Ill 9:11 BIG 141131:3 157:9 165:23,24 BILLBOARDS [11161:15 BINDING [11160:13 BIOGRAPHY Ill 114:18 B-I-S-N-O 1117:1 BC 1116:17 BEGINNING [116:7 BEHALF [212:2 6:18 BILL [1) 39:16 BIRD [212:12 6:13 BISNO'S Ill 183:10 BIT 131120:12 133:13169:18 BLACK Ill88:20 BLAME 151138:2169:1,2,2,3 BLAMED Ill 168:25 BLEW 111118:23 BOB 161146:19,21 147:25 167:5 177:2,3 BODE 111156:1 BOTH 18114:7 51:21 53:5 66:8 121:21,25 143:10,10 BOTTOM 121179:7 182:8 BOUGHT 13162:14 81:23 82:2 BOULEVARD [113:4 BOXER 1112:12 BRAM 111129:4 BRAND-NEW I11122:18 BREAK (6159:6,11 78:13,15 125: 12156:22 BRENTWOOD 11165:14 BRIEFLY 1117:16 BRING (6169:21 101:8 127:24161: 16174:10 182:15 BRINGING Ill 158:23 BROKE 121139:22157:11 BROKER [71119:8,12124:4128:9, 25145:4156:17 BROKERING [2115:23 96:11 BROKERS 151117:21 127:25 128: 8 160:7 163:22 BROTHER 118120:18 30:12 90:6 142:21,22 144:20 145:5,17 152:5, 7 154:13,17,20,25 155:5,20 158:5, 10 BROTHER'S (7167:22146:8,11 147:12 157:3,3 158:7 BROTHERS 15139:17 42:4142: 21 143:1,5 BROUGHT [51128:25 136:17159: 8,17163:20 BUDGET 11,190:19 91:2,5,7,9,9 92:13,19,20,21,25 BUILD 14141:1 48:17,1882:9 Sheet 2 ALREADY - BUILD BUILDING 15148:21 53:5 65:14 87:19 122:18 BUILDINGS 11187:19 BUILT 13148:2,8,11 BUSINESSES 11)11:24 BUY 15157:2 62:16 120:9 166:22, 23 BUYER 123116:23,23 BUYOUT 12157:3,4 BUYOUTS 11157:6 C C.S.R Ell 1:27 CAFE [21139:21 151:10 CALCULATED [5112:4 22:14 34: 3,6 81:4 CALCULATING [2192:2,5 CALIFORNIA 12511:1,5,13,15,17, 19,30 2:4,9,17 3:6 6:1,10,14 36: 21,24 37:3 40:9 43:1 61:21 62:1 185:1,13 186:1,7 CALL P 7178:14 97:16,16120:4,5 124:21 134:8 138:12,14,16,18,18 140:19 160:8 167:11 173:6,9 CALLED 11717:19 12:10 15:13, 15 31:16 37:24 57:13 64:7 66:17 72: 4 73:2,19,21 74:2,11 137:4164: 22 CALLING Ili 151:10 CALLS [13116:12,16 17:8 18:4 27: 11 29:13,22,25 100:23,25 101:2 120:6 150:5 CAME [25110:8 58:10 91:6,9 92:1 95:15 131:2,7,8 132:24 139:9 140: 12,24 143:18 144:15145:12 148: 11 150:9151:19 157:16 164:23 165:12 169:9,16 170:7 CAMPAIGN N 135:19 CANCELLED [21139:25159:13 CANDY 11157:17 CANNOT [3118:6 85:5,8 CAPACITIES [2122:6148:24 CAPACITY 19116:4 32:16 45:16 48:16 50:11 55:25 139:18144:25 148:21 CAPITALIZED [2198:22145:13 CAPITALIZING [1177:14 CAPTION 1116:15 CAPTURES Ill 10:17 CAR 131108:20,22 110:7 CARD 131143:17,18,20 CARDS (141140:22141:2,5,8,14, 17142:6146:1,10,14 147:13,13 148:12149:5 CARE t1195:6 CAREER 13148:17 52:9 53:7 CARLOS [2196:14161:4 CARRIES 11114:12 CASE [2DI6d 5,16,25 8:3,7,21 9:3 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 10:8 11:17 12:8,11 15:13 34:11 37:8 68:25,25 81:6 93:2155:17 181:9 CASES Ill 6:23 CASTRO [2196:14,15 CAUSE 171101:21,23107:6,14 117:10,11 125:10 CAUSES 121111:6 113:5 CAUTION 11168:22 CENTER [1182:10 CENTRAL 12111:16 158:11 CENTURY 1212:3,15 CEO 16118:25 19:6 71:25 72:1,7, 24 CERTAIN [73133:11 51:8 63:17 86:15 90:23 97:21,22 100:10 103: 1,2 115:7 129:8 137:13 CERTAINLY I1D112:3 22:5 86:14 115:8116:18 133:11 136:12138: 23,25 141:1 '. CERTIFIED 1411:28 2:7183:21 186:6 CERTIFY [9186:7 CFO 118118:22,23 19:4,9 20:2,14, 20 21:1 22:3,9 72:10143:14,16 145:9 146:11,14 148:21,22 CHAGRIN [11140:10 C-H-A-N 11143:21 CHAN 16143:18,19,23 46:4 56:25 57:6 CHANCE 121115:14158:1 CHANGE [Ill 50:12 55:1,22 61:23, 24 83:3,5 92:15,16,18 120:17 CHANGED 15120:22 29:19 55:18 131:25,25 CHANGES 141156:22183:11,14 185:10 CHAN'S I7144:1 CHARACTERIZE [11180:21 CHARGE 1611822 21:10,13,18,21 22:3 CHART 1614:6 74:22 75:12,16,18 76:2 CHASM 111131:11 CHECK [3192:20,21 169:10 CHECKBOOK Ill 148:23 CHECKS (41145:22,23,25 165:24 CHIEF 1121112:8 140d6,22141: 18,20 142:6,10,19,23 146:2 147: 14 165:14 CHIEFLY Ill95:4 CIRCUMSTANCE 111106:15 CIRCUMSTANCES 14179:6 96:9, 23 107:25 CITY 116133:3,5,7,8 34:20 51:7 61: 18,22 77:12,15,23 78:10 82:8 115: 12137:4160:9 CIVIL 11155:4 CLAIM [2]67:11 156:7 CLAIMING 121171:3176:5 CLAIMS 16137:8 67:8 95:2134:18, 20 180:12 CLASS 121122:18,19 CLEAN [21169:9170:8 CLEAR 14110:18 25:6 146:5 164: 10 CLEARLY 13181:4 132:9 182:12 CLIENT'S 191 t0:19 81:6,1 o 175:6 176:12,13 180:22 182:17,18 CLIENTS 11181:2 CLOCK [I1177:22 CLOSE [3149:25 128:7 138:21 CLOSED (3158:13,13 63:19 CLOSER Ill 110:15 CLUB 19137:24 38:6,19,21 151:18, 19154:2,9,22 COLDWATER Ill 98:15 COLLECTING [1166:13 COLLEGE [9123:20 30:5 32:9 33; 18,21 34:10 38:15,23,25 COLLEGES Ill 35:22 COLLOQUIAL Ili 13:15 COLONY Ili 168:9 COME 117128:7 58:9 66:11 70:15 116:6,18 117:22118:9 127:19 129:9 132:4 137:19 139:12, 22 140:7 163:5 167:3 COMES [21121:16 155:24 COMFORTABLE Ill 95:5 COMING 11519:25 68:3 112:24 116:5 129:14,23 132:12 139:15 145:4 162:14166:10,15 168:11 170:3 172:9 COMMA Ili e4:7 COMMENT [2150:9 172:1 COMMENTS (419:24 10:6 14:18 19:19 COMMITTED Ill 165:5 COMMONS 1073:19 COMMUNICATING 121101:7,10 COMMUNICATIONS [7168:24 101:17106:20, 22 107:7,15125: 10 COMMUNITY Ill 146:22 COMPANIES 110117:6 20:5 72:25 9 8:3,18 100:11 113:14,18,19171; 16 COMPANY'S 11115:25 COMPENSATED 151161:23 162: 1,5 164:8,16 COMPENSATION 131163:9,18 164:12 COMPETENTLY 111181:5 COMPLETE Ill 14:21 COMPLETED 14162:6 91:2,12,22 COMPLETELY (1149:18 COMPLETING I1i95:15 COMPLETION Ili 183:8 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 COMPLEX [1159:16 COMPLEXES 12158:6,14 COMPOUND Ill 23:15 COMPREHEND 131176:12,15 181:25 COMPUTER 111124:8.16,19 26:18 27:3,8 29:1,6,9,10,17 COMPUTERS 16124:24 26:21 29: 11,16,18,20 CONCEDE 11328:2 CONCERNING 12D112:15 15:2,5 16:5,9,23 17:3,6 18:2 22:15 37:12 41:12,25 44:7,22 46:14 61:18 62: 3 81:5 86:10 CONCLUSION 131112:25 139:9 150:9 CONDITION (4188:15 175:6177: 12,16 CONDITIONED 0178:6 CONDITIONS 01131:25 CONDO 11161:11 CONDOMINIUMS [2161:12,15 CONDOS Ill 62:15 CONFER 121180:6,8 CONFERENCE [9 78:13 CONFIDENTIAL (1112:3 CONFUSED Ili 109:8 CONFUSING Ill48:14 CONFUSION 11131:5 CONGLOMERATION (11137:14 CONJURE 11199:5 CONNECTION 1218:215:20 CONNECTIONS 111115:8 CONSENT [V 148:2 CONSEQUENTIAL Ill 136:18 CONSIDER [3163:25 90:15 140:4 CONSIDERED [2146:22 64:19 CONSISTENTLY 11151:21 CONSOLIDATED [']6:24 CONSTANCE 1213:10 6:8 CONSTRUCTION [13189:17,19, 21,22 90:2,8,11,16,20 92:7,10,13 131:23 CONSULTANT 131113:14,18139: 18 CONSULTANTS [7155:8 77:13, 13 113:17,21 146:25 165d 5 CONSULTING 1714:8,10,12104: 14122:4123:11 125:20 CONTACT 16198:18 100:12 119: 12161:9 168:14181:11 CONTACTED 121122:14150:15 CONTAINED 111137:13 CONTENDS 11122:16 CONTENT 121101:7113:6 CONTENTION Ill 10:21 CONTENTS n1107:6 CONTEXT 16130:24 31:1,1 53:11 67:19 93:5 Sheet 3 BUILDING - CONTEXT CONTINUE 19156:7 103:25 115:2 135:12 138:6 149:2176:23 177: 23 183:1 CONTINUED 1613:1 5:1 58:19 63: 25 157:10 172:12 CONTINUING 131104:3 176:11 177:7 CONTRACT 112158:5 60:16,17,21 77:10 91:19,20 92:15 137:3 139: 25150:3,23 CONTRACTOR 19130:12,25 31: 11 32:17 48:18 92:3,5 93:1,16 CONTRACTOR'S [2137:14 48:19 CONTRIBUTION 11187:11 CONTRIBUTIONS 11187:9 CONTROL [2110:8,9 CONTROLLED Ill 66:19 CONTROLS Ill 32:6 CONVERSATIONS [14185:21,24 100:14 102:19 103:5 116:17121: 1, 4127:11 143:8,11 153:7,10161: 24 CONVERSION 15161 d 1,21 62:3, 8,11 CONVERTING 13161:12,15164:3 CONVINCE 131135:16,19136:6 CONVINCED 111122:21 CONVINCING Ill 135:18 COPIES (1)17:14 COPY Fill 2:1 121:24 123:8 124: 13,15183:15,21 '. CORPORATIONS Ill 1:15 CORRECTIONS Ill185:10 CORRECTLY Ill 167:17 COSTS 12192:11,12 COULDN'T Ill 129:15 COUNCIL 12177:23 78:12 COUNSEL'S 1219:15 18:18 COUNTRY 14137:24 38:6,19,21 COUNTY 11211:2 2:8 41:4 47:16, 22 67:7 73:15,18,21 82:7185:3 186:3 COUPLE 18164:20 128:8 132:20 134:1,3 143:9 147:5 162:14 COUPLED Ill 137::12 COURSE [14113:3 36:24 37:5,6, 23 38:2,3,5 52:9 84:2 101:6 133: 14152:1 153:21 COURSES 15135:12,16 36:12,15 37:17 COURT In] 1:1 7:3 13:1,7,12,20 14:13 74:14,22 92:25 104:12 122: 2125:17148:1, 6 158:11,11 177: 14,20 178:4 180:17,23 182:10,16 183:5 COURTHOUSE 11111:16 CRAIG 131143:6,10155:5 CREATE [4121:22,22 26:8 37:3 CREATED 15117:15 20:12 91:3 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 146:2 168:12 CREATING [1118:2 CREATION 12185:10,11 CREDIBILITY 12181:6,7 CROCK Ill 149:9 CSR 1311:31 2:6 6:9 CURRENTLY (3122:2 72:24 175: 20 CURSORY [11160:3 CUSTODY 13112:7183:6,16 CUT 12192:20 145:23 CW 13130:12,17 90:7 0 DALESANDRO'S 121121:17130: 20 DANCE (11170:7 DARREN 11167:15 DATE 1616:11 108:12 126:22154: 10 181:8183:2 DAY 161126:23 147:5 148:21 149: 8 150:5 186:20 DAYS 18192:2,5,8,8 131:7148:18 183:9,14 DBA 14160:23,25 61:1,3 DC 15126:8,15,16,19 28:13 DEALING 111118:3 DEBT 151112:16,17 165:3,19167: 7 DECEIVED 111149:13 DECEMBER 1131139:16,20140:3 151:7 159:24 160:24 161:18,21 162:22 164:9,15 166:10 170:6 DECIDE Ill 92:25 DECIDED 111156:25 63:17 68:14 93:1 128:1 137:17 139:25 140:25 141:1 145:8 147:12 DECISION 15193:18,21,22,23133: 13 DECISIONS 14184:2 86:17 93:4, 14 DECLARE [11185:6 DEED 111134:23 DEEM Ill lm11 DEEMED 111112:13 DEEP 12164:7 105:11 DEFENDANT 1217:7 9:4 DEFENDANT'S 1215:2 178:5 DEFENDANTS PI1:23 3:2 6:25 DEFINITE Ill 64:25 DEFINITELY o1164:4 DEFINITION 14110:10 65:1 89:6,8 DEFINITIVE 14165:1 92:13127:9, 16 DEFINITIVELY 131169:25170:1 172:2 DEGREE [2135:5129:8 DELL Ill64:7 DELTA 1n 131:3 DENSITY Il150:20 DEPEND (11106:14 DEPENDING 11172:9 DEPOSIT 18160:17 77:10 140:1 146:19,25 149:16,18,22 DEPOSITS [11135:17 DESCRIBED 13161:9102:3,15 DESCRIBING 11184:7 DESERT [22123:11,13,17,22,25 24:2 30:5 31:17,20,21 32:9 80:25 82:8 88:15 89:25 90:3,12,20 91:2 94:7 118:25144:19 DESIGN 15118:22 21:10,14,18 22: 4 DESIGNER 111155:25 DESK Ill 17:16 DESPERATE 131146:16 148:16 149:17 DESPITE 16137:9 115:14151:3 177:10 181:18 182:9 DETAILS (1164:20 DETERMINATION 15141:16 55:4, 6 98:4150:11 DETERMINE 13165:2 172:15 173: 12 DETERMINED Is178:8 90:7132: 6 DETERMINES 11153:18 DEVELOP 19147:10,15,20 50:22 78:7 81:15 145:14 166:1 170:12 DEVELOPED Ill 48:20 DEVELOPER [3148:12 57:1 79:9 DEVELOPERS 121112:8116:10 DICTATE 11186:17 DIFFERENCE 18147:4109:22 134:4 145:11,12 171:21, 24 175:3 DIFFERENCES 12144:19,21 DIFFERENT 113119:18 21:4 42:11 43:7 44:20 46:18,19 63:25 64:20 66:16 69:19 110:2 129:24 DIFFICULT 121137:6,16 DIFFICULTIES 11154:24 DIG 11J 115:16 DILIGENCE [31150:12160:3174: 11 DILIGENTLY 121181:19 182:11 DIRECT 1919:2518:7 27:16,20 29: 23 84:13 85:7 111:10 168:14 DIRECTING 14118:15 27:13,17 70: 11 DIRECTION 12186:15141:10 DIRECTLY 12187:10130:5 DIRT 14150:18,23 53:5137:6 DISABILITIES 131175:21,23176: 8 DISABILITY Ill 176:6 DISAGREE 12110:17125:4 DISAPPOINTMENT Ill 168:18 DISCLOSE 12185:3 110:9 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 DISCLOSED In 68:21 DISCLOSING 12117d1 85:6 DISCLOSURE 12116:1317:9 DISCOUNT [21118:4129:10 DISCOUNTED 151117:17120:10 128:4 132:9,19 DISCOURSE 121156:10,11 DISCOVERY I6112:5 22:15 34:3, 6 81:5 101:12 DISCRETIONARY 14155:2,2 77: 15 137:2 DISCUSS 116168:23 85:24 86:10, 22 99:7,10,17 117:7 118:16 120: 21 127:3 139:11 140:15 158:15 164:13,15 DISCUSSES Ill 113:9 DISCUSSING 116186:18 97:9 98: 13 99:20 102:18108:4,8110:18 119:17121:3 125:4 127:20 162:1 163:8,18 164:7 DISCUSSION 111119:25 85:9,15 97:5 102:17 110:4,6 139:14 151:5 162:4,18 DISCUSSIONS I'll 18:1 88:14 89: 12 102:16 119:4,20 138:25 154: 12,16,21 162:16 DISK 1116:7 DISPOSE 12164:17,18 DISPUTE [718:12 65:20,22,24 92: 11,18 136:9 DISPUTED Ill 92:15 DISRUPT 12110:19 11:5 DISRUPTING [3119:11,17,20 DISTINCTLY 141110:10 DISTRIBUTE 111142:7 DISTRICT Ill 1:2 DITCH Ill 131 d 6 DIVERTED Ill 9:24 DIVULGE Ill 28:15 DOCUMENT'S Ill 130:22 DOCUMENTS [25115:2,5 16:5,8, 23 17:2,6 18:2 84:19 92:14107:1, 21 124:18,19 125:2, 6 178:20181: 18,20 182:4,5,9,10,12,13 DOING 115110:12 17:19 19:14 61: 20 63:10 65:17 121:14,16 144:23 156:8,17160:2 162:9165:6174:7 DOLLARS Ill 115:14 DONE 118115:1,4 61:21 95:17 102: 5 149:14156:15 160:8165:7 166: 18 167:2,4,12 169:11 170:9 172:9 174:16 179:6 DOUBT 12149:21 99:15 DOWN (13113:2 77:10 105:18 115: 18 133:9 137:8,11 158:10166:19 167:6,8,10 170:10 DOZENS Ill 168:23 DPO'S Ill 116:10 DRIVE 14123:20 24:6 32:9 98:16 Sheet 4 CONTINUE - DRIVE DRIVER 13130:12,17 90:7 DROOKS (112:12 DUAL [1] 45:15 DUE [71116:6,25 127:20 132:12 150:12 160:3174:11 DULY 1117:7 DUTCHESS (2138:19,20 DUTIES [14141:7,11 44:7,14 46:14 63:4 77:5,25 82:24 84:3,8,10,25 85:16 E EACH [6119:16 24:24 42:11 54:10 84:1 162:3 EARLIER 118130:3 43:10 61:9 71: 17 78:14102:15 122:10 125:9 128:5 158:22174:13 176:14177: 23 178:2 181:2,3,17,23 EARLIEST Ill100:4 EARLY 141139:16 140:2 149:20 151:7 EARLYIMID 121130:9 166:12 EARN [11109:9 EARTLY Ill 157:8 EASILY 11)98:22 EAST 1212:3,15 EASY 131110:12 131:25146:23 EBERSTEIN (31135:22,23,25 ECONOMICS n155:6 EDUCATION (2134:12 79:17 EFFECT Ill 35:8 EFFORT [11132:25 EFFORTS Ill 131:16 EGRESS 121137:12,15 EIGHT -BY -EIGHT Ill m:15 EITHER 119124:23 27:11 54:21 66: 21 100:9103:3106:11 108:1 119: 11 121:20123:23 131:18 132:3 140:7 146:16 158:5 161:3 163:15 165:5 ELDERLY 11164:16 ELECTRONIC 1111'106:4,9,18,25 107:4,11,18 179:9,10,12, 24 ELEVATIONS 11121:22 E-MAIL [17117:15 25:23 26:3.8 27: 21 28:3,7,7,13 101:10 102:4 121: 22 123:21,23 124:6,9,11 E-MAILED Ill123:8 EMPLOYED 16131:7,23 59:13 63: 10 70:24 71:9 EMPLOYEE 16131:1 45:11,18 55: 19,22 139:17 EMPLOYEES 16122:10,19,22 30: 11 72:16,19 EMPLOYER n16:9 EMPLOYING (11118:17 EMPLOYMENT Ill 71:1 ENCINO Ill 1:30 END 19192:19118:18129:14,23 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 158:25 159:14166:10174:16 175: 10 ENDS 111184:1 ENERGIZED [11166:7 ENGAGE Ill 138:25 ENGAGED 141101:15118:5,6,7 ENGAGING 111132:1 ENGINEER 0155:5 ENOUGH 121115:13 148:2 ENTER 13182:3 112:17116:3 ENTERED 14191:14 129:12 130: 19 137:21 ENTERING 11187:14 ENTIRE 16123:22 43:23 45:18 46: 1 58:9 62:25 ENTIRELY (21152:5163:23 ENTITIES 11171 a 0 ENTITLE 15157:1 64:18 80:16105: 5 165:25 ENTITLED 161104:14146:23 151: 2 176:7178:5,25 ENTITLEMENT 19155:7 61:8,9 77: 12 137:16 138:1 145:15146:21 150:8 ENTITLEMENTS 113151:1.4,10 52:3,10,23 53:8,23 55:12 78:10 82:2 97:22137:3 ENTITLING (2154:24 73:15 ENTITY (14131:2239:11,13 59:19 60:24 64:9 76:16,19 77:23 83:20 85:11 122:20 139:9 166:9 ENTRUSTED n1147:3 ENVIRONMENT [31116:9,16117: 15 EQUAL Ill 182:18 EQUITY [10145:1,4,6 59:25 98:23 128:3 129:19,21 165:3,20 ESPECIALLY 121176:4181:16 ESQ [212:14 3:3 ESSENTIALLY [11132:16 ET 1316:13,15,16 EVEN [61128:8,11 131:9153:19 163:25 175:1 EVENT 13111:2 77:24109:25 EVENTUALLY [3166:11 77:24 102:18 EVERYBODY [2]161:14168:22 EVERYTHING PI 88:9169-2,7 EVIDENCE (12] 9:10 11:22 12:5 22:15 34:4,7 37:3,5 81:5 84:8 139: 6 147:18 EXACT [1196:16 EXACTLY 14189:22 98:7110:3 150:9 EXAMINATION 1514:2 7:10132:4 186:13,18 EXAMINED 1117:8 EXCEED 11) 92:9 EXCEPT 12119:6 43:13 EXCHANGE [3194:24 95:2134: 16 EXCLUDE 11111:4 EXCLUSIVE Ill 130:19 EXCLUSIVITY Ell 130:17 EXCUSE [619:2419:10 21:23 24: 1 33:11 143:22 EXECUTE 131108:2 123:16 162: 13 EXECUTED Ill 185:12 EXECUTIVE Ill 144:21 EXHAUSTED M 177:15 EXISTING (17]43:14 47:4 48:21 50:19,20 51:5 62:10,12,18,22,23 65:1 112:16116:15 132:6134:9 163:16 EXISTS Ill 19:18 EXPECT 13198:24 99:1 141:3 EXPERIENCE 13112:1 87:19 174: 15 EXPERIENCED Ell42:5 EXPERT 12128:20 37:8 EXPERTISE Ill i :3 EXPLAIN [2] 30:23 109:21 EXPLAINED [6110:6 12:23 93:6, 14 109:11 120:15 EXPORT [11137:6 EXTEND 151112:15116:9 120:13 127:22 134:10 EXTENDING Ell 133:15 EXTENDS 11198:16 EXTENSION (41132:5 133:2,12 134:11 EXTRACTING Ill 155:16 EYES 11197:2 F FACED n195:15 FACT 19181:15 88:20137:12,15 138:5147:14170:21 176:4180: 21 FACTS 121139:5 147:17 FADING Ill 175:7 FAILED 151122:14 144:18,18 148: 18 158:9 FAILING 121144:19148:25 FAIR 11166:24 FAIRLY [3181:9109:8146:23 FAIT Ill 131:8 FALL 141130:9 135:5 137:20 157:8 FALLS [1151:5 FALSE 13167:12 91:10169:21 FAMILIAR 18113:11 15:12 31:16 42:7 73:2 74:1 90:19,22 FAMILIARITY 11112:21 FAMILIES Ill 42:11 FAMILY [25139:5,11,22 40:12,21 41:13,20 42:1,10,13 43:13 44:16, 23 45:2 46:12,22 50:22,22 51:11 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 52:3 53:24 64:3 66:12 142:16,18 FANTASTIC 12195:14 110:11 FAR 16114:18 30:13 46:6 55:12 108:24174:14 FARGO 110195:6 116:25 117:2,15 118: 14 120:8 122:23 127:19 129: 1 133:7 FASHION 19157:11 FAVOR Ill 145:10 FEAR Ill 139:1 FEASIBLE 13141:17 116:16129:7 FEBRUARY (3)127:20 132:12 166:13 FEE [17184:21 99:11,12,13,17105: 4 109:7,9 110:2 113:9 116:23 136: 9,11,19163:24166:7,12 FEEL 15195:5115:13168:2176: 23 177:13 FEELING 1111io:16 FEES P166:23 109:19 FELL 121151:9159:13 FELT [9192:12,13 95:3 144:15 147: 13 149:12 156:14157:14,25 FEW [8177:19115:13127:23135: 8.10 160:20,22 175:12 FIGURE 121120:7160:15 FIGURED 121132:17145:10 FILE 1911:3217:2,15,16,1618:2 158:9,13 164:22 FILED 18160:24 67:5 116:7117:19 124:16134:24155:11 180:10 FILING 12120:22 22:7 FINAL 6161:22 FINALLY 121159:2 169:16 FINANCE 18135:17 37:17135:20 136:5 151:12 168:3 172:25 173:2 FINANCES Ill 132:4 FINANCIAL 1101140:16,22 141:18, 21 142:6,10,19,23 146:2 147:14 FINANCIER 121119:13122:17 FINANCIERS 121124:5129:24 FINANCING [is) 113:3 119:5,8 122:22129:12 130:2 136:1, 3 138: 3 140:8 159:5 169:4 170:9 FIND 119114:1 54:21,22120:8,17 128:1 129:4 132:25 133:6,10 138: 7 140:8 146:18 149:24, 25 151:12 170:9,11 180:13 FINDING 131116:22138:2159:5 FINE 19148:13 78:16,18 119:13 124:2 177:2,13 180:5,5 FINISH 111149:20,20,21 62:12104: 24 123:3 180:7 181:13,13,14,14 FINISHED 17111:8 62:10 75:8 91: 16 154:6 178:16179:5 FIRM 01130:20 FISHKILL n133:10 FIVE 1191103:11,18104:1 109:3,16, 19 110:6,19111:13 128:21 133:3 Sheet 5 DRIVER - FIVE 149:8 154:19 160:22,23 162:3,23 163:13,19 FIVE-MINUTE 12159:5125:12 FLANNAGAN [5] 21:3,10 22:8 27: 22 28:4 72:9 FLOOR 1312:3,16 21:22 FOCUS 141133:15 138:17 151:15 178:24 FOLLOW [2]9:14182:7 FOLLOWED [2154:25136:8 FOLLOWING [4] 39:3 70:22111: 1,13 FOLLOWS 1117:8 FOODS 15166:15 70:5,7,13,16 FOOLED n1157:6 FOOT Ill 82:10 FORCED Ill 132:3 FORDAR [2182:22 83:25 FORECLOSURE 113117:20 FOREGOING 131185:7186:8,16 FORGOT [11116:13 FORM 12134:4179:13 FORMAL m 51:6 FORMED 12160:4 71:10 FORTH 12154:18 186:10 FORTUNATE Ill115:13 FORTUNATELY [13182:19 FORTY Ill 129:19 FORWARD 193136:6,21 137:1,25 151:3 162:6 165:25 177:14,16 FORWARDED [11183:8 FOUND [41135:21 142:5 167:10, 10 FOUR 1717:23 8:17 56:10129:17 152:22 156:20160:22 FOURTH N 105:14 FOUR -YEAR -OLD (11134:12 FOX [11168:18,22 178:21 179:11 180:10,13,16 181:11 182:7 183:4, 16 FOX'S Ill 181:8 FRAME [9143:8 54:16 91:21 130: 9 145:22 151:3 159:9,10,12 FRAMEWORK Ill 157:18 FRANKLY Ill 149:1 FREE Ill 17:12 FRIEDMAN 121116:12118:6 FRIEND 14167:22 96:10,13130:5 FRIENDS 121136:3142:16 FRONT 19175:4 104:20 110:8 111: 18126:3,7 129:17 178:13 179:2 FULFILL 11189:10 FULL 19138:14 57:10,13 76:7 88: 25 89:4,6,8 94:25 FULL-TIME 15137:20 38:7,16,25 39:4 FULLY 16340:24 129:18165:25 166:1 176:12181:4 FUNCTION Ill 112:8 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995,2449 FUND 121168:20169:22 FUNDS 11019:5 60:17 87:3116:24 117:2 146:25,25,25 165:23 167:7 FUNNY 11148:11 FURTHER Ill 148:20 FUTILE Ill 131:6 FUTURE 11l 54:23 G GAME I1] 129:8 GARDNER Ill 136:14 GAVE 131140:6 145:22180:10 GC 12192:8,13 GENERAL [818:11 12:21 48:18, 19 53:3 109:5 138:19172:6 GENERALLY [6112:25 86:3,7,8 97:20 99:3 GENEVA Ill73a9 GENTLEMAN [11129:2 GEORGE PI 116:12118:6128:13, 15,19,21,23,25 129:11 GESTURE Ill 19:22 GESTURING [2119:11,16 GETTING 18151:8 65:6 113:10 116:10 146:23 151:2 168:10 174: 16 GILFENBAIN'S 13112:7 81:7 82: 23 GIRLFRIEND Ill12:8 GIVE 119110:2 11:20 84:10111:8 115:14119:12 122:24 124:4132: 4,19 144:22 149:9 157:25 163:7 168:23 169:12 GIVEN 15153:5 145:19 148:25 176: 20 182:25 GIVING 14199:5134:2 157:24 168: 11 GLENDALE Ill 163:23 GMAX [1191:19 GMP 12192:12 93:2 GOBBLE 11198:23 GOLF 111337:23 38:2,3,4 96:11 151:18,19 152:1 153:21 154:2, 22 GOT [13166:13,17 67:1 133:13 139', 25 158:12,13 160:10166:19,22,22, 23 170:10 GOTTEN [21132:21 147:4 GRADUATE 13133:12 35:2,9 GRADUATED 11140:1 GRADUATION 11139:3 GREAT 111110:11 GREENSKEEPING Ill38:11 GROSS 11182:8 GROUNDS 12176:18,21 GROUP 17174:11 118:8 129:16 138:24171:2172:7,8 GUARANTEE (1193:21 GUARANTEES 121132:5138:20 GUARANTORS 121132:17,18 GUESS 121152:25 169:14 GUIDELINES 0186:13 GUY 116186:1495:4116:12,13118, 6 129:2 136:1414422145:6,7 146:17147:2 155:24157:9,16 169:15 GUYS 151116:12 132:12,20 133:24 174:4 HABIT 121153:8,9 HACKMAN 161116:13,14118:7 130:6,6,8 HACKMAN'S 111116:13 HALF [2177:17150:3 HALFWAY Ill lo5:18 HAND 14174:22 122:4125:21 149: 5 HANDLED 11125:21 HANDWRITE Ill 126:22 HANDWRITING Ill 126:21 HAPPEN 121133:1 173:22 HAPPENED Ill 162:25 HAPPENING 12112:25139:10 HAPPENS Ill 133:16 HAPPY 121110:17181:15 HARD [4317:14 135:18 146:16,17 HATE 111149:1 HEAD 14113:14 14:7 56:11 167:9 HEADS 111167:6 HEALTH Ill147:9 HEAR 16113:19,2415:18 34:8 92: 25 133:24 HEARD 19110:12 15:15 111:23 112:2 141:25 150:8 151:1 159:15, 17 HEARING 141117:16129:7132:1 183:18 HEARSAY [12186:25 87:20,25 88: 2,4,12,16,22 89:2 95:9133:8,22 HEART [21147:6 157:9 HECK I'1166:21 HE'LL 1219:18 151:12 HELD 1611925 59:8 74:18125:14 156:25182:23 HELL 111118:1 HELP 14155:3 139:23 147:2 157:9 HELPFUL 11162:5 HENRY 1113:3 HEREIN [117:7 HERETO [5175:3 104:19 122:9 125:25 178:11 HIGH 14132:18,21,26 33:2 HIGH -END Ill 161:7 HIGHEST 11165:3 HIGHLY 11149:11 HILLS 12164:2,5 HILLSIDE (1)137:5 HIMSELF [31145:9 169:2,3 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 HIRE 13155:3113:14128:1 HIRED 16132:17113:17,18,21 119: 9 127:25 HIRING (4177:12120:18155:23 165:15 HISTORY 11135:7 HOLDINGS Ill 64:21 HOLLYWOOD 14164:2,4 81:14,16 HOM E 18123:2 24:5 82:1 137:10 143:24144:4,6,7 HOMES 11164:3 HONESTLY 14176:23 77:1 167:13 171:6 HONOR [21135:20136:10 HOPE Ill 9:20 HOPED [11122:12 HOPES Ill imlo HORRIFIC Ill 144:17 HOUR 161152:11 153:1,25177:3 181:6 183:1 HOURS P7152:13,14,15,16,17,24 175:18 HOUSE [31155:3 157:3158:7 HOUSING 11143:14 HOW'S 111145:6 HUGE 121131:11 167:1 HUMILITY P1169:15,16,17 HUNDRED 15151:19,23 52:4 103: 23 168:8 HUNDREDS 15185:21 167:21,22 168:5 171:18 HUNG Ill i :18 HURDLES Ill151:4 HURT 11] 151:1 IDEA 161123:15146:1,4,10148:10 165:22 IDEAS O] 165:21 IDENTIFICATION 15175:2104:18 122:8 125:24 178:10 IDENTIFIED [3154:9114a9171: 17 IDENTIFY 111146:14 IDENTIFYING 121140:22141:17 ILUS Ill 74d 1 IMAGES 11110:18 IMMATERIAL Ill 49:18 IMMEDIATELY Ill 180:18 IMPETUS 111120:18 IMPLICATES (1) 84d 1 IMPLORING Ill 120:11 IMPORTANT 12113:8,13 IMPOSSIBLE 121117:1,3 IMPROPER [1149:11 INABILITY 121176:12,13 INACCURATE 15187:8164:21 172:2 176:21 177:5 INC [611:13,15,27 83:6,7,11 Sheet 6 FIVE - INC INCENSED 111169:6 INCEPTION 14155:18 79:13 83:24 157:24 INCLUDES 11124:12 INCLUDING 121141:24183:22 INCOMPREHENSIBLE M 102: 21 INCONSEQUENTIAL M 136d 7 INCONSISTENT [11164:18 INCORPORATED 13172:5,18.24 INCORRECT 12119:24 90:10 INDEMNIFY P] 95:1 INDEMNITY [4194:25 95:3134:17 20 INDEPENDENT 14130:25 31:10 32:17139:18 INDEX I+] 5:1 INDICATE Ill 182:11 INDICATING Ill 122:25 INDIVIDUAL 12211:3,21 INDIVIDUALLY Ill 143:12 INDIVIDUALS 19167:7 INFERRED Ill 113:9 INFORMATION [22110:23 20:23 27:15,16,18 28:16 34:1,2,11 70: 10 84:13 85:3,6119:7,10,11,12 121:7 138:24139:10 145:3 168: 11 INGRATIATING ill156:1 INITIAL 121127:24129:1 INITIALLY [4155:19 77:9 83:2165 1 INQUIRE 111181:20 INQUIRY Ill 182:12 INSOFAR 13124:11 70:10 83:18 INSTANCE 133154:19 96:2148:23 INSTANTLY [9162:10 INSTITUTE 141114:8,13,16,20 INSTITUTIONAL 14198:23165:23 166:15 170:15 INSTRUCT 1919:12,18 16:15 20:9 56:8 76:21 101:19 104:8 141:25 INSTRUCTING 121101:25124:22 INSTRUCTION 1619:15,1918:18 101:18 104:10125:4 INTENT Ill 122d 5 INTERACTIONS Ill 100a 7 INTERCHANGEABLE I+152:24 INTEREST [12120:5 83:16 94:12, 17121:12,12 151:15 160:4 162: 10 168:24 170:19,21 INTERESTED 14197:24119:8 121:16 163:2 INTERESTING Ill 159:21 INTERFACING 11121:21 INTERNALLY Ill 117:13 INTERNET n121:23 INTERPOSE 12156:8175:5 INTERPRETATION Ill 109:11 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 INTERROGATORIES [1134:4 INTERRUPTED 12119:21 55:13 INTERRUPTING [1I49:7 INTERVIEW Ill 156:18 INTRODUCE [2168:3 96:15 INTRODUCED 14115:21 66:5,21 133:25 INTRODUCTIONS 11198:4 INVEST 17166:7 67:23 69:21 70:6 82:14 87:2 166:16 INVESTED PI 59:15,18 70:13 INVESTING 11179:8 INVESTMENT (1D)44:2 45:9 58:9 64:8 66:11 70:14,14,15 86:24 169: 6 INVESTOR [8] 60:19109:7,8,10, 23 110:5,13 157:18 INVESTOR/AS 01109:10 INVESTORS [4158:7,8 66:14 69: 21 INVESTS Ill 170:15 INVOLVE [2] 106:11,12 INVOLVED 19137:7 48:8 51:9 62: 22.25 69:11,16,18 89:16 INVOLVEMENT 13163:5,15 70:1 INVOLVING [1164:21 IRRELEVANT [2149:14 65:7 IRRESPONSIBLE Ill138:5 ISN'T 14161:20174:16,22 175:2 ISSUE 121116:20 182:2 ISSUES 16161:18 81:5 137:12,25 150:8 151:2 - ITSELF 12184:8130:22 JANUARY 1101143:21 145:17 14! 20,20 166:12 169:3,17170:7,8 173:3 JAY h133:2 JEFFREY B130:12 JEREMY [13120:18 143:6,10,13, 20 148:11 152:8154:13,17,21,25 155:20 156:16 JEREMY'S 1221145:17155:13 JOB 115113:237:21 38:3,7,1739r 18 44:7 45:22,25 63:10 95:14,17, 19 182:20 JOHN 1512:14 6:22 7:17 33:2 54: 16 JOINT 12155:20112:17 JUDGE 12114:14 92:25 JUDGE'S Ill 101:9 JUDGMENT 13166:13 70:16148: 19 JULY Ill 102:10 JUMP 11154:8 JUMPING Ill54:17 JUNE [2194:22181:8 JURISDICTION 11151:7 JURY 11114:14 JV 13145:10 136:8 166:9 JV'S Ill 45:3 K KAIL 1213:10 6:8 KAMBIZ 131119:6 124:1 130:3 KAMDAR 161119:6,14124:1,8 130:3 133:11 KAPLAN'S 12167:24 69:22 KAPLANS 11140:2 KAREN ll112:9 KEEP 14154:16 62:14137:7,10 KEEPING 13140:24 63:8,9 KEPT 181136:11 151:41 168:4,10, 11 ,1 1 169:4170:3 KID 01157:25 KIND 1101148:1 157:22159:21,22, 23160:1 166:14169:17175:21 178:17 KNOWING 131151:3168: 17169: 14 KNOWLEDGE [31148:12168:3 172:19 KNOWN 13123:24 135:24 161:14 KYLE Ill 136:14 L LAP] 54:7 56:11 67:7 LACK Il1139:9 LACKED [11169:16 LACKING [21181:4,5 LAID (2181:20 86:12 LAND 19155:4,5 97:21 112:9 114:8, 13,16,20 135:16 LANDSCAPE 1n 137:7 LANGUAGE [2] 133:3 134:21 LAPTOP [7125:1,3,5,6,15 26:18 29:17 LARGE 14158:5 59:16 64:17137:6 LAST [23115:1,4 29:7 64:23 66:11 70:14 93:9 95:21 109:2 118:8 124: 11 126:67129:3131:16138:14 144:10 152:9 154:24 155:8 175: 18 176:21 178:24 LAST-DITCH ill 132:24 LATE 19126:7 95:22 116:9 135:15 140:2 169:17 170.6,6,8 LATENESS n1183:1 LATER 14122:17 80:24 115:18 133:13 LAW 1216:12 88.5 LAWSUIT 14167:5 68:9155:11 158:14 LAYING (1)157d 7 LEAD 1l219:1 o 11'.21 12:4 22'.14 34:3,6,10 37:3,4,5 79:9 81:4 LEARN Ill 173:15 LEARNED I2142:5 157:7 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 LEASED 12140:24 63:9 LEAST 17) 80:25 127:25129:19 134:9150:2 156:18 182:1 LEAVE 15110:1,1,3,20176:25 LED Ill 113:1 LEE [13158:16 63:24 64:8,16,17,18 65:13 66:4,4,7,12,17 70:20 LEE'S 11166:12 LEFT 14113:1 93:18129:3 130:16 LEGAL 15153:13,14 66:23 84:11 137:15 LENDER 1171116:6,15,17117:6 120:17 121:8,8,10 122:16 129:16, 21 131:24132:4167:10,11 174:9 175:1 LENDERS 131130:4,5,7 LENGTH Ill 181:7 LENT Ill 144:19 LEONARD 151127,30 2:6 6:9 186: 6 LESS [6153:21 152:14,16153:1, 25 154:19 LESSONS 111157:8 LETTER 12157:16182:7 LETTERS 1010:6 LEVINE 1213:9 19:13 LEWIS [1019:4 42:8,10 66:3,5,5,12, 15,21 70:20 LIABILITY 1211:6,18 LICENSE 13137:14 48:19 186:24 LICENSED ill 186:7 LICENSES n136:8 LIE PI 171:21,25 172:1 LIENS 12] 93:24 94:3 LIES Ill 171:18 LIFE [11147:4 LIGHT 141118:2 148:25 176:4 181: 16 LIKELIHOOD 121110:9155:16 LIKELY 11319:1011:21 17:14,17 34:10 36:20 37:3 44:19 73:8 91: 20 110:15 116:25127:6 LIKES [1I 172:8 LIMITATIONS Ill 177:6 LIMITED 1311:6,18 50:19 LINCENBERG 1112:13 LINE 18111:21 34:1 91:15118:13 120:2 122:21 149:14 181:15 LIQUIDATION 11177:24 LIST 16198:2,6,7,8,17100:11 LISTED Ill 22:7 LISTEN 121176:25 179:19 LITIGATION 12192:49124:16 LITTLE 121133:13169:18 LIVE Ill i50:1 LIVING 151144:9 145:17 146:8,11 147:12 LLC 12411:5,17 4:7,9,11 31:22,23 32:7 64:7 75:24 76:5,7,10,13,16, Sheet? INCENSED-LLC 17 78:1 82:18,19,22 104:14 111: 23112:2,5 LOANED Ill9:5 LOAN'S Ill 132:12 LOANS Ill 115:12 LOBSTER 11169:16 LOCATE 11141:15 LOCATED 1516:9 33:24 34:16 42: 22,24 LODGE 111161:3 LOI 121133:2136:7 LONG 112138:12 39:22 109:2 138: 14 144:10 148:4,25 152:9 155:8 174:6 178:17 181:21 LONGER 13143:10 131:15 169:5 LOOK [20)15:2,516:8 63:18 88:6 104:23 105:18 111:20 123:2 124: 17132:7139:2 150:13 159:18 160:3163:21 167:6 180:24 181: 10182:4 LOOKED 18116:5,22 100:20 124: 15159:21 181:18 182:3,9 LOOKING 114179:8 101:13 116:7, 14 117:17 136:4 138:22 139:4 147:2 168:23 169:4,14,24174:21 LOOKS [31106:5 126:21 162:12 LOS 11711:2 2:4,8,17 3:6 6:1,10,13 11:16 23:5 39:9 41:4 47:22 58:6 80:17 185:3 186:3 LOSE 131145:19 147:1 148:16 LOSING [11146:24 LOST Ill 183:20 LOT 18157:3 64:20 69:18 88:15,20 116:10 137:5 163:15 LOTS 141132:18137:13,14,15 LOWER [I1117:5 LUNCH 19178:20 182:2,2 M M&M 122157:13,14,19,25 58:2,3,8, 19,23 59:2,12,13,15 60:19 62:11, 16 63:21 64:13 65:17 70:23 71:1 79:13 MACHINE 12113:8,13 MAD 111147:4 MADAM 121147:21 148:1 MAINTAIN 15117:6 24:19 25:15 28:12 183:6 MAINTAINED 13123:10 30:4 63:9 MAINTAINING 11128:23 MAJORITY 12193:20 107:24 MAN 16157:3 64:16 148:25 149:11 167:1 172:12 MANAGEMENT 115139:19 40:17, 21 41:25 44:10,15,22 46:10 56:2 62:23 63:1,5,8,14 90:2 MANAGER 110163:10 73:11,12 74: 7 89:19,21,22 90:9,11,16 MANAGERS 11174:8 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 MANAGING 12165:5 89:16 MANNER 121115:9182:1 MANY [2517:22 42:5 47:9 48:7 51: 13 52:9 53:7,22 54:3 56:3 94:1.3 102:19103:5127:11 150:24151: 13 154:16 160:21,22 163:21,22 167:2,15,19 MAR 12154:6 56:12 MARCH Ill 128:17 MARELLA (212:12 6:13 MARK 16174:15,20 104:13 122:3 125:18 178:4 MARKED (614:5 75:2 104:18 122: 8 125:24178:10 MARKET [n 60:18 116:11 118:12 120:9 129:7 131:25 159:20 MARKETING 13121:22,24 40:25 MARKETPLACE 121131:5168: 14 MARKETS [11120:16 MARRIED 12121:3,6 MATERIAL [1121:23 MATH Ill 87:5 MATRIX 121122:21 160:14 MATTER 1518:11 28:20 37:6136: 10,15 MATTERS [21101:2,16 MEADOW 1111:29 MEAN 123130:24,24,25 31:1 49:1 50:16 51:4 52:23 53:2,4 64:24 70: 18 92:6 93:5 95:13115:20128:11 145:1 149:11 159:25 162:9163: 14166:21 MEANS 16114:12 49:5,24 50:10 52:13 61:20 MEANT 14114:7 53d 1 93:8 112: 23 MECHANIC'S [2193:24 94:3 MECHANICS [2196:16 160:14 MEDICAL 141175:20,23177:10,12 MEDICATIONS Ill 175a 4 MEET [6179:3 96:4,7 170:23180:6. 8 MEETING [13]96:24131:2152:9 153:24 157:2,22 158:6,17,20 159: 3 170:25 171:4,7 MEETINGS [31151:17154:13,17 MEETS I1198:15 MELROSE 131139:21 151:11 159: 3 MEMBER [15]37:11 76:10,15,16, 19,20,25 82:19,25 83:1,1 114:8, 12, 16,19 MEMBERS [3176:2,13 82:21 MEMBERSHIP 11176:17 MEMORY 16118:13 54:17,20 58: 12 99:6 182:20 MENTIONED 15124:5 29:18 66:3 121:19 169:23 MENTIONING 121121:17,20 MESSAGE Ill 102:6 MEZZ 121165:20 167:11 MICHAEL 131116:14 118:7 130:6 MID P758:11,12128:17149:20 169:3,17 173:3 MID -THIRTIES 111117:25 MIGHT 17188:6 117:14 129:20 140 2 145:24 163:22,24 MIKE (11105:9 MILE Ill 150:1 MILLION [71117:25131:23,24 132:2 134:10,13 145:14 MIND [21147:24171:24 MINE 18149:20,21 96:10105:25 126:15 153:8 179:10182:20 MINIMUM [11137:11 MINUTE 111122:24 MINUTES 110193:14 109:3 144:11 149:9 153:25 155:9 156:20 176: 21 177:1,2 MIRAGE [1182:22 MISERABLY 121148:18158:9 MISPLACED Ill 183:20 MISREPRESENT [11172:4 MISREPRESENTATION (51167: 23 168:13171:22,25 172:3 MISREPRESENTATIONS 19181: 1, 314 4:13 149:3 156:15 158:10 167:16,19 171:20 MISREPRESENTED 121147:3 149:13 MISREPRESENTS Ill 115:21 MISS 123118:1,20 19:8 20:1,4,25 21:9.9 22:2,8,8 27:7 28:4,4,12,25 29:5,10,19 30:7 72:9,9 90:1 MISSTATES [6]19:2 32:12,13 122:15147:16161:11 MISTAKE (1)167:1 MOMENT 16154:8 75:7104:23 106:15 166:25178:15 MONDAY 1311:26 2:5 6:1 MONICA Ill65:13 MONTH 141145:23,24 166:6 169: 18 MONTHS 19143:10,10 77:11 133:3, 4 149:14 155i 1 157:3 158:7 MORNING is] 7:1483:8175:8 181:21,23 MOST 1417:24 8:18 48:16 73:7 MOUTH 11188:4 MOVE [4) 52:6 103:20 104:4 151:3 MOVED 14142:16 57:4 162:6 172: 11 MOVING 13177:14,23 169:7 MUCH 112122:5 58:4 89:13110:13 111:15 117:22 137:17 140:10 157: 24 162:12165:1 169:5 MULHOLLAND Ill 98:16 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 Sheet 8 MULTI Ill 43:14 MULTI-FAMI LY [6143:14 47:5,10, 16,21 164:3 MULTIFAMILY 11150:20 MULTI -PAGE PI 122:3 125:18 178:5 MULTITUDE 121174:15,25 MUST 19118:13 78:7118:18 MYSELF [8145:9 70:20 71:8 82: 13 90:15133:11 138:13 149:2 N NAME 12516:8,9 7:15,17 12:9 15: 25 21:4 38:4 39:13 60:25 64:5 70: 2 76:7 80:18 82:17 116:13 121:17, 23 129:3 136:14 164:22 169:23 170:3,3 186:19 NAMED 16142:8 116:12,13 118:6 129:2 136:14 NAMES 12173:25 168:23 NATIONAL Ill54:5 NATURE 18110:25 55:2,2 65:24 115:17,19 137:2 157:21 NAUSEAM (1)144:24 NEBRASKA 11154:7 NECESSARILY Ill 93:22 NECESSARY 13187:3185:10,11 NEED 111315:9 55:1 61:8,17 90:8 136:12 140:11 156:22 157:25,25 168:6 NEEDED 17798:9115:12 129:19 131:4,11 145:9 157:10 NEEDS 13161:22 100:10 145:2 NEGOTIATE Ill 99:13 NEGOTIATED 11199:12 NEITHER 121112:12177:25 NESSIM (112:12 NET ill 82:9 NEWS Ill 166:24 NEXT 11038:18 38:16 73:8 77:11 111:12 115:23,25 126:17 156:17 180:25 NOAH 121129:2,3 NOAH'S Ill 129:2 NOBODY 121149:11 177:16 NOD 121116:7117:19 NODS Ill 13:14 NOISES Ill 105:11 NON Ill 109:7 NONE 12192:16 175:24 NONPARTIES I119:25 NONSENSE Ill 10:22 NOR 121112:12178:1 NORTH 11198:16 NORTHWEST Ill 1:2 NOTES 19119:16110:22,24 153:4, 6,10,15 158:17,19 NOTHING 16112:3,3 139:10 148: 20 168:12177:4 LLC - NOTHING NOTICE 1212:9 186:9 NOTICED 11110o:19 NOTIFY Ill 183:13 NOVEMBER [41132:11,22135:15 140:2 NUANCES 12144:19 46:18 NUMBER 115146:23,25 64:19 65: 14 66:8 92:8129:15131:9 134:1, 2,3 166:11 176:9,10 186:24 NUMBERS Ill 172:8 NUMEROUS Ill 157d 3 0 OATH 15111:2414:10 78:24185:7 186:11 OBJECT 19127:24 49:6 53:12 73: 8 76:18,20 152:21 176:2,10 OBJECTED Ill 66:22 OBJECTING Ill 176:10 OBJECTIONS 17153:13 56:8101: 5 147:24148:3 186:13,17 OBJECTIVE I,I 113:10 OBLIGATION 11195:3 OBSERVATION 01181:23 OBSERVE 121158:19181:24 OBSERVED 14128:25 29:5,10 181:3 OBTAIN 111133:21 OBTAINED 11161:4 OBTAINING M 113:3,19119:4 129:11 135:7,25 136:2 OCCASIONS 12152:4159:2 OCCUPANCY Ill 132:7 OCCUPIED 12195:16117:4 OCCURRING Ill 139:8 OCTOBER 171132:22159:14,24 160:24 161:21 162:22 164:8 OCTOBER/EARLY Ill135:15 OCTOBER/NOVEMBER Ill138: 9 ODDS Ill 109:13 OFFER 110111:20 61:5117:24 138, 20 159:14160:11,13 161:6 163:3, 4 OFFERED 121140:5,18 OFFERING 1116o:18 OFFERS 18163:18,19 132:15 160: 7,19,25 161:20164:12 OFFICE [22123:1,2,7,10,13 24:4,5, 23,24 30:4,8,10,14 32:9,16 40:5 46:9 106:4,7,8,8,18 OFFICER 1113140:17,22 141:18, 21 142:6,10,20,23 146:2 147:14 180:16 OFFICERS 111127:21 OFFICES Ill6:13 OFFICIAL 12190:8 93:18 OFFICIALLY Ill 22:7 OGDEN Ill 24:5 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 61 UGULNICK'S [2118:20183:3 OLD 13150:19 159:161642 OLDER Ill 65:6 ONCE [7155:25 133:13 139:2145; 5 149:8 151:19 160:15 ONE -PAGE 11174:21 ONE-THIRD 11184:1 ONES Ill 168:8 ONGOING 111135:14 ONLY 117113:8 15:22 19:12 27:14 28:15,15 66:19 69:2 78:9 96:10 132:2 133:12,14 135:7 136:5 144: 18 146:24 ONSITE 12163:10 89:14 0001316:3 184:4,12 OPERABLE Ill 91:24 OPERATOR Ill 6:8 OPINION [3184:10156:1 177,10 OPPORTUNITIES (1141:1 OPPORTUNITY Ill 147:1 OPPOSED 11170:11 OPPOSITE [2195:11,13 OPTION 121120:14133:12 OPTIONS Ill 140:3 ORANGE 14147:16 73:15,18,21 ORDER PI 118:3 162:24172:12 ORDERS 13192:15,16,18 ORDINANCE 141137:4,5,5,19 ORGANIZATIONAL 1414:6 74:22 75:12,16 ORIGINAL 15150:4 92:12 183:7, 17,19 ORIGINALLY Ill73:18 OTHERS 13134:14 81:2 117:7 OTHERWISE [21125:3183:20 OUTLAST Ill 129:9 OUTLINED [1184:23 OUTSIDE [417:16 33:5,7 47:21 OVER 116110:912:24 90:5,14 91:6 92:11,18,20,21,24100:2118:15 119:25 132:14 136:9 150:6 OVERAGES 11193:20 OVERCONFIDENT Ill 15525 OVERLAPPED Ill 118:22 OVERSAW [118s:2o OVERSELLING 111156:4 OVERSIGHT 11190:2 OVERSOLD 11l 157d 9 OWED (3)117:6,25136:9 OWN 111127:3 30:17 53:19 60,16, 17,22 98:11 167:12169:11 170: 10 171:24 OWNED [5129:11 39:16 93:12 159:21 163:2 OWNER (6131:13 44:5 59:4 61:2, 2 92:12 OWNER'S Ill 89:21 OWNERSHIP [12120:5 31:22 75, 18 83:16 87:10 92:15,17 93:3,5,8 94:6,7 OWNS Ill 29:16 P P.M 113159:9 74:17,19 78:19,21 125:13,15 156:24157:1 182:22, 24 183:25 184:9 PACKAGE 111124:3 PAGE [2314:2,512:24105:15,15, 15,18 106:1 111:16,18,21 112:11, 11,12 113:8 126:6, 7, 913 0:15 178: 24179:2,4,8 PAGE/LINE 1115:5 PAID 12199:8136:12 PALM 122123:10,13,17,22,2524:2 30:5 31:17,20,21 32:9 80:25 82:8 88:15 89:25 90:3,12,13,20 91:2 94:7 118:25 PALMS 12140:9 54:5 PAPER 14317:14105:8 153:15 164:10 PARCEL [11137:11 PARDON 16111:3 27:11 59:22 65: 10 142:12181:3 PARENTS Ill 150:1 PARK 1212:3,15 PARKING [2188:15,19 PART 1916:24 42:10 45:10 48:16 56:2125:1 134:10158:11 166:9 PARTICIPANT 12145:4,6 PARTICULAR M39:11 51:652: 25 53:1,3,8,23 PARTIES 1538:21 9:2 93:12,13 149:5 PARTNER 15131:2 55:20 123:23 170:11,15 PARTNERS 161117:14121:22,25 123:18 129:19 131:16 PARTNERSHIP [7180:24 84:20, 22 86:12,24 93:19 128:2 PARTY [418:3,715:12 67:14 PASSAGE 111137:3 PASSED 121128:21 151:14 PASSING 12119:16145:5 PAST Ill 12:1 PATH Ill 78:9 PATIO 111154:9 PAUL 12143:18,19 PAY 18166:18,23 68:14 93:1,16 122:23 136:19 139:22 PAYING 11393:19 PAYMENT Ill116:7 PAYOFF 141120:10 128:4 132:9, 19 PAYOFFS Ill 117:18 PAYROLL I11139:17 PEN 111153:15 PENALTY [21183:11 185:6 PENDING Ill 101:13 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 PEOPLE 17119:18 106:7122:14 130:1 140:11 157:21 168:15 PER 11193:19 PERCEIVED Ill 117:5 PERCENT 112183:24,25,25 87:2 94:12,19 95:2,16 110:15 117:4 140:6 166:3 PERCENTAGE [3187:10 94:7,16 PERCEPTION [41155:13,13,21 156:3 PERCEPTIONS Ill 157:4 PERFORMANCE 12195:24 96:3 PERHAPS [6181:2 120:6,9152:22 165:7 177:13 PERIOD [21151:9 164:23 PERJURY 121183:12185:6 PERSISTS Ill 19:13 PERSON [14113:1 17:21 21:4 42: 7 69:2 97:13 100:10 102:13119: 23 128:20 132:25147:5 168:7 173:13 PERSONAL 13165:6 70:10 93:20 PERSONALLY 120117:4 51:9 59: 18 60:2,12,13 61:1,17,25 62:19 67:1 69:24 76:20 77:2,4 78:7 82: 25 83:19 91:17134:14 PHONE 117197:12.14100:9,21,21 101:15102:13 109:16, 20 110:7, 19 111:14 119:25120:4,5,6 173:9 PHRASE 13115:6 52:17,21 PHRASED PI 20:10 141:23 142:1 PHRASES I1113:15 PHYSICAL 141175:6176:5177:6, 16 PIECE 13158:9 64:14 PIECES 12117:14 50:18 PILING Ill lo3:19 PLACE 11811:29 26:24 37:4 58:12 97:11 102:11 108:19128:6132: 16138:10 143:23144:5,8 151:8 152:2 155:2 173:4 186:10 PLACED 15160:16 77:9 93:24 94: 4 179:24 PLAINTIFF [316:19,23 9:5 PLAINTIFFS 1311:8 2:2,11 PLANNER Ill 55:5 PLANS Ill 21:22 PLAY [7154:23 61:11 96:11 132: 23 137:16 146:21 165:23 PLAYED 121132:15 148:13 PLAYING n1129:8 PLAYS 12164:19,24 PLEASE 11316:20,20 7:3 11:20 26: 24 30:23 33:25 102:3 147:20,25 174:17 181:11,12 PLEASED 11166:20 PLOT Ill 51:6 PLUS Ill 129:19 POINT 116163:17 64:18 65:16 90: Sheet 9 NOTICE - POINT 23 94:6 98:8,8,15 100:16 124:24 129:20 131:21 135:17163:25 165: 2 167:3 POLISHED [1] 157:20 PORTFOLIO Ill40:23 POSITION [14110:18 18:20 38:9 43:12 44:2 58:2,5 71:24 73:5,10 74:4,6 95:5 128:4 POSITIONS [1122:3 POSSIBLE 19122:5 28:2 62:11 118:2 131:14141:23149:20 166: 14182:15 POSSIBLY Ill128:2 POST [11132:1 POTENTIAL 16198:2,18 100:11 124:4 157:18 164:3 POTENTIALLY Ill 180:20 POWERS Ill86a6 PRACTICE 13188:5107:21 126: 22 PRE-2010 11124d2 PRECIPICE Ill 146:24 PRECISE I3121:2 45:7 123:7 PRECISELY m 109:13 PREDECESSOR [1110:7 PRE -LAW [1135:7 PRELIMINARY m 77:11 PREMISE Ill164:18 PREMISES [1111:3 PREPARATION Ell 141:13 PREPARE PI 14:23 140:21 141: 17 PREPARED Ill 141:2 PRESENT (1113:7 88:25 89:4 97: 14 117:22 143:10,25 145:2 146:7 152:4 155:4 PRESENTED Ell'146:15 PRESENTING [21117:24182:9 PRETTY 111111:15 PREVENT [11177:7 PREVIOUS 14119:2 81:11 85:19 132:1 PREVIOUSLY 15154:15 81:20 90: 6 93:7146:4 PRICE Ill 147:9 PRINCIPAL 17I15:23 45:9 55:20, 23 56:4 58:8,15 PRINCIPALS 14115:22,23 129:4 136:4 PRINTED (11147:13 PRIOR 12417:16 8:16 21:17 25:16 52:15 67:16 87:14 93:4 99:20 103: 6 107:17,21 108:5 111:22,24112: 1 121:25 127:4 130:12 147:17 164:19 179:23 180:24 182:2 PRIVACY (13120:8 56:7 59:21,22 70:9 71:15 73:6 76:19,21 83:18 87:4 101:25 176:10 PRIVATE [3110:10 101:2 176:1 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 PRIVILEGE 131101:24 124:25 125 3 PRIVILEGED Ill179:16 PRO [21144:16 150:4 PROACTIVE Ill 160d 6 PROBABLY 112312:23 37:23 52: 24 54:17 55:17107:20,25 117:5 121:9132:21,22 133:3 PROBLEM 131101:8 131:19 134:5 PROBLEMS [1114:17 PROCEED Ill 78:9 PROCEEDING P17:16,1910:10 11:1,19 12:2 117:20 PROCEEDINGS m 184:1 PROCESS 14112:2213:11 77:15 166:1 PROCUREMENT n1105:4 PRODUCE 15166:6 69:19 125:5 179:11 180:18 PRODUCED 191119:9124:18,19 125:2 138:6 148:12 180:11,17 182:13 PRODUCT [11145:3 PROFESSIONAL 12136:7 37:12 PROJECT'S Ill 95:16 PROJECTS 112145:2,7 47:11,16, 21 48:2,7,17,20 50:22 79:22 163: 15 PROMISING 0i113:2 PROOF Ill 11:20 PROPENSITY Ill 162:8 PROPER I,188:3 PROPERLY 12166:19 92:14 PROPERTIES 14140:23,24,25 62: 23 PROPOSE I21165:8,9 PROPOSED 131165:11 166:2,8 PROPRIETOR 11171:9 PROSPECTUS Ill 161:5 PROTECT Ill 162:10 PROTECTED 111101:24 PROTOCOL 12149:19181.12 PROVIDE 110114:20 24:7 86:23 90:2 99:11 138:23 176:6,18177:7, 11 PROVIDED 1318:19 41:18 98:2 PROVIDING n1157:17 PROVISION 111130:16 PUBLIC 11)12:2 PURCHASE 11197:21 PURCHASED 11182:15 PURDUE (2156:11,12 PURELY 111133:15 PURPORTS [31178:22180:15,22 PURPOSE 111113:19 PURPOSES Ill 183:22 PURSUANT 1212:9186:9 PURSUE 13171:10 97:22139:25 PURSUING 11146:23 13194:25 134:17140:4 Q QUASI -PUBLIC m 11:1 QUESTIONING 13111:21 34:1 138:17 QUESTIONS [1415:4 14:18 19:20 77:19 101:13 103:2 173:25175: 13 176:12,16,24 181:5,25 185:8 QUICKLY [31131:13 157:11 182: 15 QUITE 12195:11,12 QUOTE 12149:25,25 R RACHEL [23117:23,24 21:3 27.22, 22 28:24 29:17 124:18,19 125:2,5, 7144:1 145:8 146:5 148:11 155:5 156:10,11,12,16 157:4 158:5 RACHEL'S [21150:1 155:13 RAISE 161112:8 116:20 166:19,19, 20 172:13 RAISED [41146:10 164:14 165:12 182:1 RAISING 131165:2, 14,16 RANCHO I1]82:22 RATHER [1)173:23 REACHING Ill 113.10 READ 19118:11 50:6 52:16,18,20 147:23 148:7 179:4 185:9 READING 131100:22112:24167: 17 READY [21123:16 174:22 REALIZE [31118:11 133:11 146: 20 REALIZED 171115:17117:18 118: 1,11 133:1 166:13,25 REALLY 151132:11 145:10149:16 160:2,13 REASON 1611420107:10109:12 126:25177:18 183:19 REASONABLY [719:912:4 22:14 34:3,6,10 81:4 REASONS (2149:10166:11 RECALLS Ell 154-4 RECEIPT Ill 183:10 RECEIVE 14127:21 28:3 41:24 129:10 RECEIVED 19J 27:15,16,1828:16 70:15 84:13 85:3,6 163:19 RECEIVING 123111:22112.1 RECENT 1217:24 8:18 RECESS 16159:8 74:18 78.20 125: 14156:25182:23 RECESSION 111166:15 RECOGNIZE 141105:1,22 123:5 126:12 RECOLLECT 13199:23119:6 127: 18 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 RECOLLECTION [17118:13 45: 21 54:21 56:25 62:10.13 92:16 96: 10 109:12 116:22121:10 127:9, 16 139:7,16 162:24 182:1 RECOMMENDATION 11141:16 RECORDED Ell 186:14 RECOURSE Ill 95:4 RECOVER [1)9:5 REDUCE 0l 94:6 REDUCED (2194:20,23 RE -ENTITLED m 64:2 REFER 16115:6 16:2 60:9 75:23, 23 145:9 REFERENCE N 121:23 REFERENCED Ill 168:19 REFERRED 111175:4 REFERRING 116115:8 16:3 21:19 58:15 60:10 68:16 82:12 90:24 100:17103:1 120:5,6162:15 164: 24,25 175:4 REFLECTS t1181:9 REFRESH 11118:12 REFUSED Ill 135:17 REFUSING 1n93:10 REGARDING 13198:24 99:1 109: 6 REGARDS 11154:9 REGISTER Ill 110:2 REGISTERED 181109:7,7, 10,10, 22,23 110:1,5 REGRESS (1)165:15 REJECTED 131159:6,7166:11 RELATED 15160:13 61:18 64:11 124:25 134:18 RELATES 112144:15 56:4 62:19 75:17 83:19,19 84:4 85:17,25 86: 4163:19 174:14 RELATION 111137:11 RELATIONSHIP 111155:17 56:4 66:25 69:6 130:19 141:9 147:10 149:2 168:2 171:3 172:12 RELATIONSHIPS [11168:3 RELAYING 12128:16 84:12 RELEASE [2]95:1 149:18 RELEASED Ill149a5 RELEVANT [1019:10 11:22,25 33: 25 34:10,14 37:3,7 38:3 176:2 RELIED Ill156:14 RELIEVED I11183:5 RELUCTANT Ill140:9 RELY 151107:25 120:13 121:2 138: 5 149:3 RELYING 141133:6,20168:15172: 10 REMAINS Ell 101:18 REMEMBER [24166:21 70:2 96: 16,17 98:7 110:16 120:12 129:2 130:7 131:10 133:25 1342147:5 149:19 150:9 153:14,22 154:10, Sheet 10 POINT - REMEMBER 10164:1,5 167:13 171:7 172:17 RENEGOTIATE [1] 112:15 RENT [1] 139:22 RENTS [1] 132:8 REPORT 121180:14,25 RE -SET Ill 169:17 REP O] 89:21 REPAY Ill 140:5 REPEAT 18113:20,21 18:9,10 50:5 52:14 111:2414721 REPHRASE Ill15:9 REPHRASED 11183:20 REPLACED [5125:7,8,11,14,16 REPORT 13140:11,11 125:10 REPORTED 1511:29131:2,15174, 4,5 REPORTER [2212:7 7:313:2,7,12, 20 55:16 74:14,22 75:2 104:12,18 122:2,8 125:17,24 147:22 148:1 178:4,10 183:5 186:7 REPORTERS In 1:28 REPORTING 121139:8141:24 REPORTS 19166:19 REPRESENT 1617:1710:511:1 114:15 141:11 178:19 REPRESENTATION 13]81:20 112:14 169:21 REPRESENTATIONS 19111:25 22:16 149:16167:2168:15172: 10,11 181:18,21 REPRESENTATIVES n1112:13 REPRESENTED 15134:13,14 97: 23,25 115:8 REPRESENTING Ill io1:16 REQUEST 17110:3 53:13,17103: 19140:21 141:7175:9 REQUESTED 121140:25 182:4 REQUESTS 1415:3178:6,23180: 9 REQUIRE 121110:14111:8 REQUIRED 16184:2 89:10 97:20 125:6 129:16 134:12 REQUIRES 12184:10111:5 REREAD 121148:2,4 RESOLUTION 131127:21,22,24 RESORTS I11161:7 RESPECTED 11193:21 RESPOND 16172:13,14 123:23 124:6,8 181:5 RESPONDED [31123:25 124:1 180:9 RESPONSE 13152:19 103:18180: 18 RESPONSES 1415:2 178:6,22 181:19 RESPONSIBILITIES 116131:19 41:7,12 44:15 54:10,14 55:10,22 62:19 63:5 64:11,12 77:5 78:1 84: 4.25 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 616. RESPONSIBILITY Ill 183:6 RESPONSIBLE 13128:23 44:9 95: 4 RESTATE 131142:2147:20,25 RESULT 12168:9117:20 RESULTS 12151:7144;17 RETAIL Ill 122:19 RETAIN [3125:14183:16,16 RETAINER Ill 102:18 RETAINING 131117:8119d8,21 RETELLING 111173:10 RETURN 13166:9 141:7 183:12 RETURNS Ill66:10 REVEAL 119118:1434:1 100:24, 25 101:2,22,23 106:20,21 107:6, 14 111:5,6 113:6 117:10,11 124: 21 135:1,2 REVEALED [11115:11 REVEALING 16118:7 27:11 29:14, 23,25 179:15 REVEALS n170:10 REVELATION Ill 16d 6 REVIEW 113175:7107:19,21 123:2 130:12178:15,18 179:17,23 180: 1 181:17182:14183:10 REVIEWED 13110:7 104:25 182: 14 REVIEWING 111101:5 RICO Ill 144:21 RIDGE Ill 1:29 RIDGES [2] 137:7,9 RIDICULOUS Ill157:20 RIGHTS 16151:8 56:1 59:21 84:1 101:25 162:11 RIPPED 121149:11,12 RISK 15155:7137:18138:1 145:15 177:14 RISKY Ill 146:20 RIVERSIDE 11182:8 ROAD 14156:7115:18 133:10 174: 6 ROBERT I413:3 7:1 30:11,16 ROBIN 1311:30 2:6 186:6 ROCHESTER 119158:6 60-8,9,14 61:9,19 62:20 63:15 64:12 65:4 ROCKPOINT 1111135:19,21 136:4, 13,16,21,25 137:24 138:19 168:9 174:22 ROCKWELL 121170:20171:12 ROCKWOOD 1201170:1,14,14,18, 23 171:5,9,11,12,15,17 172.4116, 17,21,24 173:1,11,13 174:5 ROLE 14186:10 148:13 165:7,14 ROLES (2146:10 148:22 ROOM [12110:1,2,3,2013:319:24 144:9145:17146:8,11 147:12 172:13 ROUGHLY 13143:6,11 119:22 ROYAL [22] 97:10,19 98:10,14,14 99:21 100:7,18 102:8 105:5 113:3 114:24 115:3,24 118:21 135:14 139:24 144:18 151:9 159:12 174: 14,19 ROYALTON 11198:16 RULES 111148:6 RUMBLINGS 1V 151:1 RUN I7186:13 117:15 129:23150: 10 151:1,6,23 RYAN 11011:20,25 2:1 4:3 7:6 76: 15 78:6 165:17 185:19 186:8 RYANQa VINEYARDSDC.COM RYANOGULNICK@a HOTMAIL 125:25 .S SALES 113144:22 SALESMAN PI 155:22156:2,4 SALESMEN 11] 155:24 SANCTIONS 11110:3 SANTA 14165:13 77:16 78:11 146: 22 SATISFY 11189:11 SAVE 131169:6,7 SAW 15129:17 98:7,8 124:11 180: 24 SAYING 16110:13119:13 146:11 157:4170:4 182:6 SAYS [51112:12 130:16 155:24 166:22 175:1 SCHEDULE 13191:19,21 92:9 SCHOOL 14132:18,22,25 33:2 SCHOOLS Ill 36:3 SCHOTTENSTEIN I413:8 19:10, 13 28:5 SCREAMER Ill 120:12 SCREAMING Ill 120:13 SEAFOOD 13166:6 67:24 69:12 SEAFOODS Ill 69:19 SEAN'S Ill 144:13 SEARCH 111181:20 SEARCHED 19182:11 SECOND 15150:7 74:16111:16 112:11 182:21 SECRETARY Ill 20:23 SEE 124175:13 76:3 105:16,20 115: 14,15 117:22 118:8 121:15 126:9, 10, 17,18127:23 128:1 131:17 145:11 157:20 159:23160:1 162: 11 163:7169:19177:18 SEEING Ill133as SEEKING 1219:5 113:11 SEEKS Ill 137:7 SEEM Ill 12:21 SEEMED 14146:10 116:18159:18 181:24 SEEMING Ill 162:10 SEEMS 111177:13 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 SEEN 110175:10123:6 150:2,24 156:12 180:2,3,12,15,19 SELF-EVIDENT Ill 34:5 SELL (2157:1 63:18 SELLER Ill 16o:5 SELLERS [I1135:16 SELLING Ill157:17 SEND [21160:16 164:12 SENDING 131119:10121:14,24 SENIOR (11112:16 SENSE 17155:7 71:8,9 93:1 98:5 140:18 159:18 SENT [10127:23 28:4 60:18 121:7, 21 123:17, 21 151:12,13 165:1 SENTENCE 151111:20112:12,19, 23,24 SEPARATE 1612424 52:4143:7, 12 162:4168:8 SEPTEMBER 151117:19127:1,5 130:10 135:8 SEQUENCE Ill 162:25 SERIOUS I21101:8 160:3 SERIOUSLY Ill 160:6 SERVED 121178:20,21 SERVER 14126:16 28:13,19,23 SERVICES [2184:21 86:23 SESSION [11180:25 SET 1615:3 7:13 78:13 97:2 178:8 186:10 SETTLE Ill 93:2 SEVEN [218:20126:2 SEVERAL 17158:8 73:25 77:11 120:6 135:24159:2 182:10 SHAKES [913:14 SHALL (11112:13 SHAME 121157:7,8 SHARP Ill 175:8 SHARPER 111177:3 SHEET 151121:16 135:20 138:6 166:20 170:10 SHEETS 12198:24 99:1 SHE'S 0 ] 18:22 SHIPPING 11166:5 SHIT 111149:10 SHOPPING (1)82:10 SHORT 131117:18 131:1 145:10 SHORTHAND 1e11:28 2:7 75:2 104:18122:8 125:24 178:10186: 6 SHOT Ill 175:11 SHOULDERS [1113:15 SHOW 14121:7 98:6 141:4 163:5 SIC Ill 170:20 SIDE [2158:6 92:17 SIDES 111161:16 SIDEWAYS 111139:1 SIGN 113161:23106:1 108:6,15 123:16126:23 127:1 128:15132: 5 150:2,23,24 183:11 Sheet 11 REMEMBER - SIGN SIGNATURE 1243105:15,19,22,24 106:4,9,18,25 107:4,11,12,18126: 9,12,14179:7,9,10,12,24 180:16, 23181:9182:10 SIGNED 123184:21 93:20 99:12 105:4 106:3,5 108:14,17 112:19, 23 115:25 121:21 123:15128:13 130:23 133:2,4,14 134:17136:15 163:24 164:5 180:1 SIGNIFICANT Ill 131:20 SIGNING 111194:25 103:6 107:22 108:5 121:25 127:4 128:8,11 129: 25130:12 179:23 SIMILAR 12143:13 131:19 SIMPLY 121138:1 148:24 SINCE 19110:8 21:3,4 22:20 25:8 29:10 70:25 124:15177:13 SINGLE 13164:2 92:21 96:2 SINGLE-FAMILY 11182:1 SIR 14175:5104:21 174:1 178:13 SIT Ill 84:24 SITES 112141:2,15,15 45:10 50:17 53:24 54:9 55:19 56:3,24 57:3 58: 7 SITTING Ill172:19 SITUATION 121129:10168:12 SIX 11018:20 9:11,12 43:10,10 70: 23 126:1 133:3 152:13,14 SIX -PAGE Ill 104:13 SIZE [21137:10,11 SKEPTICAL Ill 128:5 SKEWING Ill 172:3 SKI Ill 161:3 SKILLS Ill i :19 SLICK [I1155:25 SLUG 131165:20,20167:7 SMALL [2164:8 131:9 SMARTER Ill 49:22 SMIRKS 1219:2510:2 SMITH 191116:12 118:6 128:14,16, 19,19,23,25 129:11 SOCIETIES 11137:12 SOLE 14144:5 59:4 61:2 71:8 SOLEMNLY Ill 185:6 SOLVENT Ill 132:17 SOMEBODY 120117:15 66:20 96: 11 108:1,1 110:1,2 115:6 118:9 119:7 120:17121:14138:5 139:2 149:12 156:7,13 158:8 171:2 173: 11 SOMEONE 18117:17,18 91:8 107: 18 108:6,15146:13 170:20 SOMETIME 18123:11 25:11 117: 19 118:18 137:20169:3,17 173:3 SOMETIMES [41160:17168:25 169:1,1 SOMEWHERE 15157:10108:20 131:6 134:13 160:9 SON-IN-LAW Ill66:4 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters rare WWI SONG 111170:7 SOON [11115:11 SORRY [13113:25 21:23 26:19 27: 24 33:6 48:24 50:3 55:13 101:19 102:16 105:10 124:8 126:2 SORT [9148:12 66:5,24 98:22 102: 18 129:23 148:15161:6 172:3 SORTS 111181:22 SOUNDED Ill i15:6 SOURCES 13197:23,25138:7 SPE [7132:5 60:4,5,19 64:6 70:11 164:23 SPEAKING [7] 53:12 97:20 130:4, 5,6 136:13 148:5 SPEAKS [3184:8 115:8130:21 SPECIAL 12113:8,13 SPECIFIC 111145:24 54:5 85:22 86:2 87:5 96:25 100:3127:9 138: 18 163:6.7 SPECIFICALLY [11128:1 54:4,25 85:22 98:1 109:6 121:4 130:7 133: 23 153:14172:17 SPELL 11)58:17 SPELLED Ill 92:14 SPEND 12189:13 160:2 SPENT 11177:11 SPE'S 11J 45:8 SPOILED Ill66:24 SPOKE 17184:19119:14 128:7 140:25 143:1 149:8 167:5 SPOKEN [21136:5148:13 SPOT Ill 148:16 SPOUSAL 119118:5,7,14 27:12,15 29:14,23,25 101:1,24 106:20,21 107:6,14111:7, 8124:21 125:10 135:2 SPOUSE 15127:19 28:17106:13 111:13 117:12 SPRING 121128:17,23 STAB Ill 118:8 STABILIZE Ill 127:23 STAFF Ill 46:9 STANDS Ill 125:4 START 15126:5 57:10 78:17160:4, 5 STARTED 112158:4 92:14 115:12 129:17 133:11 146:20147:9 149: 1,10 159:1 166:7 169:3 STATE 12111:1 2:9 6:21 20:23 22: 7 34:17,20,24 35:21,25 36:2,18 40:1 60:24 61:21,25 118:12,12 185:1 186:1,7 STATED 1717:15 8:13 20:24 30:2, 16 41:6 46:11 STATEMENT 12120:23 122:16 STATEMENTS 12119:23 67:12 STATUTORY 01183:6 STAY 14154:19 115:12 116:8135: 16 STELLAR 12195:17,19 STENOGRAPHICALLY Ill 186: 14 STEP Ill 168:17 STEPFATHER Ill 68:13 STEVE 19112:7,13 79:1,3 82:13,23 83:25 129:4 STICKS 123159:23160:1 STILL 115125:15 26:1 69:5 78:24 94:12 101:12 124:13 129:11 135: 15 136:18,19 147:5 148:22 169: 19 174:3 STIPULATE 1219:17,21 STIPULATED Ill 183:23 STOP [7120:19 42:13 56:22 57:5 65:16 177:18,19 STOPPAGE 12192:7,10 STOPPED [11156:13,20 57:24 63: 21,24 70:23,25 100:20131:13 139:3174:20 STORY [21168-25 172:7 STREET [1164:7 STRETCH Ill 116:1 STRUCK Ill 151:15 STRUCTURE [3150:19 65:2 165: 25 STUCK Ill 146:17 STUDENT (1138:25 SUBJECT 1418:11 37:6 101:12 180:6 SUBJECTS Ill 173:8 SUBMIT Ill114:18 SUBMITTED 121180:16,23 SUBORDINATE Ill 112:16 SUBPOENA Ill 125-6 SUBSCRIBED Ill 186:19 SUBSEQUENT 17136:2 73:16 83: 3 124:2 162:14 174:6 180:6 SUBSTANTIAL (1)167:11 SUCCEED 141115:22144:16158: 1 166:13 SUCCESS 141110:9 113:9,10 166: 8 SUCCESSFUL 1151110:10 113:3, 22 114:24 115:3, 10.15 122,12, 13 156:19 157:7165:21 166:2 168: 16 172:13 SUCCESSFULLY Ill 112:15 SUED P166:12 67:1,14,16 69:2 70: 15,20 SUFFERING Ill 175:20 SUFFICIENT (a] 122:22128:7 146:21 SUGGEST 14149:10 53:14 54:15 140:15 SUGGESTED 111146:13 SUING 11166:14 SUIT Ill 158:9 SUITE Ill 3:5 SUITS 12166:16 155:25 SUM 131116:14118:2,9 SUMMARY [11182:17 SUMMER 14115:19 96:6 97:9 118: 19 SUMMERS 11138:14 SUNSET Ill 3:4 SUNTEK 15130:17,19 32:2,3,5 SUPERIOR Ill 1 d SUPERVISOR PI 39:14 43:15,23 SUPPLEMENTAL 1415:2178:6, 20,22 SUPPOSED 12184a8,23 SWEAR 1217:4134:3 SYNDICATING 0158:7 SYNDICATION (1159:24 SYNDICATOR 12159:24 60:2 SYNDICATORS Ill 112:9 SYSTEM [23156:6 158:12 T TABLE Ill 129:9 TAHOE Ill 161:3 TALKED 13171:17 96:17116:11 TAP Ill 120:17 TAPES 111156:23 TASK Ill s9d 1 TEACH 1988:5 TEAM 11156:2 TECHNICAL Ill 36:3 TECHNICALLY 1116:23 TECHNIQUES Ill 157:22 TELEPHONE 15396:20108:21,25 138:11 173:5 TELLS 121115:21 150:5 TEN 113151:17 103:13,19 104:2 109:3 131:7 149:9 155:1 157:3 158:7 176:25 177:2 183:14 TENDENCY Ill 140:9 TENDS 111138:17 TEN-MINUTE 151109:16,20 110:6, 19 111:14 TENTATIVE Ill 61:22 TERM 18198:24 99:1 109:6 110:5 121:16 135:20 138:6163:14 TERMINATE 12119:14103:24 TERMINATED 111141:9 TERMS [2158:10150:10 TESTIFY 11111:13 TESTIFYING 14111:2314:13100: 9 173:23 TESTIMONY [2518:1910:19 11:6 12:15 14:12,21 19:3 32:12,14 81: 11 102:15106:20 141:24147:17 161:12 164:17,19 176:7 177:7,11 181:17182:18,19186:12,17 TEXAS 131159:15,19164:1 TEXT [9102:6 THANKS Ill 178:7 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 Sheet 12 SIGNATURE -THANKS THEME 131138:19 168:6,6 THEMSELVES 11184d s THEREAFTER 111186:14 THEREFORE 12112:4141:25 THEREIN Ili186:10 THEREOF Ill 186:19 THERE'S 11616:2312:215:12 44: 19 64:25107:25 126:9 130:16 139:21 150:5 174:15,25 175:3 177:4 180:22 183:14 THERETO Ili 185:9 THEY'LL 121160:8,10 THEY'VE 12119:21,21 THIN m icl:23 THINKING 121148:15166:8 THIRD ri 128:1 149:1,3,5 178:24 THIRD -PARTY 12177:13 90:8 THOUSAND 11J 104:7 THREE 12517:23 8:1,13,17,17 38: 14 54:8,9 56:10 86:16 93:12,13 117:14 120:16 122:14 127:13 132: 7 133:16134:9 145:24152:15,16, 22 161:15 181:6 THROW 131159:22,25162:9 TIED (1187:10 TILL 13123:7 40:3 71:12 TIMEFRAME Ili16o:24 TIRED 111181:22 TITLE 110145:22,24 46:1,3 58:23 59:2 74:21 89:22 105:15 112:9 TITLED 13175:12122:3 125:20 TODAY 11917:2512:23,25 14:12, 21,24 23:8 25:5 28:23 29:20 69:6 94:11, 16 95:16 137:8 175:14176: 7178:2184:1 TODAY'S 1116:11 TODD 141135:22,24136:11,17 TOGETHER 19145:3 58:13 60:17, 18 97:6 116:15118:2 124:4161:4 TON [11151:13 TOOK 11018:9 36:24 37:5 57:4 58: 12 59:10 63:18 90:5,14118:8 TOOL [21148:17,24 TOP [4117:16 56:11 111:20128:3 TOPIC 121100:4,7 TOPICS 141109:15 138:16 144:12 155:15 TOPPED O188:20 TOTALLY Ill 181:25 TOWARDS 15119:22 98:16129: 22 161:6 166:9 TRACTION Ill 47:8 TRADITIONAL Ill 121:10 TRAINING 13141:18,24 84:11 TRANSACTION 14180:22 81:10, 18 87:15 TRANSACTIONS (2137:7 82:4 TRANSCRIBED Ill 186:15 TRANSCRIPT [101181:17183:7,8, R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 10,11,13,14,15,17, 20 TRAVEL Ill 150:3 TRIAL F111:11,13,1512:2 19:18 183:18,22 TRIALS Ill 12:17 TRIED 131109:21 120:16132:15 TRUE 110166:10147:15167:3,16, 20,24 172:16,21,24 186:16 TRULY 11146:23 TRUST 13182:22,23 134:23 TRUSTING Ili 167:1 TRUTH 121148:20 172:3 TRUTHFUL 15114:21 88:10171: 10,14 181:25 TRY 14110:19 120:16132:25146: 18 TRYING 161127:21 133:10135:16, 19 148:18 161:5 TUNE Ill 48:13 TURN 151105:7,14111:16126:6 130:15 TURNED 121167:16172:24 TWICE 14151:20 52:1 145:5 149:8 TWO-THIRDS Ill 84:1 TYPE 14197:24155:22,24 156:4 TYPES [Il i7:1 TYPICAL 11163:8 TYPICALLY 12155:3155:23 U ULTIMATELY PI 86:15134:6 137:17 UMBRELLA Ill 150:12 UM-HMM In 13:15 UNABLE 131177:11,15181:24 UNANSWERED Ill 5:4 UNAVAILABLE Ill 183:21 UNDER 123111:24 14:10 45:8 51:5 58:5 60:15,16,21,22 64:6 77:10 78:24 91:2,9 137:3 150:3,12,22 155:23 183:11 185:6, 7186:11 UNDERLYING [3154:2555:1,6 UNDERSTANDING 111114:17 49: 18 78:14 84:17,24 91:25 92:22 112:22 129:18 130:18 174:9 UNDERSTANDS 11149:16 UNDERSTOOD 16114:749:15,16 102:22 115:7 149:4 UNDERUTILIZED 11165:2 UNDERWRITE 14141:15 54:23,24 138:24 UNDERWRITING 121121:15170: 4 UNHAPPY 13195:7,24 96:3 UN -HUH Ill 13:16 UNITED 15166:15 70:5,6,13,16 UNITS 12147:5 73:17 UNIVERSITIES Ill 35:23 UNIVERSITY 17133:23 34:24 35: 21,25 36:2,18 40:1 UNNERVE Ill 10:4 UNNERVING Ill 10:4 UNSIGNED [31121:24123:14,17 UNSUCCESSFUL 121118:21 162: 7 UNTIL 18158:20 100:16 115:18 116:17 133:4 135:14 169:2 170:7 UNTRUE Ill 173:16 UNTRUTHFUL 11187:24 UPFRONT Ill 109:6 UPSET 151156:13,16,16 174:20,24 URBAN 141114:8,13,16,19 URGE Ill 104:4 USAA Ill 170:2 USES 13149:25 106:4,8 USING 17113:13 25:16 26:5 28:25 29:6 50:15 163:17 V VACANT 12150:18 163:15 VALID 11192:17 VALUE [2165:3117:5 VARIED Ill 159:24 VARIETY 15134:5 40:25 158:23 161:24 178:23 VARIOUS [7] 10:6 11:24 45:2 71: 10 81:1 97:23 100:14 VD Ill 73:3 VDB 110173:3,5,14 76:2,5,7,10,13, 16,17 VDC 11811:18 73:22 74:2,4,8 75:17 18,23,24,24 77:5 78:1 149:23,25 151:23 161:10 164:14,21 VEGAS Ili 66:6 VENICE [2142:25 43:1 VENTURE 13155:20 97:24112:18 VENTURES 14146:24 71:11 115: 15 162:7 VERIFICATION [21178:25130:11 VERSION [2]123a4,17 VERSUS 121109:7110:2 VESTED [4151:8 56:1 78:8, 10 VET [1163:25 VIA 111121:22 VIABLE [1141:17 VICE-PRESIDENT (4121:10,13, 18 22:3 VICINITY 12181:14,16 VIDEO m6:8 VIDEOGRAPHER [2013:10 6:6 7: 3 59:7,9 74:17,19 78:19,21 105:8, 11,13 125:13,15 156:20,24 157:1 182:22,24 183:25 VIDEOTAPE 13110:11,13,17 VIDEOTAPED 1116:6 VIEW 131114:23 181:4 182:18 VINEYARD 121130:22141:12 VINEYARDSDC.COM Ill26:5 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 VIOLATION 111148:5 VIRTUALLY (21116:25117:3 VISTA 12154:6 56:12 VOLUNTARILY [11125:1 VOTE PI 86:16 93:15,18 VOTED 11193:17 VOTES Ill 86:16 VOTING 12156:1 84:1 VP 12118:22144:21 VS [211:10 6:16 W WAIT [11122:24 WAITING Ill 133:24 WAIVE Ill 101:25 WAIVED 131101:5 125:1,3 WALK I3111:6 177:18,19 WALL [21159:23160:1 WALMART Ill 164:2 WANTED 13] 57:2 58:9 63:18 64: 17,18 66:23137:10 157:9 WANTS nP10i:6 WAREHOUSE 121159:16164:2 WARNED 13166:18138:21 157:23 WARRANTY Ill 112:14 WASTE m 93:i 1 WAY 122110:19 54:6 56:12 61:13, 14 66:19 81:19 88:2 95:21 101:4 118:1 132:8133:9 144:15,16149: 12 156:6 158:12 164:23 168:16, 17 182:18 WAYS 131137:5 174:15,25 WEARS 111155:25 WEBSITE 11121:23 WEEK [21133:1 162:7 WEEKS Is] 131:7 135:8,11 WEIGHT O] 14:13 WEINGARTEN 110167:15,16,20, 23 68:4,7,12 69:6,9,20 WEST 13154:7 56:11 58:6 WHATEVER 15110:11 14:1 17:16 39:20 140:6 WHEREAS 11146:24 WHEREIN In 55:18 WHEREUPON 16175:1 104:17 122:7125:23 178:9 184:8 WHETHER 116148:1 49:14,15 55: 1.4 68:24 102:13 130:18 137:13. 24153:9 154:21 165:3 168:9 180: 12 183:3 WIFE [20121:7 22:21 25:21 101:18 102:4 140:10, 2 5, 25141:1, 3,16, 25 142:16, 21 144:1 147: 6 148:14, 20 155:5 164:22 WILKINSON 111130:11,16,21 31:7, 10,13,19,23 32:6,8 89:20 WILKINSON'S 0130:19 WILLING [71116:8 138:23,25 139: 23 146:18 167:8177:17 Sheet 13 THEME - WILLING WILLY P] 155:25 WINDOW 121117:18145:11 WINGS P] 155:23 WISH IV 11:4 WITHDRAW 13127:25103:4142: 13 WITHIN 1712:7 43:9 103:2 137:4, 14146:22183:13 WITHOUT 111117:11 18:7 84:12 85:5 99:5 102:2 141:23,24 148:12 169:14 179:14 WITNESSED m 101 a 4 WITNESSING 121176:11,13 WITNESS'S 14132:13 147:16 161: 11 164:18 WOLPERT 1112:12 WOOD Ill 151:2 WOOLWORTH Ill 164:2 WORD 112113:2 17:16 34:9 48:17 49:1,5,25 50:10 52:12,24 53:10 64:23 WORDS 14113:14 90:22 98:25 134:3 WORKS [7117:15,18,18108:1 158: 10,12 172:8 WORLD 121132:6145:6 WORTH 121131:23 150:12 WOUND PI 66:14 92:19117:24 WRITE 13119:19 126:20 165:23 WRITING 121131:10153:15 WRONGFULLY Ill180:13 Y YEAR 114115:1,4 22:16 24:21 29:7 33:15 35:9 90:5,14 118:5,15 132: 14133:10 150:2 YEARS 11518:1,17,18,20 9:11,12 30:4 39:24127:23 128:21 132:7 133:16 135:24156:13 160:8 YELLING 111121:3 YORK 112132:24 33:3,23 34:16,17, 20,24 35:21 36:1,3,19 40:1 YOUNG 12157:2 158:12 YOURSELF 15122:21 70:11 71:6 114:19 179:4 Z ZERO 121110:15165:17 ZONING 17151:6 54:25 55:1 61:18, 20,24,24 R. Leonard, C.S.R., Inc. Certified Shorthand Reporters 818.995.2449 Dalesandro vs. Ogulnick Deposition of Ryan Andrew Ogulnick, Vol. 1 August 13, 2012 Sheet 14 WILLY - ZONING SUBP-010 ATTORNEY OR PARTY `MTHOUT ATTORNEY (Name, State Bar number, and aWresy FOR COURT USEONLY adraic Glasov (SBN 259563) Howarth & Smith 523 West Sixth Street, Suite 728, Los Anqeles, CCaliffornia 90014 TELEPHONE NO.. (213) 955-9400 FA No: (213) 622-0791 E-MAILADDRESS: pglaspy@howarth-smith.com ATTORNEY FOR (Name). Defendant Protilus Investors, LLC SUPERIOR COURT OF CALIFORNIA, COUNTY OF Los Angeles STREErADDRESS: 111 North Hill Street MAILING ADDRESS 111 North Hill Street CITY AND ZIP CODE.. Los Angeles, California 90012 BRANCH NAME Central - Stanley Mosk Courthouse PLAINTIFF/PETITIONER: VDB Santa Ana, LLC, et al. DEFENDANT/RESPONDENT: Protilus, LP, et al. DEPOSITION SUBPOENA CASE NUMBER FOR PRODUCTION OF BUSINESS RECORDS BC484031 THE PEOPLE OF THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA, TO (name, address, and telephone number of deponen4 if known): Union Bank, 400 California Street, San Francisco, California 94104 1. YUU AKE OKUEKEU TU PKUUUCE THE BU5I114E55 RECORDS described In Item 3, as follows To (name of deposition officer): PadraicGlaspy, Esq. On (date) : May 21, 2013 At (time): 10:00 a.m. Location (address): 523 West Sixth Street Suite 728 Los Angeles, California 90014 Do not release the requested records to the deposition officer prior to the date and time stated above. a. LJ by delivering a true, legible, and durable copy of the business records described in item 3, enclosed in a sealed inner wrapper with the title and number of the action, name of witness, and date of subpoena clearly written on it. The inner wrapper shall then be enclosed in an outer envelope or wrapper, sealed, and mailed to the deposition officer at the address in item 1. b. ✓� by delivering a true, legible, and durable copy of the business records described in item 3 to the deposition officer at the witness's address, on receipt of payment in cash or by check of the reasonable costs of preparing the copy, as determined under Evidence Code section 1563(b). c. 0 by making the original business records described in item 3 available for inspection at your business address by the attorney's representative and permitting copying at your business address under reasonable conditions during normal business hours. 2. The records are to be produced by the date and time shown in item 1 (but not sooner than 20 days after the issuance of the deposition subpoena, or 15 days after service, whichever date is later). Reasonable costs of locating records, making them available or copying them, and postage, if any, are recoverable as set forth in Evidence Code section 1563(b). The records shall be accompanied by an affidavit of the custodian or other qualified witness pursuant to Evidence Code section 1561. 3. The records to be produced are described as follows (if electronically stored information is demanded, the form or forms in which each type of information is to be produced may be specified): 0 Continued on Attachment 3. 4. IF YOU HAVE BEEN SERVED WITH THIS SUBPOENA AS A CUSTODIAN OF CONSUMER OR EMPLOYEE RECORDS UNDER CODE OF CIVIL PROCEDURE SECTION 1985.3 OR 1985.6 AND A MOTION TO QUASH OR AN OBJECTION HAS BEEN SERVED ON YOU, A COURT ORDER OR AGREEMENT OF THE PARTIES, WITNESSES, AND CONSUMER OR EMPLOYEE AFFECTED MUST BE OBTAINED BEFORE YOU ARE REQUIRED TO PRODUCE CONSUMER OR EMPLOYEE RECORDS. DISOBEDIENCE OF THIS SUBPOENA MAY BE PUNISHED AS CONTEMPT BY THIS COURT. YOU WILL ALSO BE LIABLE FOR THE SUM OF FIVE HUNDRED DOLLARS AND ALL DAMAGES RESULTING FROM YOUR FAILURE TO OBEY. Date issued: April 18, 2013 (,-,- Padraic Glaspy (TYPE OR PRINT NAME) (SIGNA RE OF PERSON ISSUING SUBPOENA) Attorney for Defendant Protilus Investors, LLC (Proof of service on reverse) (TITLE) Page 1 of 2 Form Adopted for MandatoryUse DEPOSITION SUBPOENA FOR PRODUCTION Codeofcmvl Proce.lure,§§2020.410-2020.440; JudioalCoundl of California Government Code § 680971 SUBP-010[Rev January 1, 20121 OF BUSINESS RECORDS corny wmtsca gw ATTACHMENT The following definitions pertain to all of the following requests. 1. For the purposes of this entire set of document requests, "DOCUMENT" or "DOCUMENTS" means a writing(s), as defined in Evidence Code § 250, and includes any written, graphic or recorded matter and any object or tangible thing of every kind, character or description, or any other means of preserving thought or expression, or any combination thereof; whether draft, revision or final; however stored, retrieved, produced, transferred, processed, reproduced or reproducible; whether printed, typed, written, produced by hand, photographed, or produced by any other process, including, but not limited to, chemical, mechanical or electronic processes; including originals and non -identical copies, whether different from the originals by reason of any notations, handwritten or blind notes, comments, underlinings, highlightings, or other distinguishing characteristics made on such copies or otherwise; in your possession, custody or control (including, without limitation, documents within the possession, custody or control of your attorneys, accountants or agents, documents that you have a legal right to obtain, documents that you have a right to copy or have access to, and documents that you have placed in the temporary possession, custody or control of any third person); wherever located; which can be located or discovered by reasonably diligent effort; including, but not limited to: acceptances, accounting records and work papers, accounts, accounts payable, accounts receivable, administrative records, advertisements, advertising literature, attorneys' notes and memoranda, advertising materials, affidavits, agendas, agreements, analyses, announcements, annual or other periodic reports, applications, appointment books, appraisals, assignments, assignments of beneficial interest, audit reports, audio-visual materials, audits, awards, balance sheets, bank account records, bank statements, bills, bills of lading, bills of sale, books, bonds, brochures, budgets, bulletins, business records, calendar entries or notations, calendars, canceled checks, cards, cartridges, cash flow statements, cassettes, celificates, change orders, charts, checkbooks, checks, circulars, clips, closing statements, commission agreements, conferences (including, but not limited to, reports and/or summaries thereof), communications (including but not limited to, reports and/or summaries thereof), communiques, computer printouts, computer tapes, contracts, conversations (including, but not limited to, reports and/or summaries thereof), copyrights and material relating thereto, correspondence, credentials, criteria, data (in electronic, mechanical, chemical or any other form), decrees, deeds, deposition exhibits, depositions, diaries, diary entries or notations, directives, disclosure statements, discovery requests, discs (including, but not limited to, all types of computer disks), displays, documents of title, drafts, drawings, e-mails, engineering reports, engravings, envelopes, equipment, evidence, expense records, experiments, exhibits, figures, file folders, files, filings with any government agency (including, but not limited, to federal, state, local or foreign governments), films, filmstrips, financial projections, financial records, financial statements, financial summaries, financing statements, forecasts, formulas, general ledgers, graphs, handbills, handbooks, inscriptions, instructions, instruments, interrogatories and responses and answers thereto, interviews (including, but not limited to, reports and/or summaries thereof), inventories, investigations and summaries of investigations, invitations, invoices, journals, judgments, laboratory reports, ledgers, legal bills and statements, letter agreements, letters, licenses and applications thereof, listing agreements, lists, literature, lithographs, loan documents, magnetic tapes, mailgrams, management records, management reports, manifests, manuals or excerpts therefrom, maps, menus, memoranda filed in court, memoranda (including, but not limited to, inter - and intra-office memoranda), messages, microfiche, microfilm, minutes, minutes or records of meetings (including, but not limited, to directors and shareholders meetings), minutes of meetings or creditors, models, mortgages, newsletters, notebooks, notes (including, but not limited to, stenographic, handwritten and personal notes, notices to creditors, offers, offers and acceptances, opinions (including, but not limited to, opinions of consultants, experts, accountants, attorneys or service organizations such as title companies), original or preliminary notes, outlines, packaging materials, pamphlets, papers, passbooks, patents and materials relating thereto, periodicals, permits, personal records, photographs slides or negatives, photographs and negatives, pictures or other matter which is able to be seen or read with or without mechanical or electronic assistance, plans, plates, pleadings, policies, press releases, price lists, profit and loss statements, pro formas, programs, projections, promissory notes, promotional literature and materials, proof, proofs of claim, proposals, prospectuses, publications, punch cards, purchase orders, receipts, recorded recollections, recordings, recordings or transcriptions of verbal conversations or statements (however made), records, records of meetings (including, but not limited to, notes, reports and summaries of conferences or interviews, whether formal or informal), registrations, reports, research and reports thereof, resumes, retainer agreements, schedules, scripts (including, but not limited to, television and radio scripts), seals, security agreements, shipping documents, sketches, slides, solicitations, sound recordings, specifications, statements, statements of income and expense, statements of cooperation, statements or books of account, statistical or informational accumulations or compilations (including, but not limited to, all forms of computer storage and retrieval), statistical statements, stenographic notes, stock certificates, stock ledgers, studies, study notes, summaries, summaries of investigations, summaries of records of personal conversations, surveys, sworn statements, syllabi, synopses, tables, tabulations, tape records, tapes, tax returns, telephone messages, trademarks and materials relating thereto, trade secrets and materials relating thereto, telegrams, telephone bills and toll call records, telephone logs and records, telex communications, tests and results thereof, title policies, title reports, trade letters, transactional records, transcripts, transcriptions, travel records, trial exhibits, trial transcripts, trust agreements, trusts, verdicts, video tapes, video discs, voice recordings, warrants, warranties, wills, worksheets, work papers, writs, writings, and written memorials of oral communications (including notations or statements of any kind whatsoever of communications containing conversations, dialogues, discussions, interviews, consultations, or other understandings between or among two or more persons, whether oral or written). 2. For the purposes of this entire set of document requests, "THE MET AT GENEVA COMMONS" means that certain piece of real property located at 200 East First American Way, City of Santa Ana, County of Orange, State of California. 3. For the purposes of this entire set of document requests, "PROJECT" means that certain investment in the real property as more fully described in the Second Amended and Restated Operating Agreement for VDC at the Met, LLC, attached to the Plaintiffs Verified Complaint as Exhibit A. 4. For the purposes of this entire set of document requests, "OGULNICK" means Ryan Ogulnick, individually, in his capacity as a manager of VDB Santa Ana, LLC, and/or in his capacity as an officer of Vineyards Development, Inc. 5. For the purposes of this entire set of document requests, "YOU' and "YOUR" means Union Bank, as well as any advisors, agents, employees, servants, officers, directors, other persons and/or employees working at Union Bank. 6. For the purposes of this entire set of document requests, "PROTILUS" means Protilus Investors, LLC and Protilus, L.P. 7. For the purposes of this entire set of document requests, "ILUS INVESTORS" means Ilus Investors, LP. 8. For the purposes of this entire set of document requests, "ILUS GP" means Ilus GP US, LLC. 9. For the purposes of this entire set of document requests, "VDC OPERATING AGREEMENT" means the Second Amended and Restated Operating Agreement for VDC at The Met, LLC. 10. For the purposes of this entire set of document requests, a document 'concerns", "refers to", "relates to" or is "concerning", "referring to" or "relating to" a particular fact, matter or event when it proves or disproves, or tends to prove or disprove, the fact, matter, or event, or contains information concerning, explaining, or providing a background for understanding that fact, matter or event, or is evidence of or a result of that fact, matter, or event, or could lead to additional relevant information concerning, explaining, or providing a background for understanding that fact, matter or event, or was produced altered or signed as a part of or as a result of that fact, matter or event. INSTRUCTIONS 1. The DOCUMENTS produced pursuant to these requests must be segregated and identified according to the specific request to which they are responsive. Duplicate copies of DOCUMENTS which are responsive to more than one request need not be produced more than once if the specific requests to which such DOCUMENTS relate are designated. 2. The DOCUMENTS requested hereby specifically include, but are not limited to, those DOCUMENTS in YOUR possession, custody or control, or in the possession, custody or control of YOUR employees, agents, representatives, attorneys, accountants, auditors, affiliates, advisers, consultants and any other person or entity acting, or who has acted, on YOUR behalf. 3. If any of the DOCUMENTS requested below are claimed to be privileged or are otherwise withheld, set forth with respect to each such DOCUMENT facts of sufficient specificity to permit the Court to make a full determination as to whether the claim of privilege is valid, including each and every fact or basis upon which said privilege is claimed. 4. In the event that any DOCUMENT or other thing called for by any request has been destroyed, discarded, or otherwise disposed of, that DOCUMENT or other thing is to be identified as completely as possible, and the following information is to be provided. (a) date of disposal; (b) manner of disposal; (c) reason for disposal; (d) person and/or entity authorizing the disposal; and (e) person and/or entity disposing of the DOCUMENT or other thing. 5. The terms "and" and "or" shall be construed either disjunctively or conjunctively, and the singular shall be deemed to include the plural and vice versa, as necessary to bring within the scope of each request all DOCUMENTS and other things which might otherwise be construed to be outside the scope of that request. 6. Words used in these requests in the present tense include the future as well as the present; words used in the masculine gender include the feminine and neuter; the singular includes the plural, and the plural includes the singular. 7. Unless a specific time period is provided, the applicable time period for each request shall be from January 1, 2011, through May 31, 2012. 8. And DOCUMENTS produced pursuant to this subpoena shall be produced directly to Judge Joyce Karlin Fahey, ARC, 205 Pier Avenue Suite 103, Hermosa Beach, California 90254 for in camera review. DOCUMENT REQUESTS 1. All DOCUMENTS relating to the bank account of Vineyards Development, Inc., Account Number 0360044459. 2. All DOCUMENTS relating to any other financial transaction including wire transfers initiated or received by Vineyards Development, Inc. LLC. 3. All DOCUMENTS relating to any bank account for the entity VDB Santa Ana, 4. All DOCUMENTS relating to any other financial transaction including wire transfers initiated or received by VDB Santa Ana, LLC. 5. All DOCUMENTS relating to any other bank account held in the name of an entity in which Ryan Ogulnick owns an interest. 6. All DOCUMENTS concerning some, all, or the following: Vineyards Development Inc., VDB Santa Ana, LLC, the real property frequently known as THE MET AT GENEVA COMMONS, VDC at The Met, LLC, ILUS INVESTORS, ILUS GP, PROTILUS, Ridgemount Investments, Inc., the Avalon Loan, Barry L. Levine, and/or Ari Schottenstein. 7. All DOCUMENTS with Robert H. Bisno that pertain to some, all, or the following between the dates September 2011-May 2012: Vineyards Development Inc., VDB Santa Ana, LLC, the real property frequently known as THE MET AT GENEVA COMMONS, VDC at The Met, LLC, ILUS INVESTORS, ILUS GP, PROTILUS, Ridgemount Investments, Inc., the Avalon Loan, Barry L. Levine, and/or Ari Schottenstein. 8. All DOCUMENTS with Rachel Ogulnick, f/k/a Rachel Flanagan that pertain to some, all, or the following: Vineyards Development Inc., VDB Santa Ana, LLC, the real property frequently known as THE MET AT GENEVA COMMONS, VDC at The Met, LLC, ILUS INVESTORS, ILUS GP, PROTILUS, Ridgemount Investments, Inc., the Avalon Loan, Barry L. Levine, and/or Ari Schottenstein. 9. All DOCUMENTS with Alexander H. Iscoe that pertain to some, all, or the following: Vineyards Development Inc., VDB Santa Ana, LLC, the real property frequently known as THE MET AT GENEVA COMMONS, VDC at The Met, LLC, ILUS INVESTORS, ILUS GP, PROTILUS, Ridgemount Investments, Inc., the Avalon Loan, Barry L. Levine, and/or Ari Schottenstein. 10. All DOCUMENTS with David Ulmer that pertain to some, all, or the following: Vineyards Development Inc., VDB Santa Ana, LLC, the real property frequently known as THE MET AT GENEVA COMMONS, VDC at The Met, LLC, ILUS INVESTORS, ILUS GP, PROTILUS, Ridgemount Investments, Inc., the Avalon Loan, Barry L. Levine, and/or Ari Schottenstein. 11. All DOCUMENTS with Brian Appel that pertain to some, all, or the following: Vineyards Development Inc., VDB Santa Ana, LLC, the real property frequently known as THE MET AT GENEVA COMMONS, VDC at The Met, LLC, ILUS INVESTORS, ILUS GP, PROTILUS, Ridgemount Investments, Inc., the Avalon Loan, Barry L. Levine, and/or Ari Schottenstein. 12. All DOCUMENTS with Geoffrey Gold that pertain to payments made by Mr. Geoffrey Gold to some, all, or the following: Vineyards Development Inc., VDB Santa Ana, LLC, the real property frequently known as THE MET AT GENEVA COMMONS, VDC at The Met, LLC, ILUS INVESTORS, ILUS GP, PROTILUS, Ridgemount Investments, Inc., the Avalon Loan, Barry L. Levine, and/or Ari Schottenstein. 13. All DOCUMENTS with J.T. Fox that pertain to payments made by Mr. J.T. Fox to some, all, or the following: Vineyards Development Inc., VDB Santa Ana, LLC, the real property frequently known as THE MET AT GENEVA COMMONS, VDC at The Met, LLC, ILUS INVESTORS, ILUS GP, PROTILUS, Ridgemount Investments, Inc., the Avalon Loan, Barry L. Levine, and/or Ari Schottenstein. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 SUPERIOR COURT OF THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA FOR THE COUNTY OF LOS ANGELES SANTA MONICA DEPARTMENT 0 HON. LISA HART COLE, JUDGE RYAN OGULNICK, ET AL., PLAINTIFFS, vs. SEAN DALESANDRO, ET AL., DEFENDANTS CASE NO. BC469863, ETC. REPORTER'S TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS TUESDAY, DECEMBER 6, 2016 APPEARANCES OF COUNSEL: FOR DALESANDRO, ET AL.: GERALD FOX LAW BY: JOHN K. RUBINER, ESQ. CYRUS SHAHRIARI, ESQ. 1880 CENTURY PARK EAST, SUITE 1410 LOS ANGELES, CA 90067 310-441-0500 JRUBINER@GERALDFOXLAW.COM CYRUS.KSHAL@GMAIL.COM FOR OGULNICK, ET AL.: LAW OFFICES OF COONTZ & MATTHEWS, LLP BY: M. STEPHEN COONTZ, ESQ. 30900 RANCHO VIEJO ROAD, SUITE 230 SAN JUAN CAPISTRANO, CA 92675 949-240-3040 SIEVE@COONTZMATTHEWS.COM (APPEARANCES CONTINUED ON NEXT PAGE.) MARK SCHWEITZER, CSR, CRR, RPR OFFICIAL PRO TEM COURT REPORTER LICENSE NO. 10514 Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 1 1F 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 APPEARANCES OF COUNSEL: (CONTINUED) FOR ILUS, VDCATM: RAINES FELDMAN, LLP BY: MILES J. FELDMAN, ESQ. LAITH D. MOSELY, ESQ. ROBERT M. SHORE, ESQ. 9720 WILSHIRE BOULEVARD, FIFTH FLOOR LOS ANGELES, CA 90212 310-440-4100 MFELDMAN@RAINESLAW.COM LMOSELY@RAINESLAW.COM RSHORE@RAINESLAW.COM Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 1 4 5 7 >i 9 10 1 1. 1! 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 MASTER INDEX DECEMBER 6, 2016; FULL DAY'S TRANSCRIPT MATTER: VERDICT. CHRONOLOGICAL/ALPHABETICAL INDEX OF WITNESSES PINUP E X H I B I T S NONE OFFERED Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com I 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 CASE NUMBER: CASE NAME: SANTA MONICA, CALIFORNIA DEPARTMENT 0 REPORTER: TIME: BC469863, ETC. OGULNICK, ET AL. TUESDAY, DECEMBER 6, 2016 LISA HART COLE, JUDGE MARK SCHWEITZER, CSR 10514 10:46 A.M. -000- THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT OUTSIDE THE PRESENCE OF THE JURY: THE COURT: All right. We'll go on the record. Counsel are present. Do you wish to state your appearances? MR. SHORE: Robert Shore and Laith Mosely of Raines Feldman for VDC at the Met and the Ilus entities. MR. COONTZ: Good morning, your Honor. Stephen Coontz for the Ogulnick defendants. MR. SHAHRIARI: Good morning, your Honor. Cyrus Shahriari here on behalf of plaintiffs and cross -defendants Sean Dalesandro and Parallel Real Estate Advisors, LLC. THE COURT: Good morning. The jury asked two questions. The first question is as follows: "If you answer, quotation marks, no, end quotation marks, to a question that subsequently asked you to skip to a section, and the minimum required jurors answered yes and continue to the next question, is the person who voted no supposed to answer questions in the remaining of the section?" And in my reading of this, the answer is yes. Does Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 1 2 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 28 anybody disagree with that? MR. SHORE: No, your Honor. MR. COONTZ: No, your Honor. That's correct. MR. SHAHRIARI: I agree. THE COURT: Today is the 7th, right? THE CLERK: The 6th. THE COURT: Oh, it's the 6th. Second question: "Please give us the legal definition of intentional misrepresentation and negligent misrepresentation." My suggestion would be to refer them to the page number in the packet of instructions, and I have checked that Page 57 is negligent misrepresentation. Let me just double-check since you're here. Yes. 57 is Instruction 1900, intentional misrepresentation. And Page 62 is 1903, negligent misrepresentation. And I'd like to refer them to the page numbers. MR. COONTZ: That's good. THE COURT: Is that agreeable? MR. COONTZ: Yes. MR. SHORE: Yes. MR. SHAHRIARI: Yes. THE COURT: Does anybody have any other suggestions? MR. SHAHRIARI: No, your Honor. MR. COONTZ: No. THE COURT: All right. That's what I shall do. MR. COONTZ: Thank you. MR. MOSELY: Thank you. THE COURT: Thank you, Counsel. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 3 2 5 7 3 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 (Recess taken.) 2:02 P.M. THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT IN THE PRESENCE OF THE JURY: THE COURT: All right. We're on the record. All of our jurors are present. Our alternate is here. Let's see, Mr. Alterson, I understand you're our foreperson. THE FOREPERSON: Yes, your Honor. THE COURT: Would you please hand the verdict form to the courtroom assistant. Thank you. All right. I'm going to be reading the verdict. You may know, now that you're leaving, that Christy is a brand new clerk filling in for Nancy. She's done an amazing job, and I want to thank her, and she's never read a verdict form before. I hardly think that I'm the one she needs to learn from, but I'm all she's got right now. So I do want to thank her publicly for the work she's done on this very difficult work for a judge. All right. Title of court and cause, Ryan Ogulnick versus Sean Dalesandro and related and consolidated cases and cross -complaints, BC469863. Consolidated with case numbers BC469871 and BC484031. Special Verdict form. We the jury in the above -entitled action find as follows: Sean Dalesandro's claim, Section 1, breach of contract as to Ryan Ogulnick/Vineyards, oral or implied contract. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 Question 1. Did Sean Dalesandro and Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards enter into a contract? Answer: Yes. If your answer to Question 1 is yes, then answer Question 2. If you answered no, go to Section 2. Question 2. Did Sean Dalesandro do all, or substantially all, of the significant things that the contract required him to do, or was he excused from having to do those things? Answer: Yes. If your answer to Question 2 is yes, then answer Question 3. If you answered no, go to Section 2. Question 3. Did all the conditions occur that were required for Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards' performance, or were they excused? Answer: Yes. If your answer to Question 3 is yes, then answer Question 4. If you answered no, go to Section 2. Question 4. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards fail to do something that the contract required them to do? Answer: Yes. If your answer to Question 4 is yes, then answer Question 5. If you answered no, go to Section 2. Question 5. Was Sean Dalesandro harmed by that failure? Answer: Yes. If your answer to Question 5 is yes, then answer Question 6. If you answered no, go to Section 2. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com I 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 Question 6. As part of Sean Dalesandro's contract, did he perform or agree to perform acts, as part of the contract, requiring a real estate broker's license when he did not have a valid license? Answer: No. If your answer to Question 6 is yes, then answer Question 7. If you answered no, go to Question 8. Question 8. Is the contract of the type that is required to be in writing according to the instructions? Answer: No. If your answer to Question 8 is yes, go to Section 2. If you answered no, then answer Question 9. Question 9. What are Sean Dalesandro's damages? Answer: $252,000. Section 2. As to VDC at the Met, oral or implied contract. Question 10. Did Ryan Ogulnick agree, on behalf of VDC at the Met, to answer into a contract with Sean Dalesandro between the dates of March 22, 2011, and March 28, 2011? Answer: Yes. If your answer to Question 10 is yes, then answer Question 11. If you answered no, go to Section 3. Number 11. Did Ilus Investors, or Ilus G.P., ratify the contract? Answer: No. If your answer to Question 11 is yes, then answer Question 12. If you answered no, go to Section 3. Section 3, promissory estoppel. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 11 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 If your answer to Question 1 was yes, skip this section and go to Section 4. Section 4. If your answer to Question 10 was yes, skip this section and go to Section 5. Section 5. False promise without intent to perform. As to Ryan Ogulnick/Vineyards. Question 36. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards make an important promise to Sean Dalesandro? Answer: Yes. If your answer to Question 36 is yes, then answer Question 37. If you answered no, go to Section 6. Question 37. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards intend to perform this promise when he or it made it? Answer: Yes. If your answer to Question 37 is yes, then answer Question 38. If you answered no, go to Section 6. Question 38. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards intend that Sean Dalesandro rely on this promise? Answer: Yes. If your answer to Question 38 is yes, then answer Question 39. If you answered no, go to Section 6. Question 39. Did Sean Dalesandro reasonably rely on this promise? Answer: Yes. If your answer to Question 39 is yes, then answer Question 40. If you answered no, go to Section 6. Question 40. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards perform Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 7 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 the promised act? Answer: No. If your answer to question 40 is yes, then answer Question 41. If you answered no, go to Section 6. Section 6. False promise without intent to perform as to VDC at the Met. Did Ryan Ogulnick cause VDC at the Met to make an important promise to Sean Dalesandro? Answer: Yes. If your answer to Question 44 is yes, go to Question 45. If you answered no, then go to Section 7. Question 45. Did Ilus Investors, or Ilus G.P., ratify the promise? Answer: No. If your answer to Question 45 is yes, go to Question 46. If you answered no, then go to Section 7. Section 7. Intentional misrepresentation as to Ryan Ogulnick/Vineyards. Question 55. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards make a false representation of an important fact to Sean Dalesandro? Answer: Yes. If your answer to Question 55 is yes, then answer Question 56. If you answered no, go to Section 8. Question 56. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards either know that the representation was false or make it recklessly and without regard for its truth? Answer: Yes. If your answer to Question 56 is yes, then answer Coalition Court Reporters 1 213.471,2966 1 www.ccrola.com 3 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 Question 57. If you answered no, go to Section 8. Question 57. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards intend that Sean Dalesandro rely on the representation? Answer: Yes. If your answer to Question 57 is yes, then answer Question 58. If you answered no, go to Section 8. Question 58. Did Sean Dalesandro reasonably rely on the representation of Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards? Answer: Yes. If your answer to Question 58 is yes, then answer Question 59. If you answered no, go to Section 8. Question 59. Was Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards' representation a substantial factor in causing harm to Sean Dalesandro? Answer: Yes. If your answer to question 59 is yes, then answer Question 60. If you answered no, go to Section 8. Question 60. What are Sean Dalesandro's damages? Answer: $1,200,000. Interest rate, if any, and starting date: Answer: 7 percent and October 3rd, 2013. Proceed to the next question. Question 61. Do you find that clear and convincing evidence that Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards made the representation with malice, oppression, or fraud? Answer: Yes. Section 8. Negligent misrepresentation. As to Ryan Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 9 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 Ogulnick/Vineyards. Question 62. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards make a false representation of an important fact to Sean Dalesandro? Answer: Yes. If your answer to Question 62 is yes, then answer Question 63. If you answered no, then go to Section 9. Question 63. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards honestly believe that the representation was true when it was made? Answer: No. If your answer to Question 63 is yes, then answer Question 64. If you answered no, go to Section 9. Section 9. Quantum meruit, common count. If you answered Question 9, even if your answer was zero, skip this section and proceed to Section 13. Section 13. Breach of fiduciary duty. Question 102. Did Sean Dalesandro owe Ilus Investors, or Ilus G.P., a fiduciary duty? Answer: No. If your answer to Question 102 was yes, then answer Question 103. If you answered no, go to Section 14. Section 14. Aiding and abetting breach of fiduciary duty. Question 110. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards owe Ilus Investors, or Ilus G.P., a fiduciary duty? Answer: Yes. If your answer to Question 110 is yes, then answer Question 111. If you answered no, then give this form to the Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 10 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 presiding juror to sign and date. Question 111. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards breach his or its fiduciary duty to Ilus Investors, or Ilus G.P.? Answer: Yes. If your answer to Question 111 is yes, then answer Question 112. If you answered no, then give this form to the presiding juror to sign and date. Question 112. Did Sean Dalesandro know that a breach of fiduciary duty was being committed or was going to be committed against Ilus Investors, or Ilus G.P.? Answer: No. If your answer to question 112 is yes, then answer Question 113. If you answered no, then give this form to the presiding juror to sign and date. Signed Jeffrey Alderson, dated 12/6/2016. Can I see counsel in chambers for a moment, please. Ladies and gentlemen, just hold on. We'll be out in a couple minutes. Thank you. (SIDEBAR CONFERENCE HELD, NOT REPORTED.) THE COURT: Ladies and gentlemen, we detected a couple errors that are ours, not yours, that we need to discuss, fix, and send you back. So may I ask you to please take a 10-minute break and come on back. Thank you very much. The admonition I previously have given you still remains. THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT OUTSIDE THE PRESENCE OF THE JURY: THE COURT: On the record. In reciting the verdict Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ecrola.com 11 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 form out loud, counsel identified correctly some mistakes in the verdict form. The first mistake we discussed in chambers had to do with Page 8, the instructions after Question 40. The instructions after Question 40 read: "If your answer to Question 40 is yes, then answer Question 41." That should have read: "If your answer to Question 40 is no, then answer Question 41." So I have made that correction upon the request of counsel, and I believe it is correct. Does anybody wish to be heard further as to that correction? And I showed you what I had done. MR. RUBINER: Nothing from us, your Honor. MR. FELDMAN: No. MR. COONTZ: Could I just take a minute to make sure? I'm a little stunned right now. No, I think that's correct, your Honor. THE COURT: Okay. The next area was Section 9. Quantum meruit on common count. The instruction reads: "If you answered Question 9, even if your answer was zero, skip this section and proceed to Section 13." The agreement was it should have read Section 11, and I've made that correction. MR. RUBINER: Actually, your Honor, I think that's also a mistake. It should be Section 10. They need to look at Section 10 because Section 10 is quantum meruit as to VDC at the Met. If they answered Question 21 -- if they didn't answer Question 21, they are supposed to do Section 10, and they skipped it. So this 13 should have been -- Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 12 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 THE COURT: Right. We discussed that back in chambers, and we discussed the merits of raising that issue at this juncture, given the verdict. And you -- MR. RUBINER: And in discussing it with my client and thinking about it, your Honor, I don't -- we spent a long time working on this verdict form. And I think it was -- THE COURT: Counsel, please don't tell me how long you spent. Let's just get to the bottom line. This jury is waiting. MR. RUBINER: I think the jury should be asked to answer Section 10. MR. FELDMAN: We disagree because there's already been a finding at Question 10 that there was a contract. MR. SHORE: That Ryan Ogulnick agreed on behalf of VDC at the Met -- MR. FELDMAN: Ryan Ogulnick agreed on behalf of VDC at the Met to enter into a contract. So because that was answered yes, then there is no quantum meruit. THE COURT: I agree. I'm going to decline Mr. Rubiner's request. Okay. So I'm going to leave on Line 18, Page 13, proceed to Section 11. And then the understanding is they are to go to Section 11 and Section 12; is that correct? MR. FELDMAN: Yes, your Honor. MR. SHORE: Yes, your Honor. MR. RUBINER: Yes, your Honor. THE COURT: Any objection to that? Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 13 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 MR. RUBINER: No. I think we should tell them they don't need to go back to any of the other sections. THE COURT: I will tell them that. MR. SHORE: It's up to them whether they want to, your Honor. THE COURT: You've just won. Why would you want them to go back to the other sections, Mr. Shore? I'm just curious. MR. FELDMAN: Me too. MR. SHORE: Okay. THE COURT: Thank you. All right. I have a question for the jury. And that is did they intend for the $252,000 on the contract to be in addition to the 1.2 million? I think that's a little unclear, and I would like to ask them that. Does anybody have any objection to me asking them that question? MR. RUBINER: Are you going to ask orally or -- THE COURT: I'm going to do it in writing. MR. RUBINER: Okay. So that will be an additional question saying did you intend the 252,000 to be separate -- THE COURT: Yes. MR. RUBINER: Okay. If you don't mind telling me exactly what the question would say. THE COURT: I'm going to write down did you intend for the $252,000 awarded in Question 9 to be in addition to the $1.2 million awarded in Question 60. MR. RUBINER: That's fine, your Honor. THE COURT: Okay. And I'll let you see it before I Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 14 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 send it in. Okay. Let's bring the jurors in. Have you prepared for punitive damages? Have you propounded discovery? MR. RUBINER: We did a demand to bring financial records to trial. So I guess we'll have to put Mr. Ogulnick on the stand and ask him about his finances. THE COURT: All right. We need to get Mr. Ogulnick here, please. MR. COONTZ: coming back now. THE COURT: MR. COONTZ: THE COURT: MR. COONTZ: 2:30. Mr. Ogulnick, I believe, is on a plane From where? From Dallas. When is he due to arrive? I understood that his plane left at THE COURT: All right. THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT IN THE PRESENCE OF THE JURY: THE COURT: Since our alternate is here, if she would like to go in and sit just to observe, is that objectionable to anyone? MR. RUBINER: No objection, your Honor. MR. COONTZ: No. MR. FELDMAN: No objection. THE COURT: All right. All of our jurors and alternate are present. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 15 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 Ladies and gentlemen, a couple mistakes were made on the form that have become obvious to us. I have made the corrections on your original verdict form. I'm going to read them out loud to you right now. And you can go back, and I'm sure your foreperson can read them if you have any questions. On Page 8, Line 15, the instructions should have read: "If your answer to Question 40 is no, then answer Question 41. If you answered yes, go to Question 6." I've made that correction on the form in red with my initials by it. The next mistake we discovered is on Page 13, Line 18. On Page 13, Line 18, the line should have read: "Skip this section and proceed to Section ll." Not Section 13. And I have put it in red and put my initials by that line as well. I've also put a paperclip by there so that you'll have an easy time finding it. I am also going to send you an additional question that has been approved by counsel regarding the award of the damages. And I'll send that in shortly. All right. I'm going to give the original back to our courtroom assistant and ask you to continue your deliberations. I apologize for the mistake. Thank you. And for the alternate, would you like to go back and listen? The lawyers have agreed, but you cannot say anything. Thank you very much. THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT OUTSIDE THE PRESENCE OF THE JURY: I!/ Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 16 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 THE COURT: I am going to be sending the following question in to the jury: "Did you intend for the award of $252,000 in damages from Question 9, parentheses, Page 2, Line 19, end parentheses, to be in addition" -- the word addition is underlined -- "to the damages of $1.2 million awarded in Question 60, Page 11, Line 26? And then I gave a spot for yes or no. Does anybody have any objection to me sending this in to the jury? MR. RUBINER: No, your Honor. MR. COONT2: No, your Honor. MR. FELDMAN: No. THE COURT: Thank you. All right. And we need to talk about the punitive damages phase. I am not sure the jury can come back tomorrow. MR. RUBINER: I'm sorry. As opposed to coming back on Thursday or coming back at all? THE COURT: I don't know that they can come back at all. They have been expressing, you know, financial hardship. So I think that that could be a problem. If they can't come back, they can't come back. So think about that. MR. RUBINER: Okay. (Recess taken.) THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT IN THE PRESENCE OF THE JURY: THE COURT: All right. All of our jurors and alternate are present. Thank you very much, ladies and Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 17 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 gentlemen, for your cooperation. Okay. I understand you've answered the question that we've asked you to do. Thank you very much, sir. Would you please hand it to the courtroom assistant. If it's agreeable with counsel, I'd like to read only those new areas. Is that agreeable, Mr. Rubiner? MR. RUBINER: Yes, your Honor. THE COURT: Mr. Coontz? MR. COONTZ: Yes, your Honor. THE COURT: Mr. Feldman? MR. FELDMAN: Yes, your Honor. THE COURT: Thank you. So the first question that we corrected was on Page 8, Line 13. The question was Question 40. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards perform the act promised? Answer: No. If your answer to Question 40 is no, then answer Question 41. If you answered yes, go to Section 6. Question 41. Was Sean Dalesandro's reliance on Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards promise a substantial factor in causing harm to Sean Dalesandro? Answer: Yes. If you answered Question 41 yes, then answer Question 42. If you answered no, go to Section 6. Question 42. What are Sean Dalesandro's damages? Answer: $60,000. Interest rate, if any, and starting date: Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 Zero percent, and not applicable. The next area that we asked you to check -- A JUROR: Your Honor, go to Question 43? THE COURT: Oh, sorry. Thank you. Question 43. Do you find by clear and convincing evidence that Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards engaged in the conduct with malice, oppression, or fraud? Answer: Yes. Now we're going to Section 9 on Page 13. Section 9. Quantum meruit, common count -- MR. RUBINER: Didn't we -- THE COURT: I'm making this, the correction, and I'm stating the correction in front of the jury. Section 9, quantum meruit, common count. If you answered Question 9, even if your answer was zero, skip this section and proceed to Section 11. It was formerly 13. Section 11. The Ilus parties' claims to Sean Dalesandro. Intentional misrepresentation and concealment. Question 85. Did Sean Dalesandro make any false representation of an important fact or intentionally fail to disclose one or more important facts to Ilus Investors, or Ilus G.P.? Answer: No. If your answer to Question 58 is yes, then answer Question 86. If you answered no, go to Section 12. Section 12. Negligent misrepresentation. Question 94. Did Sean Dalesandro or Parallel Real Estate Advisors make a false representation of an important Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.cerola.com M 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 fact to Ilus Investors or Ilus G.P.? Answer: Yes. If your answer to 94 is yes, then answer Question 95. If you answered no, go to section 13. Question 95. Did Sean Dalesandro or Parallel Real Estate Advisors have reasonable grounds for believing the representation was true when he or it made it? Answer: Yes. If your answer to Question 95 is no, go to Question 96. If you answered yes, go to Section 13. And previously this was already answered, Section 13, breach of fiduciary duty. Question 102. Did Sean Dalesandro owe Ilus Investors, or Ilus G.P., a fiduciary duty, and the answer previously stated was no. All right. One more thing before we go. The Court issued a question to the jury. The question was as follows: The Court submits the following request or question to the jury. Did you intend for the award of $252,000 in damages from Question 9, Page 2, Line 19, to be in addition, and addition was underlined, to the damages of $1,200,000 awarded in Question 60, Page 11, Line 26. Answer: Yes. Signed by the foreperson. A JUROR: Your Honor, the same counts for the -- THE COURT: I'm going to have to ask you that in writing, and we will get there. Thank you. Okay. Give me a second. I'm sorry, Mr. Peck. We Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 20 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 want to do it all right. (SIDEBAR CONFERENCE HELD, NOT REPORTED.) THE COURT: Okay. You can all go back. We're going to send you one more question. Thank you. THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT OUTSIDE THE PRESENCE OF THE JURY: THE COURT: All right. Back on the record. I'm sending the jury an additional question as follows: Did you intend for the award of $60,000 in damages from Question 42, Page 8, Line 22, to be in addition, underlined, to the award of damages of $252,000, Question 9, and $1,200,000, Question 60? Yes or no. Any objection? MR. RUBINER: No objection. MR. COONTZ: No, your Honor. MR. FELDMAN: No, your Honor. Are you going to request a polling? MR. COONTZ: Yes. THE COURT: That's going to take a while. So is your client with his wife? MR. COONTZ: Yes. THE COURT: Did you try emailing him? MR. COONTZ: Yes. I emailed and texted. THE COURT: Did you have him under subpoena? MR. RUBINER: We did a notice to appear. THE COURT: He left without Court permission. All right. They checked yes. So as soon as Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 21 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 Mr. Rubiner returns, I'll read it, I'll poll, and then we'll figure out what to do. MR. FELDMAN: When we do the poll, we're only doing the questions they answered? THE COURT: That's right. Let's bring them in. THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT IN THE PRESENCE OF THE JURY: THE COURT: All right. Back on the record. All of our jurors and alternate are present. I sent you one additional question, and it read as follows: Did you intend for the award of $60,000 in damages from Question 2, Page 8, Line 22, to be in addition to the award of damages of $252,000, Question 9, and $1,200,000, Question 60? Answer: Yes. Signed by the foreperson. I've out loud read all of your responses. Ladies and gentlemen, are these your verdicts? THE JURY: Yes. THE COURT: Mr. Rubiner, Mr. Coontz, or Mr. Feldman, do you wish to have the jury polled? MR. RUBINER: No, your Honor. MR. COONTZ: Yes, your Honor. MR. FELDMAN: No, your Honor. THE COURT: All right. We are now going to poll the jury, and this is where I ask you individually how you voted on each individual question. So I'm going to read the question and then just call out your number, and the question Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www,ccrola.com 22 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 you will be answering is is this how you voted. So if you voted the way I read it, you say yes. If you did not vote the way I read it, you say no. Does anybody have any questions? Thank you. Section 1, breach of contract as to Ryan Ogulnick/Vineyards oral or implied contract. Question 1. Did Sean Dalesandro and Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards enter into a contract? Yes. Juror No. 1, is this how you voted? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: No. THE COURT: Juror 6? JUROR NO. 6: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 23 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 THE COURT: 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. Question 2. Did Sean Dalesandro do all or substantially all of the significant things that the contract required him to do? Or was he excused from having to do those things? Answer: Yes. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 24 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 3. Did all the conditions occur that were required for Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards' performance, or were they excused? Ts this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 25 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 4. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards fail to do something that the contract required them to do? Answer: Yes. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 26 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 failure? THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Thank you. Question S. Was Sean Dalesandro harmed by that Answer: Yes. Juror No. 1, is this how you voted? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ecrola.com a 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 6. As part of Sean Dalesandro's contract, did he perform or agree to perform acts as part of the contract requiring a real estate broker's license when he did not have a valid license? Answer: No. Juror No. 1, is this how you voted? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com O 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 7 is skipped. Question No. 8. Is the contract of the type that is required to be in writing according to the instructions? Answer: No. Juror number -- is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 damages? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 9. What are Sean Dalesandro's $252,000. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. Coalition Court Reporters 1 213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 30 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Section 2, breach of contract as to VDC at the Met oral or implied contract. Question 10. Did Ryan Ogulnick agree on behalf of VDC at the Met to enter into a contract with Sean Dalesandro between the dates of March 22, 2011, and March 28, 2011? Answer: Yes. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 31 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 11. Did Ilus Investors, or Ilus G.P., ratify the contract? Answer: No. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 32 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: I'm skipping now to Section 5. False promise without intent to perform as to Ryan Ogulnick/Vineyards. Question 36. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards make an important promise to Sean Dalesandro? Answer: Yes. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.cerola.com 33 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 37. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards intend to perform this promise when he or it made it? Answer: Yes. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 34 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 38. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards intend that Sean Dalesandro rely on this promise? Answer: Yes. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 39. Did Sean Dalesandro reasonably rely on this promise? Answer: Yes. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 36 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. MR. COONTZ: Your Honor, I didn't hear the response from Juror No. 1 to that question. THE COURT: Juror No. 1 answered yes. MR. COONTZ: Thank you. THE COURT: Question 40. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards perform the promised act? Answer: No. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Excuse me. What number are you on? THE COURT: Question 40. JUROR NO. 1: Yes, I voted no. THE COURT: I'm going to read the question again. Question 40. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards perform the promised act? Answer: No. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 37 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 41. Was Sean Dalesandro's reliance on Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards' promise a substantial factor in causing harm to Sean Dalesandro? Answer: Yes. Juror No. 1, is this how you answered? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ecrola.com 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 42. What are Sean Dalesandro's damages? $60,000. Interest rate, if any, and starting date, zero percent, and not applicable. Juror No. 1, is this how you voted? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com M 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 43. Do you find by clear and convincing evidence that Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards engaged in the conduct with malice, oppression, or fraud? Answer: Yes. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. Coalition Court Reporters 1213,471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 40 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Section 6, false promise without intent to perform. As to VDC at the Met, Question 44. Did Ryan Ogulnick cause VDC at the Met to make an important promise to Sean Dalesandro? Answer: Yes. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.29661 www.cerola.com 41 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 45. Did Ilus Investors, or Ilus G.P., ratify the promise? Answer: No. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 42 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 55. Section 7, intentional misrepresentation as to Ryan Ogulnick, Vineyards. Question 55. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards make a false representation of an important fact to Sean Dalesandro? Answer: Yes. Juror No. 1, is this how you voted? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 43 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 56. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards either know that the representation was false or make it recklessly and without regard for its truth? Answer: Yes. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 44 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. JUROR NO. Yes. THE COURT: Question 57. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards intend that Sean Dalesandro rely on that -- on the representation? Answer: Yes. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 45 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 58. Did Sean Dalesandro reasonably rely on the representation of Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards? Answer: Yes. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 46 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 59. Was Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards' representation a substantial factor in causing harm to Sean Dalesandro? Answer: Yes. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ecrola.com 47 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 60. What are Sean Dalesandro's damages? $1,200,000. Interest rate, if any, and starting date. 7 percent and October 3, 2013. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.cerola.com 48 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10. Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 61. Do you find by clear and convincing evidence that Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards made the representation with malice, oppression, or fraud? Answer: Yes. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. Coalition Court Reporters 1 213.471.29661 www,cerola.com 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes, MR. COONTZ: Your Honor, I wasn't sure what Juror No. 3 said. THE COURT: He said no. Section 8. Negligent misrepresentation as to Ryan Ogulnick/Vineyards. Question 62. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards make a false representation of an important fact to Sean Dalesandro? Answer: Yes. Coalition Court Reporters 1 213.471.29661 www.cerola.com 50 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 63. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards honestly believe that the representation was true when it was made? Answer: No. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Section 9, quantum meruit, common count. We changed it from Section 11 to 13. We're moving on. Sorry. Section 11, intentional misrepresentation and concealment. The Ilus parties claims as to Sean Dalesandro. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 52 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 Question 85. Did Sean Dalesandro make any false representation of an important fact or intentionally fail to disclose one or more important facts to Ilus Investors, or Ilus G.P.? Answer: No. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: No. THE COURT: Let me start this again. Question 85. Did Sean Dalesandro make any false representation of an important fact or intentionally fail to disclose one or more important facts to Ilus Investors, or Ilus G.P.? Answer: No. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: No. A JUROR: I'm sorry, your Honor. I misspoke. THE COURT: Let me read this again. The question is Question 85. Did Sean Dalesandro make any false representation of an important fact or intentionally fail to disclose one or more important facts to Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 53 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 Ilus Investors, or Ilus G.P.? Answer: No. Juror No. 1, is this how you voted? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Section 12, negligent misrepresentation. Question 94. Did Sean Dalesandro or Parallel Real Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 54 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 Estate Advisors make a false representation of an important fact to Ilus Investors, or Ilus G.P.? Answer: Yes. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 95. Did Sean Dalesandro or Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 55 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 Parallel Real Estate Advisors have reasonable grounds for believing the representation was true when he or it made it? Answer: Yes. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Section 13. Breach of fiduciary duty. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 Question 102. Did Sean Dalesandro owe Ilus Investors, or Ilus G.P., a fiduciary duty? Answer: No. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: No. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. Section 14, Question 110. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 57 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 Vineyards owe Ilus Investors, or Ilus G.P., a fiduciary duty? Answer: Yes. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question 111. Did Ryan Ogulnick or Vineyards breach his or its fiduciary duty to Ilus Investors, Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 58 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 or Ilus G.P.? Answer: Yes. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. Question 112. Did Sean Dalesandro know that a breach of fiduciary duty was being committed or was going to Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 59 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 be committed against Ilus Investors, or Ilus G.P.? Answer: No. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Question number -- I'm going to call this supplemental question No. 1. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 60 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 The Court's question to the jury: Did you intend for the award of $252,000 in damages from Question 9, Page 2, Line 19, to be in addition to the damages of $1,200,000 awarded in Question 60, Page 11, Line 26? Answer: Yes. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 61 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: Supplemental Question No. 2 from the Court to the jury: Did you intend for the award of $60,000 in damages from Question 42, Page 8, Line 22, to be in addition to the award of damages of $252,000, Question 9, and $1.2 million, Question 60? Answer: Yes. Is this how you voted, Juror No. 1? JUROR NO. 1: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 2? JUROR NO. 2: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 3? JUROR NO. 3: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 4? JUROR NO. 4: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 5? JUROR NO. 5: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 6? JUROR NO. 6: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 7? JUROR NO. 7: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 8? JUROR NO. 8: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 9? JUROR NO. 9: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 10? JUROR NO. 10: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 11? Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 62 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 JUROR NO. 11: Yes. THE COURT: Juror No. 12? JUROR NO. 12: Yes. THE COURT: The Court finds this to be a true verdict as to all questions and answers stated. All right. We need to talk. Okay? So this is the situation, ladies and gentlemen. First, let me thank you on behalf of everyone for your careful attention to this case and the verdict form and the verdict. We really appreciate your attention and your patience with us. In this case you found as to a couple of the questions that Ryan Ogulnick conducted himself with malice, oppression, or fraud. When that happens, the plaintiff is entitled to what's called punitive damages. Punitive damages are to be assessed in a second phase of the trial. It is a very short second phase. Counsel's entitled to give an opening statement. They can present witnesses. I don't expect it to take very long. In fact, I expect the only witness -- there to be only one witness by the plaintiff? MR. RUBINER: One, maybe two. THE COURT: One, maybe two witnesses. It's now 4:05. We would not be able to finish this today. My question to you, ladies and gentlemen, is are you all able to come to court tomorrow? Please raise your hands if you are not able to come to court tomorrow. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 63 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 Mr. Bik? A JUROR: I'm flying to Florida tomorrow for a week. I have an appointment there. THE COURT: Okay. So you'll be gone for a week? A JUROR: I'll be gone for a week. I'll be back next Wednesday or Thursday. THE COURT: Ms. Bulboba (phonetic)? A JUROR: My mom is a doctor. I promised her I'd help her with something in her office, and it has to be tomorrow. I haven't been able to do it since I've been here. I have to do it. I cannot come in. But I'm available Thursday. THE COURT: You would be available to come in Thursday? A JUROR: Yes. Just for the day. THE COURT: Okay. Would anybody have a problem coming in on Thursday other than Mr. Bik? Please check. And this question goes to you, Ms. Williams. A JUROR: Your Honor, are you estimating a day? THE COURT: I'm estimating no more than one day. A JUROR: Is that one day deliberation and trial? THE COURT: It should be completed in one day. I would expect it to be completed in one day. I will make sure that it's completed in one day. A JUROR: Famous last words. A JUROR: Will there still be bagels and orange juice in the jury room? THE COURT: I promise you they will be there every Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.cerola.com 64 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 day. A JUROR: I would feel terrible if Jerome were not part of our deliberations. THE COURT: Well, you'll have to overcome that emotion. All right. So it seems like everyone but Mr. Bik is available on Thursday. Is that correct, Ms. Williams? THE ALTERNATE: Well, I actually have my review on Thursday for my job, and I probably have to be there. THE COURT: Is there any way to reschedule that? A JUROR: I could ask tomorrow. I could ask. Oh, crap. THE COURT: What time is your review? A JUROR: It's in the morning. But I wouldn't be here until 12:00. A JUROR: What about Friday the 9th? THE COURT: Is Friday better for everyone? A JUROR: May I check my calendar now? THE COURT: Of course. And may I see counsel? (SIDEBAR CONFERENCE HELD, NOT REPORTED.) THE COURT: Back on the record. Is Friday better for everybody? A JUROR: Friday would be fine. THE COURT: All right, then. My intention will be to excuse Mr. Bik today. Because he is flying out tomorrow. Is there any objection? MR. RUBINER: No objection, your Honor. MR. COONTZ: No objection, your Honor. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 65 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 THE COURT: All right. Mr. Bik, thank you so much. You are excused. I don't know if Julia is still upstairs. We're going to make a call. On behalf of everybody, and I've said this before -- and believe me, I've never brought in breakfast for a jury before -- you've really been an extraordinary jury. Really and truly outstanding. And really above and beyond the call of duty. And we greatly appreciate it, and we greatly appreciate all your effort and your time, and you are just truly extraordinary. Mr. Bik, we wish you safe travels. And you are excused from the jury. Ms. Williams, you are substituted in as Juror No. 3. Ladies and gentlemen, I am going to excuse you for the day. There is a new set of instructions that you will receive. So again, please don't do any research on your own or check this out. You know, this concept of punitive damages, please don't do any research or ask anyone about it. Don't develop any opinions about this until you hear all the evidence and any further instructions and arguments of counsel. You are excused for the day. Mr. Bik, you are excused permanently. And the time on Friday, 9:30 on Friday. So you are excused until 9:30 on Friday. You can leave those on your seat. MR. COONTZ: Your Honor, before the jury leaves, we talked about them being available if they wished to speak with US. THE COURT: Not now. The case isn't over yet. Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www,ccrola.com 66 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 All right. M. FELDMAN: What about Mr. Bik? THE COURT: You are not entitled to talk to Mr. Bik until the case is over. MR. SHORE: Your Honor, can we provide Mr. Bik with our contact information so that after the case is over, he can reach us if he is so inclined. THE COURT: If you wish, but please, there is a -- I don't know if it's Business and Professions Code or a State Bar rule that there is to be no contact with a juror who is excused until the conclusion of the trial. So I would not want there to be any mistrial. So thank you very much, ladies and gentlemen. You are excused for the evening. And we'll see you Friday morning at 9:30. Thank you very much. If you left things back there, please feel free to go back and get them. THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT OUTSIDE THE PRESENCE OF THE JURY: THE COURT: All right. We're still on the record. Mr. Coontz and Mr. Rubiner, how are we going to deal with discovery? MR. RUBINER: I mean, if you can get it to me tomorrow or Thursday. MR. COONTZ: I'll get it to you as soon as I can. THE COURT: Okay. All right. Thank you very much. Mr. Mosely, Mr. Shore, Mr. Feldman, last but not Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 67 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 least, thank you very much. It has been a pleasure having you here, and you are excused from all further proceedings if you wish. Obviously, you are entitled to be a spectator, but I don't believe that you have a dog in this fight. MR. FELDMAN: Yes, your Honor. MR. RUBINER: Your Honor, there are bench issues we'll have to deal with later on. THE COURT: Which bench issues? MR. RUBINER: There is my client's cross -claims for indemnity against VDC at the Met and against VDI for the Ilus complaint against him. And that was deferred -- THE COURT: Hold on. We've got jurors coming through. (Pause.) THE COURT: Okay. So there's further issues. Well, we'll set a date after Friday, and you'll give counsel notice. MR. RUBINER: That's fine, your Honor. THE COURT: It will obviously be sometime in January. MR. FELDMAN: We'll need time for briefing and things like that. THE COURT: Off the record. (DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD.) (PROCEEDINGS CONCLUDED AT 4:15 P.M.) Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 SUPERIOR COURT OF THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA. FOR THE COUNTY OF LOS ANGELES SANTA MONICA DEPARTMENT 0 HON. LISA HART COLE, JUDGE RYAN OGULNICK, ET AL., PLAINTIFFS, VS. SEAN DALESANDRO, ET AL., DEFENDANTS ) CASE NO. BC469863, ETC. ) ) I, MARK SCHWEITZER, OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER PRO TEM OF THE SUPERIOR COURT OF THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA, COUNTY OF LOS ANGELES, DO HEREBY CERTIFY THAT THE FOREGOING TRANSCRIPT, DATED DECEMBER 6, 2016, COMPRISES A FULL, TRUE, AND CORRECT TRANSCRIPT OF THE PROCEEDINGS HELD IN THE ABOVE -ENTITLED CAUSE. DATED THIS 6TH DAY OF DECEMBER, 2016. MARK SCHWEITZER, RPR, CRR, CSR NO. 10 Coalition Court Reporters 1213.471.2966 1 www.ccrola.com Orozco, Norma From:Dan Burley <dan.burley@youngpeopleinrecovery.org> Sent:Wednesday, September 02, 2020 10:16 AM To:eComment Cc:Patrice Denbeau Subject:Comments to Santa Ana City Council by Dan Burley … Project Coordinator for YPR Orange County Chapter The purpose of the following comments is to make the Santa Ana Council aware of free recovery communities dedicated to helping adults of all ages, but particularly young adults succeed in their long-term drug and alcohol recovery. Drug and alcohol addiction have become epidemic in America and particularly in Orange County with the explosion of the Opioid crisis. There are multiple paths to drug and alcohol recovery available in Orange County and many resources are free. 12 Step Programs, Faith Based, Smart Recovery and Medical Assist are some of the pathways. Young People in Recovery or YPR is a nonprofit organization in Orange County dedicated to administering free resources for long term recovery to anyone in Orange County. Recovery support communities such as YPR and The Phoenix Organization based in Newport are dedicated to helping young and older adults thrive and live a drug and alcohol-free lifestyle. \[D Dan Burley Program Coordinator, Orange County YPR - Young People in Recovery (310) 256-9745 1